Can we trade Van Gundy instead. Yao has all the skills to be a bad ass Brad Miller. Instead we are trying to make him into Shaq. Yao is no Shaq. Shaq is an athletic freak of nature. Shaq averaged 25+ points against Dream(in his prime) in his second year in the league. No one that big ever moved that fast or gracefully. We should make yao take more jumpshots because it would wear on him less. Run some pick and pops for him like last year. It will open the middle for Tmac.
rockbox EXACTLY !! I said this in another thread, but I truly believe that JVG tries to get players to play HIS way instead of adapting and playing to the players strengths. I thought Rudy had lost the players and it was time to go, but now, I freely admit that I was wrong, Rudy would be the PERFECT coach for this type of team. DD
Many of you Yao bashers are just too lazy to read the whole article. I do agree with much of what said in the article. It's Yao's failure as much as the incompetency of the coach and the organization to fully maximize his strengths as well as cover his weaknesses. Yao will never be quick nor able to jump like Hakeem or Sampson. Yao will never be able to bang inside like Shaq. He'll never have Shaq's strength and mobility. As mobile as Shaq is, I don't see him coming out of the paint to defend other big men. JVG and Ewing are simpily the wrong coaches for Yao. Last year we had Cato to help out inside the paint. This year we have sissies, like Howard and Mo, who can't do squat defensively. It's obvious except for you basketball noobs out there that Yao is really frustrated. It's clear Yao is not having much fun out there, he looks disinterested. Not only he has an elbow injury, he also has a coach who kept ranting all the time. He got no respect from the refs, got no help from inside the paint, a point guard running on a sore knee and teammates who still can't hit the 3's consistently. Along with the influx of foreign players, the role of the big men have changed. It emphasizes both versatility and shooting ability. All these 7-foot pseudo forwards, like Dirk and Gasol, would be as much liable as Yao if forced to play EXCLUDSIVELY inside the paint. As near-sighted as the Roc organization as many of you in this BBS, JVG's use of Yao is simpily pathetic. It tires him out with all those ineffective screens, all those posting and reposting even when he has good position the very first time. IMAO, Yao would be much more effective if setting screens near the elbow than the 3-point line. He could either shoot from there, or roll to the basket for a pass or rebound. More often than not, Yao is either stranded out near the 3-point line after a screen, or station and I do mean STATION and got boxed out on the other side of the basket while his teammates taking a 20 foot jumpers. There's simpily enough blames to go around for everyone, the players and the organization alike.
So is it Van Gundy's fault that Yao cant grab a rebound or hold onto the ball instead of getting it stripped. While some blame should be placed on Van Gundy for his limited offensive schemes, Yao should also shoulder the blame for his soft play.
Yao is way to slow to be a great center, above average at best and he will always have to be off the floor at times because he can be exploited by match-ups. Name me another great center ever who was or is as slow as Yao.
I think there have been great slow centers before, they just haven’t been in this era. The role of center has changed so much. The NBA today relies much more on athleticism. There are so many quick athletic 4s playing the center position (ie. Camby, Amare). There are so many centers that are perimeter oriented (ie. Okur, Miller). There’s no way Yao can compete with these type of centers. Call me crazy, but I think Yao would fair better against the tradition old school hall-of-fame centers of the past (Ewing, Robinson, Mourning), then he’s fairing against the new breed of NBA centers today. My fear is Yao's style of play is outdated. He would fit in better if this were the 1980s or 90s, but the NBA today just doesn't fit him.
So if Yao is all about WINNING, doesn't that contradict his attitude if he's not motivated? I mean if someone cares about WINNING, shouldn't that be motivation enough to play your heart out every night?
I agree. The truth of the matter seems to be that Yao is not as bad as some think and will never be as dominating as some hope. 19 points, 9 rebounds, very inconsistent play - sounds about right for his career. Realizing that this is all-star caliber but not superstar caliber makes it less frustrating. That said, you don't trade Yao, but you certainly entertain offers for him. If Dallas thinks Yao is the answer and will give you Dirk or Minnesota and Garnett or Cleveland and Lebron or Phoenix and Amare + Marion, well, why not at least ENTERTAIN those offers. The other note from last night is the DNP-CD for Juwan. I still contend that answer number 1 should be giving Juwan more time and not less - but I'm not the coach.
It is not so much how he competes against them it is how they compete against him Yao needs to be agressive and the refs need to start calling sh*t JVG should get ejected a few times yelling at the officials say what u want about phil. . . but Shaq got his calls Rocket RIver
Bingo! It's no mere coincidence that Yao's play started to suffer once Ewing came over to "coach" him. I remarked last year that it looked like they (Ewing & JVG) were trying to turn Yao into a EwingII clone. The results speak for themselves. Cato wasn't great but he was perfect for playing the 4 when teamed up with Yao because he furnished a physical presence in the paint. They replace Cato with two soft, short PFs (Howard/Taylor) and now the Rockets are getting murdered on the the boards on a nightly basis and they actually have the nerve to act surprised. This team was put together cheaply and poorly by a guy (Dawson) who has a terrible record of evaluating talent. Given how his past personnel moves have not worked, no one should be really surprised with what's going on now.
