No it isn't absurd at all, if you think Ron fits in better with Yao, then perhaps they would have advanced. But that is a waste of time, and an argument that you can not prove. So, yes, we are talking about THIS year.....so? And I hope they trade Tracy just to see what you do with your moniker. DD
Our team defense has been above average but on most nights Tracy wasn't necessarily playing "good defense". We weren't losing because of his defense but it's not like he was being a difference maker on that end of the floor. If Ron is shooting like garbage he can still contribute with his defense and by getting to the line. Tracy could still help with his passing when he shot poorly...but I can't recall the last time he really stood out defensively. Don't be so biased as to where you can't admit that replacing a guy who at best plays "good defense" with a guy who gives his all defensively...and pairing him with another guy who does that in Battier makes a huge difference. Having a lockdown defender at both wing spots makes a huge difference. And the sad part is T-Mac has all the athletic ability to be a great defender like he was early in his career....he just doesn't put forth the effort.
04-05? how would they advance? tmac played great on both ends that year. 06-07? the talent level wasn't as much so ron would be expected to do so much more. our defense was at a high level that year. so what would ron change? 07-08? i don't think we would have made the playoffs with ron when yao went out. so yes, it's absurd. you're replacing an all-nba player the previous years... that's a fact. and it's easy to talk about this year when the guy SUCKED. and 80% of the league is better than tracy. what's the point really when it's a fact. rafer had a better year than tracy did. scola, landry....and name almost any other player. what point does that prove?
while i do admit his defensive intensity wavers in the past, in the playoffs, he does bring it nightly (which is frustrating for people who follow tracy). so i mean, in the games that do count, at least he brings it on both ends. he needs to re-find that motivation into the reg. season wherever he goes next yr. yes, having artest + battier helps. i never said it didn't. but that is not the argument of this post.
Tracy was great in the past two years. But he still was injury prone, still wilted like a flower at times (he stepped up big at times too...but there were plenty of drama queen moments), still had us screaming for him to take it to the rack more and never really was a difference maker defensively. So if you consider the ability to play great defense and play almost every game, get to the line...oh, and actually seem like you want to go just as hard at the other guy like he is going at you (i.e. how T-Mac seems in awe of Kobe when they play while Ron wants to kill him) important factors in how you rate players...then I can see why someone would choose Ron over T-Mac. Not to mention every Rockets-Kings game I watched last season the "better player" (T-Mac) seemed pretty scared of Ron every time they squared off....especially come 4th qtr time. I recall one of those guys rising to the occasion and going at the other one...while the other guy was getting locked down. Maybe I just like guys who go hard on both ends. They are rare these days. I don't have an issue if someone picks a guy who is pretty good on both ends over a guy who is great at one and just average on the other.
the thing is, is our defense right now better than it was in past years when those teams played well? people can say about individual defense, but our team emphasizes team defense. though tmac has been a subpar individual defender in previous years b/c of effort, he's a pretty good team defender. and our team defense was top notch every year tracy was here (top 3 in the L). like i said, it's absurd to think you can replace an all-nba player with...
He brought it defensively in the Dallas series. I can't really say he was a difference maker defensively against Utah. I can say he had moments against the Jazz where he wasn't very tough and lived outside of the paint. If you are 6-9 you have no excuse to allow a 6-2 Fisher to keep you on the perimiter. I'm sorry, but you don't. You are supposed to abuse him in the post all game long. IIRC, one of the main criticisims of Tracy against Utah was how he wasn't getting to the rack enough. I am not saying Artest is def better than Tracy. They bring it in different ways. Admit it or not, but some of the things folks would say are T-Mac's weaknesses (heart, passion, defense, efficiency, getting to the line, etc) are Ron's strengths.
Pretty much. Where was all these threads last year when people was saying the rox were better minus Yao? Where were the people like DD saying shane was better than artest or he didn't fit? I know its "what have you done for me lately?", but really? Of course he's better because tracy was injured, not hurt. Unlike DD that thinks they don't fit or can't fit, I think they can if both are healthy. The rox will never put too much talent on the floor because they don't have that kind of talent.
