I love winning arguments where it is me against a whole band of liberals. mcmark, gifford, FranchiseBlade, Mulder vs The_Conquistador If you think the odds are stacked, then you're right. To be fair to the liberals, maybe I should only engage them in debate when it is 10-on-1 against me.
But let's say that every time this guy plays the Astros he goes hitless. EVERY SINGLE GAME. Would you get suspicious at all?
Trader this is a serious question. Has Cheney pledged to donate any profits from his Halliburton stock options for all time? Or is this pledge time specific?
No, simply because his performance (as well as the Astros performance) has no impact on his receiving the deferred money. Now if your example was "what if he makes an inordinate amount of fielding errors that appear deliberate", I'd have some thoughts about that, but it would not make sense as it relates to his deferred compensation. It would lead me to believe he is either mentally unstable or has a different deal (one that's not on the books).
That is a good question. Why didn't he transfer the beneficial ownership of the options rather than pledging the profit? Makes me think that he can 'unpledge' them should he be looking for other work in November.
I suspect that you can't transfer stock options (at least I know I can't transfer mine). They belong to me and me alone.
I expect you're right. That's why i said beneficial ownership rather than the options themselves. There must be some sort of trust that them fancy lawyers could draw up though. It just seems sort of 'soft.' And i get back to the perceived conflict thing. I just don't accept that the former CEO is ever truly independent.
So, is it in your interest to have that stock go up before you exercise those options, whenever you choose to? One would think so. Personally, I don't care if Cheney used the "F" word in the Senate chambers. I would wager that it was used quite frequently by LBJ, just as one example, and by others in it's long history. He may not have done it during a speech or a debate, but I don't think Cheney did, either. Having said that, I think Cheney is a lying weasel who is the worst VP we've had since Agnew. I wouldn't trust him to do my laundry, much less run the country if Goofus were to drop dead.
The argument has been proved in this thread (and others) with substantial documentation. Why should we all keep reposting the facts for you over and over when you simply lie and spin and yell your little lunatic cries of desperation in all caps? It's very boring. So, let's have some fun. Compare and contrast Cheney's ties to Halliburton to... Al Qaeda's ties to Saddam Hussein. Did Saddam used to run Al Qaeda? Did he receive "deferred payments" for past work on Al Qaeda's behalf? Does he own major stock positions in Al Qaeda? No, no, and no, but you want us to believe they collaborate, right? Yet, Cheney has no connection to the company. Interesting position. Until your next lunatic war cry, enjoy the comparison. By the way, I don't care about the expletive at all. It's kind of funny. Kind of sad, too, that smackdown is now the rule of the day for our government (on both sides mind you).
oh the irony, frank lautenberg, installed as the democratic candidate for senate only because the democratically controlled NJ supremes chose to ignore their own statutes, questioning cheney's ethics... really, who really gives a flying F!!ck if the F!!cking VP told somebody to F!!ck off? we're involved in a war and this is what the press, senate, and the bbs choose to debate? f!!cking pathetic...
whoa. I think everyone here has said they don't give a flying Humpty Dumpty about the f-word. right? But those of us who care about our nation aren't going to sit back and let someone repeat the spin that Cheney has no ties to the company he used to run. That dog won't hunt, and it's become a subject in this thread because that's what Richard flipped out over.
Yes, it's about as trivial as Kerry happening to be at an anti-war rally in the same crowd as Jane Fonda. Glad we agree.
You know, whenever I need financial advice, I march right into my physics professor's office. Ha! What part of the no-financial ties do you not understand? 1) That the upside from the stock options are pledged to charity? 2) That the deferred compensation has already been earned? 3) That the deferred compensation has nothing to do with Halliburton's performance?
Trader will you explain the process by which the stock options will be exercised and the profits given to charity?
I found this: Cheney sold most of his Halliburton shares when he left the company, but retained 433,333 stock options worth about $8 million. Cheney arranged for the profits to be donated to charity, placed the options in a charitable trust, and relinquished control over them.
You refused to compare and contrast this situation to another "collaboration" allegation. We are eagerly awaiting your insight. You accused "liberals" of posting short posts, and now you avoid the question before you. As for Physics, I could argue from the point of view of General Relativity that an apple does not fall to Earth at all -- it follows its natural space-time path, and is only truly accelerated once the ground interrupts its natural Minkowsky stationary point. But everyone with common sense would hopefully say "whatever, B-Bob, the apple falls." As a physicist, I would not wave my semantic wand of high theory at a very practical, life-on-Earth conclusion. Your trappings of financial legalese strike me as having substantially less practical merit than the work of Albert Einstein. I will admit a bias toward and a deep respect for the work of Einstein when compared to the lifetime profiteering of Cheney though. I cannot say I'm objective on that front. But let us use common sense, shall we? For all real purposes, the apple falls to earth. For all real purposes, to appear objective, Cheney should forfeit these foul-looking payments that put the median American income to shame and sell his Halliburton stock before the federal government awards enormous contracts to the company. That's obvious, and the PR damage alone is staggering. Does he love his country more or less than he loves his accumulated wealth? Again, this is kind of boring.
