Yes it does...when he decides to actually penetrate....and having TWO guys that can do that...ala Parker and Ginobli makes the team that much better. Thanks for playing. DD
Disagree. A contract is only bad if it's hard to move or has negative trade value. As long as Hinrich is a starting quality white PG he'll be overvalued by franchises looking at ticket sales. I believe he'll be easily moved by Morey down the road if he chooses to.
LOL - yes, we agree there. IMO, Artest is a good player, but when you have Tmac and Battier already on the team, he is redundant, and it would be nice to upgrade at another position where we are weakest.... Hinrich's contract gets smaller it decreases.....and he would be the starter here for the next 3 -5 years..... Ugh....people who don't have an understanding of chemistry and how teams and players fit together are maddening. DD
I just don't think that bringing in an over paid, offense minded PG would help our team....We're not an offensive minded team. Our focus should be on strengthening our bench and thats what Artest does in so many ways.
I think we all forgot he was coming off of surgery.... i think he is going to continue this play through the year.
Of course a better PG would help but, we all know they are not gonna trade Ron for ANYBODY, because they didn't bring him to do it. They wanted him to be a part of something big, they wanted to add a scorer and upgrade defensivly at the same time.
Its a move that should help in so many different ways. A PG would improve our offense, but honestly, our offense isnt that bad when Tracy and Yao are healthy. Our bench has always been the problem, and Ron''s versatility makes our bench stronger.
Our problem has been offense in the playoffs. You pretty much know what you're gonna get from Tracy, Yao. But it is all on guys like Luther, Von, Ron, Rafer, Scola, Landry...Usually in the playoffs they SUCK badly. That is the problem. I damn don't care if Van scores 18 or 30 in regular season. If he comes in during the playoffs and adds those 10 points - it matters. I really don't care how our bench, or role players are playing during the season (as long as we win of course). It all matters in the playoffs and those guys FAILED for 2 straight years
All this debate about Rafer when he's irrelevant. This season will NOT come down to the Alston/Brooks rotation. They should be good enough. Our season rests on the shoulders of the Tmac/Yao/Artest trio. They've got Scola, Landry, Battier, Brooks, Rafer, and Chuck as a supporting cast. Barry and Wafer might provide something too. That's enough! Do you see Celtics fans complaining about needing a near all-star at center? No, because with three HOF's in the starting lineup Perkins and Davis are enough. Rafer did just fine last year and is starting to round into form now. If our big three can't get it done with his erratic play they're just not as good as we thought. Look to improve the roster, sure. But we have the talent to win a championship now. No excuses. Don't put this season on Alston. The season should not come down to the fifth man.
This is true...Two years ago, look at who we had in the playoffs....Look at the team now. We have made a major effort to correct this problem. Artest to me will make a big impact in the playoffs, while a player like kirk hinrich would just do what luther head, rafer alston, etc have done in the past. Miss shots, turn the ball over, and get burned on defense. Ron will make shots, create turnovers, and play inspired defense.
You got to look at the totality of the circumstances involved in bringing Artest here before you decide. First, I think the Rox were looking for a so called big three. That means they wanted a legit superstar type player to bring in. I dont think Hinrich, Williams or any other available PG fits that bill. Do you think anyone would say Houston had a big 3 if it was Tmac, Yao and Hinrich. Not saying that matters, I just think Morey wanted three big time stars. Second, the Rox had to have concerns about Tmac and Battier since both came off surgery. What bringing in Artest did, was cover for some of Tmac's scoring and Battier's defense should either one of them miss extended time, which both have done. Bringing in a second tier PG wouldnt have helped this team nearly as much as far as injuries go. Third, the Rox had much more confidence in the emergence of Aaron Brooks at PG then anyone emerging as a backup SG or SF (Head, Harris). Although inconsistent, I think Brooks has done well enough to at least calm the fears about Rafer having to play 40 min a game. Fourth, you have to consider what it took to get Artest. We gave up Bobby Jackson, Donte Green, and next years number one. I doubt that same offer nets up Hinrich or any significant upgrade over Rafer. I dont think that combo gets us anything near Artest as far as talent goes because obviously Artest was not going to be a King this year. Fifth, you have to consider long term. Neither Hinrich or Williams was coming off a big year. If anything both had much worse seasons last year then the year before. Bringing them in meant a long term commitment whereas we could dump Artest this year if we wanted. Most importantly, Williams and Hinrich are both signed past 2010 when the Rox can basically go any direction they want. Lastly, you can say Hinrich's contract goes down each year, but its not like it drops significantly. After the 10 million this year he still hangs around 9.5-8.5 million the next three years. Its not like it drops 50% or anything. So in conclusion, Artest was the best talent available and at least can play multiple positions. Although he has struggled offensively, over the course of the season he will undoubtedly pay dividends on both sides of the floor which is quite valuable.