So you're saying Shaq got calls because Phil Jackson was his coach So i guess Hakeem got calls because Rudy T. was his coach Why didn't Yao get those calls when Rudy T. was his coach
phil b*tches and moans he passes message through the media etc He is constantly on the official's *ss It worked WHO FIGHTS FOR YAO? If yao gets slapped upside the head. . .who will come to his defense? Who complains to the officials for Yao . . [cause Yao won't do it himself . . not enough] Rocket River
Actually, Hakeem didn't get a lot of calls even at his prime. At least not compared to other superstars. There are lots of times when Hakeem gets slapped on the wrist doing his dream shake and not get called fouls. The Dream gets opponents in foul trouble more with his quickness, by faking them out with many moves. Yao doesn't have that quickness. He usually makes one move and shoots.
You and I have seldom agreed, so strike up the band; you are right on, absolutely correct. It is becoming increasingly clear, Ming is being poorly managed. Something has to change, and soon.
I remember when Yao played bad in his rookie year, Rudy always supported and teach him tricks to relax.
I think that is on the money. I just saw a game thanks to Bittorrent and I think JVG is trying to fit the players into a certain mold. Yao can't do the things Shaq can do (especially if he gets calls like the 1st two fouls he got in Utah). But Yao can do things other big men can't do. Let Yao be Yao. Let him pick and pop. Let him catch the ball on the move. Let him take the mid-range jumper. Make the defense defend Yao Ming all over the floor; not just wait for him to post up and then swarm him with defenders. A great coach is a teacher who doesn't try to micromanage his players individual styles and decision making. JVG is not a great coach. He is trying to make Yao Shaq. That is a no-go. I think that if JVG coached Minessota during KG's early years, he would have tried to make KG post up every play instead of letting the Kid develop his all around game. Right now, He has a 25 year old 2-time NBA scoring champ and a mobile 7'6" smooth, jump shooting, crafty, passing big man. Both players are impeccable passers. Put in a motion offense and let them use their passing skills to the best of their abilities. I look forward to the day JVG is gone. I think Mike Dunleavy or Del Harris would have made better pick ups.
Most of this thread should be put next to OVERREACTION in the dictionary... I don't know if you have all forgotten already, but immediately following the trade for Tmac this summer, the consensus was that the most important role THIS year would serve is a trial to find out who we need to surround Yao and Tmac with. That is exactly what's happening. It is clear the Rockets do not have the right pieces, but you people are reacting like sports-radio nutjobs and talking about 'we need to trade Yao' and 'Yao can never be a great player' as if he pulled a Ron Artest or some other unforgiveable crime. So what if he is not a top 10 player in the league? How many other teams can say they have two of the top 10? What we have is one top 10 player (Tmac) and one very good (top 25-30) complementary star in Yao. Just like Minny with Garnett and Cassell. And Dallas with Dirk and Finley. And San Antonio with Duncan and Parker. The problem with the Rockets is they do not have the supporting pieces those teams have; guys like Sprewell, Dampier and Ginobili. Once we find those guys, which may take 2 or 3 years, then we will truly see what the pairing of Yao and Tmac can yield. Until then, chill out and quit acting like Longhorns fans who want to fire Mack Brown every year after the Oklahoma game. This season is not about putting Yao or Tmac on trial. They are here to stay. Accept it. But it is a trial for JVG, MoT, Juwan, Ward, Lue, Boki and everyone else on the team not named Yao or Tmac. If, at the end of the year, we are once again in the lottery, I will not even be that surprised. Or pissed off. Hell, we gave Steve and Cuttino 5 years to even MAKE the playoffs...perhaps Yao and Tmac should get more than 14 games before everyone decides either needs to go.
Maybe gaining weight makes Yao slow in reacting to the ball. But then without the weight, he won't be able to back down and dominate in the post. So it's a double edge sword thing. I do thing Yao defensive instinct isn't where he is supposed to be like previous years...and sometimes doesn't know who to guard. And that has a lot to do with Van Gundy defensive changed up. Also one thing i don't understand about Yao defensive strategy is....when the opposing teammate had a wide open 18footer jumper and Yao was running and rushing to him trying to get to him knowing he won't be there to block him....ok stop right there. Why did he even bother running toward that player to begin with??? I mean he even try to jump and block it even though there is no chance in the world (not even close)....why not just run halfway and get back to the basket quickly and try to help out the rebound....THAT's what I DON'T UNDERSTAND!!! That's very stupid of him to do that in the game and i said this because he keeps doing it and it bother the heck out of me. He still would even try to jump and block it when he's not even close..it's rediculous...what he should do is stop wasting his energy knowing he would not get there in time...and get back to the paint and at least try to rebound the ball. But man...i keep seeing him doing that all the time....and my reason is...if he doesn't run toward the opposing shooter, then JVG might think he's playing really bad defense!! But it is already a bad defense by allowing wide open jump shot...it only add insult to injury by playing unintelligently by rushing toward the shooter when knowing you have no chance of getting there. Why not stop halfway and get back to the paint immediately and help out the rebound.
We have all seen the flash of greatness from Yao, and we all know how good he can become. But I do believe Yao's success is going to largely depends on his supporting cast and his coach, and by far, both of these aren't helping Yao.