Has he been a good team defender, or have we been a good defensive team in spite of his subpar defensive efforts? That's something that's really hard to measure. But I bet in the games T-Mac missed we didn't have a huge drop off defensively (just a guess....I may be wrong).
again, A LOT of players are better than tracy this year. you can name most decent players and i'll agree with ya. it's very easy to pick at a guy who's having the worst season of his career, had season-ending surgery with drama, and then take a guy who's been here and has played well for 20-25 games and then basically disses tmac's whole career as a rocket. that's absurd. and efficiency and getting to the line are ron's strength? now that's a new one. heart, passion, defense, those are why we picked him up and he's doing it right now. hopefully he'll keep it up. i really love the way ron's playing right now. he's a really good player.
well, our team defense is a system. we don't miss a beat with anyone missing. shane missed 15 games to start this year and we didn't miss a beat. yao missed most of the last 2 years and we didn't miss a beat. it's only normal that we don't miss a beat with tracy. our defense is based on a team system. it's not straight up man defense. we pack the paint, force jumpers, rebound... JVG has instilled that well.
DD, your problem is you clearly know T-Mac doesn't fit as your girlfriend, but you still unable to give up her. It's TMac's operation saved your life Eventually you understand Ron is your ideal partner, just love him with all your heart
I think they can fit...and if they can't it's only because you can say both are ball stoppers and it hurts to have two in the lineup at the same time. But I think it makes a world of difference to have two lockdown defenders manning your wings...and we have been winning with defense lately. Last night's game was a prime example. So was the game against Utah even though we lost. We got down big and didn't fold and still could have took that game.
Basically when a player is HURT anyone can have a better year than him because he can not give it his all. It's not that he sucked its just that he was hurt and couldn't give it his all. When your hurt you have a different mind set to when your healthy. No need to prove yourself when you know the truth. The media and some guys on here are going to bash him because they don't like him and it's a what have you done for me lately. I guess that is what a fans all about. Personally I laugh at people saying Ron Artest is better than McGrady. Sure compare a guy who was hurt all year. Who shouldn't have been playing because doctors messed it up. Ron isn't durable himself. He also has history of missing tons of games. I just laugh at the whole situation because if I'm not mistaken Yao was hurt year after year. I'm just glad he is able to be healthy this year. I just dont understand how guys want to get rid of a proven player
Artest is a better fit for this team, no question. Sometimes regardless of talent the player just does not fit and that was T-Mac and Adelman in a nutshell. I think there's a better than even chance that McGrady will not be a Rocket next season. Whether or not Houston decides to keep Artest I have no idea. A deep run in the playoffs would certainly help his case.
LOL it's really funny how people forget or turn on you so quickly. Look....I couldn't agree more that Tracy's injuries and antics are old....I’ll be the first to say that, but when people selectively forget how good this dude is because of those antics and injuries....it's puzzling. Despite all the nonsense;the good out weighs the bad and WHEN healthy...he's a top talent in this league. A healthy T-Mac is the perfect fit for Yao's game He showed up EVERY year in the playoffs when it mattered most...too bad the Rockets couldn’t advance, but I will always remember what he did in those series. Even though I feel it's time for him to move on, I WILL NOT kick him while he's down and injured. So many of you have selective and short term memories I guess it really is “what have you’ve done for me lately” I love what the Rockets are doing without him, but you CAN’T tell me that they wouldn’t be unstoppable with a HEALTHY T-mac…..oooh what could have been *sigh* lol
Icehouse- You brought up fisher and keeping tracy from the rack. Do you know why coaches play smaller guys on bigger wing players? Its to cut off penetration to the rack. That's why kobe scored less against the rox when he was defended by wesley vs battier. That's why teams tried to play Jordan with smaller guys, joe dumars, because they had the quickness to stay in front. They wanted to make the guy a contested jump shooter. Coach shouldve made the adjustment and put tracy in the high-mid post like adelman did after game 2 last year. Give the player a shorter distance to drive or already have him in range where he can turn and fire.
You gotta remember its a 5 on 5 not 1 on 1. I'm sure the other team realizes that and once he starts to post Fisher up a help defender is coming. Also as for him driving to the basket more, I couldn't agree with you more but we gotta remember one thing. We have a 7'6 center clogging up the middle. There isn't really that much room for him to operate when he drives.
actually the team did miss a beat early on when shane was hurt. also those trips to philly and toronto i dont think shane played in those games as well. if you remember our transition D was atrocious at the beginning of the season a lot of that was because shane was not there. i think shane does an amazing job of making up for other people's mistakes he is probably the greatest team defender i have seen in a long time. a healthy mcgrady vs a healthy artest is no question its mcgrady of course but not this season. if we were able to transplant artest's mindset into tracy we'd have a real nba monster on our hands. oh well
i think guys don't get that. when you have shorter guys on taller wing players, you force the fadeaways more than penetration b/c those guys are quicker. tmac did what he had to do but he just couldn't make his jumpers consistently that series (did shoot well at home though). and they rotated a bunch of defenders at tmac.