Read the thread more carefully...Rafer + Head + Chuck Hayes = about $9 million worth of salary you can work with...not to mention you can add another filler here and there to a potential deal. I guess we disagree in our assessment of Hinrich. The only reason I bring up Kirk is because he's a realistic option and is available. Williams was, but not anymore. TJ Ford is one hard fall away from his career ending so I would pass on him. I wouldn't be opposed to Bibby since he knows the system, but he's an expiring $15 million contract and I don't know if Atlanta is willing to give him up...might be worth a shot though. Ramon Session from everything I've read isn't available either. All this leaves Hinrich as the only viable option to pursue as an upgrade over Alston. Mr. Buttocks, I think you're downplaying the importance of the PG position in today's NBA. Everything goes through that position and it is vital to have, at the very least, consistent play from your PG. It's not too much to ask for your PG to be able to hit WIDE open shots on a more consistent basis than Rafer, it's not too much to ask your PG to be able to occasionally create for himself and others, it's not too much to ask your PG to be able to drive and finish at the rim or dish it off to somebody else every once in a while. If your PG can't do any of these things, what good is he to a potential contender? Over the years, since the no hand check rule was implemented, the importance of the PG position has gone up a great deal. That Boston team you bring up has an exceptonal PG in Rajon Rondo. He might not be a good shooter, but he does everything else well. He doesn't take bad shots either like Rafer. You can live with a garbage man who does little things well at the C or PF spots, but Celtics would not be where they are without a good PG. There's a reason Rafer is WIDE open all the time. Other teams recognize that he's not a good shooter, but he just keeps on shooting it and throwing up bricks. He can't drive it to the basket either, because he's a poor finisher. His floater might as well be considered a turnover. Imagine bringing in a PG who can hit WIDE open jumpers. Other teams won't be able to double team Yao as much and if they do, they'll pay due to our improved perimeter shooting. They'll have to pick their poison. If we're in win now mode then there needs to be a change at that position.
can i bring up the return of SF3 now? I have to say, it amaze me how many people here support rafer. And their excuse for rafer is that he is the best PG in the roster, thus making him the perfect fit. It does not make any sense to me. You always try to trade for a better player no matter who that player you use as trade bait is. Be it yao/tmac or scrubs- head. Seeing that rafer (top PG for some of you), head (a career 39% 3p shooter) and hayes (premier post defender) all have some trade values, and their contract comes to 9.5m and ends by 2010. I cant see why we cant trade for an up grade. Every team needs a shooter and post defenders, and rafer is well... you have to take the chance on him. Heck i even take the chance on Nelson/Felton. Best case senario, SF3 recovers, AB takes starter minutes with SF3 playing backup, and rafer, head and hayes traded for Kaman.
Alvin Choo, there's a difference between supporting him and not wanting him to be traded. I will support him because I think he fulfills what is asked of him well, or to the best of his abilities, but that doesn't mean I would keep him if an upgrade (a significant one) is available. You don't trade Alston, Head, and Hayes for a gamble like Nelson or Felton. If they don't work out, you're stuck with someone who doesn't fulfill what you ask him. And to top it off, you've lost another guard as well as a great post defender. Hinrich is better than Nelson/Felton. If you're going to gamble, i'd bet on Hinrich over those 2. Also, the return of SF3 would be awesome, but it is improbable. I want it to happen because I really like him, but it's just not working out. Alston at least fulfills the role asked of him and that seems to be underrated around here. I don't think there are many people who support him to the point where they wouldn't trade him for an upgrade. Don't get it twisted.
Nobody says Alston is the perfect fit or the perfect player for this team. You said it yourself, we believe he is the best PG on the roster. I dont think anyone here wouldnt trade him for an elite PG but it just is not that easy. You clearly dont understand the importance of salaries and long term planning. Why would we want Kaman who makes 9.5 million this year, then 10.4, then 11.3, then 12.2 million the next three years. That is almost 44 million bucks over four years for a back up center. He is not gonna be able to play PF for us and Im assuming you dont think he will take starter mins from Yao. At most he plays 16 min a game with Yao playing 32 and I dont think we want to pay 44 million bucks to a 16 min a game player. Lastly, I dont see how you can bash Alston yet hope for the return of SF3 like that will make a difference. Francis cant shoot the three, over dribbles the ball and plays horrible defense. That was when he was rather healthy. Yet somehow he is supposed to come back from basically four or five years of insignificance to out play Rafer who is not a superstar by any means but is a steady player.
I would be more than happy with SF3 coming back and relegating Alston to the bench. The combo of SF3 and AB is our best one-two punch as it currently stands. As long as Alston doesn't play, I'm satisfied...He's too much of a liability.
