1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

[Chron] Rockets sharing, thriving

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by daRox, Feb 11, 2008.

  1. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    129,236
    Likes Received:
    39,744
    This is exactly why JVG had to go.....and that involving everyone is a much better way of doing things.

    I am extremely happy with the way things are going.

    And Battier looks good coming around off of those screens this year......

    DD
     
  2. durvasa

    durvasa Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2006
    Messages:
    38,893
    Likes Received:
    16,449
    Shane's field goal attempts per minute are down, as are his free throw attempts per minute. He is taking slightly more 3-point shots per minute, though. Oh, and assists are down as well.

    So ... is he more involved on offense? Could have fooled me.
     
  3. Yetti

    Yetti Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2002
    Messages:
    9,589
    Likes Received:
    529
    Translation: The Rockets are now playing the team game, thats the way Basketball is supposed to be played. :p
     
  4. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    129,236
    Likes Received:
    39,744
    But he gets more touches, this year he is more of a passer, and that may not lead to more assists, as his pass may be the pass that sets up the next pass for an assist.

    Durvasa, for someone as stats oriented as you, sometimes it seems you are missing the forest looking at the trees.

    TEAM assists are way up lately, but individual assists may be down.....what does that tell you?

    DD
     
  5. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2007
    Messages:
    45,153
    Likes Received:
    21,575

    Is he talking about this involvement as a season-long thing or a more recent thing? The Rockets have looked to be playing better cohesive offense of late. Maybe guys are getting more involved lately.


    Also, there could have been more touches for him when he is just a conduit-- didn't neccesarily lead to a shot or assist, just passing the ball on.
     
  6. durvasa

    durvasa Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2006
    Messages:
    38,893
    Likes Received:
    16,449
    So, in this article, the Rockets seem to be focusing on their assists as an indicator of improved offense. I remember doing the same thing about a month ago, and people didn't like that too much.

    Anyways, with McGrady on the floor 61% of the Rockets field goals are assisted. When he's not on the floor, it's 56%. That's all I'll say about that! ;)
     
  7. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    129,236
    Likes Received:
    39,744
    When was the last time you can recall an offensive possesion where all 5 guys touched it and it led to a layup?

    Now only one assist was given, but EVERYONE felt involved in that plays success.

    That is a MAJOR difference this year.

    DD
     
  8. durvasa

    durvasa Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2006
    Messages:
    38,893
    Likes Received:
    16,449
    I guess it means that assists are more evenly distributed? This is something I've looked at in the past, and it might be interesting to do it again -- comparing how evenly the the assists are distributed on a game by game basis, compared to last year. When I get a little extra time, I might do this.
     
  9. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    129,236
    Likes Received:
    39,744
    Wouldn't that be indicated in APG? If they are getting more APG than last year it would seem to indicate a greater empasis on team play.

    DD
     
  10. Dave_78

    Dave_78 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2006
    Messages:
    10,809
    Likes Received:
    373
    No love for Mo Taylor? :D
     
  11. durvasa

    durvasa Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2006
    Messages:
    38,893
    Likes Received:
    16,449
    I agree, there is a little more of that this year. I don't think the difference is as dramatic as you're putting it, but hopefully we keep improving in that regard. Ultimately, what matters is what all that extra player involvement leads to. For instance, more people were involved when T-Mac was injured out of necessity, but that didn't necessarily lead to higher quality shots. The real test for our offense is when we start playing the really good defensive teams again in March.
     
  12. blackbird

    blackbird Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2007
    Messages:
    462
    Likes Received:
    0
    LOL, I second this. Durvasa, I do like your stats. But, sometimes you ONLY pick stats in your favor.

    .
     
  13. rocketsregle

    rocketsregle Member

    Joined:
    May 28, 2005
    Messages:
    2,027
    Likes Received:
    10
    I remember that lay-up. When I saw it, it reminded me of how we moved the ball in 93-94. My row at the game was wowed: "Did you see that? The ball didn't even touch the floor!" It was beautiful.

    I was critical of Adelman to start the season and there are some things he can still do better, however I really like how his player's coach approach is molding the players into leaders on the court. The journey is far from over. We still have our own version of March Madness to face. But it sure is cool to watch the players be much more involved without the coach during time-outs. They no longer wait to be told. This will pay dividends in the playoffs.
     
  14. durvasa

    durvasa Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2006
    Messages:
    38,893
    Likes Received:
    16,449
    Not necessarily. APG is determined by the following factors: percentage of FGM assisted, FG%, and FGA/g. And FGA/g is determined by factors that aren't necessarily tied in to "team play", like possessions per game and offensive rebounding. I'd argue that Ast% (percentage of made field goals assisted) is a better indicator. Here's a comparison of team rankings for each stat. You decide which better represents the teams that play well together as a team:

    Code:
    [SIZE=2]    [B]Team                     Ast/g          Team                     AST/FGM[/B]
    1   Phoenix Suns             27.3       1   New Jersey Nets          70.0%
    2   Utah Jazz                26.2       2   Utah Jazz                66.0%
    3   Denver Nuggets           23.7       3   Phoenix Suns             65.9%
    4   New Jersey Nets          23.7       4   Detroit Pistons          62.4%
    5   Los Angeles Lakers       23.6       5   Toronto Raptors          61.8%
    6   Indiana Pacers           23.3       6   Indiana Pacers           61.5%
    7   Toronto Raptors          23.2       7   Los Angeles Clippers     61.4%
    8   Golden State Warriors    23.0       8   Denver Nuggets           61.4%
    9   Detroit Pistons          22.8       9   Atlanta Hawks            61.1%
    10  Boston Celtics           21.7       10  Boston Celtics           61.0%
    11  Houston Rockets          21.7       11  Charlotte Bobcats        60.7%
    12  New Orleans Hornets      21.6       12  Los Angeles Lakers       60.6%
    13  Charlotte Bobcats        21.6       13  Portland Trail Blazers   60.1%
    14  Portland Trail Blazers   21.5       14  San Antonio Spurs        60.0%
    15  San Antonio Spurs        21.5       15  Chicago Bulls            59.5%
    16  Seattle Supersonics      21.5       16  Houston Rockets          59.5%
    17  Atlanta Hawks            21.3       17  Milwaukee Bucks          58.5%
    18  Los Angeles Clippers     21.3       18  Seattle Supersonics      57.3%
    19  Chicago Bulls            21.2       19  Golden State Warriors    57.1%
    20  Milwaukee Bucks          21.1       20  Miami Heat               56.6%
    21  Orlando Magic            20.2       21  New Orleans Hornets      56.2%
    22  Dallas Mavericks         20.2       22  Dallas Mavericks         55.3%
    23  Memphis Grizzlies        20.1       23  Orlando Magic            55.2%
    24  Philadelphia 76ers       20.0       24  Philadelphia 76ers       55.2%
    25  Miami Heat               19.8       25  Memphis Grizzlies        54.2%
    26  Cleveland Cavaliers      19.3       26  Cleveland Cavaliers      53.6%
    27  Washington Wizards       19.2       27  Washington Wizards       53.0%
    28  Minnesota Timberwolves   18.9       28  New York Knickerbockers  52.3%
    29  Sacramento Kings         18.7       29  Minnesota Timberwolves   51.9%
    30  New York Knickerbockers  18.3       30  Sacramento Kings         51.8%[/SIZE]
    
    In the article, they talk about more people getting assists, instead of the assists coming from just one person. That could be captured, I think, by looking at average variance in assists/min for every player playing at least, say, 15 minutes in a game.
     
    #34 durvasa, Feb 11, 2008
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2008
  15. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    129,236
    Likes Received:
    39,744

    No doubt, everyone gets to play the same teams, I am just happy that Tmac came back and Luis moved into the starting lineup during this stretch of games against some weaker opponents.

    Though beating Portland away and Golden State and San Antonio at home is a good indicator that things are looking up.

    DD
     
  16. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2007
    Messages:
    45,153
    Likes Received:
    21,575
    The percentages seem low... I mean... given that the Suns has 27.3 APG, and that's 32.4% of their FGM... my math says that means they average 83 FGM per game?
     
  17. durvasa

    durvasa Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2006
    Messages:
    38,893
    Likes Received:
    16,449
    You're right, I screwed up ... updating. :D

    Hmmm ... ok, I'll admit that after fixing those numbers, I'm less convinced on Ast%. When New Jersey leads the league at a startling 70%, despite being a bottom 10 offensive team in terms of efficiency ... you have to wonder about the usefulness of that number. On the other hand, I think Ast/g is a deceptively good indicator. As I said earlier, that is essentially a product of the following factors: Ast%, FG%, and FGA. Well, if you look at how each of those correlate to Offensive Efficiency, you get 0.18, 0.795, and 0.05 for r, respectively. And the correlation coefficient for Ast/g is 0.47. In other words, the dominating factor there is FG% ... not the proportion of field goals assisted or field goal attempts.

    What does all this mean? Capturing "team play" statistically is tough, and Ast% is probably not a great indicator for it (unless we want to accept that New Jersey plays good team basketball on offense, despite being one of the worst offensive teams).
     
    #37 durvasa, Feb 11, 2008
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2008
  18. McGradySNKT

    McGradySNKT Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2005
    Messages:
    1,693
    Likes Received:
    2

    I think you missed the part of the article where it said the guy passing might not be the one getting the assist, but he trusts that passing it off will result in a basket in the end.

    That could explain why Shane's assists aren't up but it doesn't matter as long as the team is scoring, and I also think the guys on this board is more excited about this team playing like this than they ever were with Assistant coach's philosophy.
     
  19. durvasa

    durvasa Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2006
    Messages:
    38,893
    Likes Received:
    16,449
    But they also stressed the importance of all the assists they are getting. Couple the two together, and what they are really excited about is the distribution of assists. They are getting a lot of assists, and it's not just coming from one or two people. Lots of people are involved passing the ball and creating shots. I think that's what Adelman is after.

    That leads to a question. Is it possible for teams to play Adelman's style well, and still not be a very good offensive team?
     
  20. Jelle

    Jelle Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2007
    Messages:
    272
    Likes Received:
    0
    Great article and hopefully they will keep it up. If they do, there's a great chance we might pull off something huge this year as a team.
     

Share This Page