CD on 610am. Mike make less $$ but still choose Min.

and of course he wouldn't lie or anything .. .



Rocket River

 

That might be the stupidest thing I've ever read.

F**k Mike James. CD says the Rockets offered the 4th year option, James says they didn't offer it. Who are you going to believe? If you believe James, you are full of ****. The Rockets did everything they could to get him back, and of course they shouldn't offer the trade kicker to a freakin' complimentary player. That would be insane...you never know what could happen.

I'm completely convinced...the guy is a greedy tool that will never get the chip off his shoulder that he thinks he gets no respect. I hope he enjoys the last few years of his career on a mediocre team that will never get past the second, maybe not even the first round.

 

Alright, use your brain, make simple mathematical calculations, and you will CLEARLY see that he didn't go for more money. He went for stability when the Rockets refused to swear their allegiance to him...he would no doubt be a Rocket had the team shown him more commitment to 'right' their wrongs in trading him in the first place.

 

You just described the Rockets...

 

So true. We are not that much better than Memphis even when Yao amd TMac are healthy.

 

Sounds to me like James "beltraned" the Rockets. Maybe Minnesota wasn't giving him the offer he wanted, he gets the Rox to agree to a 4th year PO and then shoves that back into Minny's face. Now the same deal is on the table with James getting more $ from the Rox (no state tax) so Minny agrees to the trade kicker and he immediately agrees to sign. At least that's what I make of CD's account.

 

If precident is a concern, then with your next negotiation, you can distinguish giving MJ a trade kicker on the fact that his value is more than the average NBA salary, i.e., the MLE. Tell the next free agent you're not giving a trade kicker, because that free agent is being paid fair market value. MJ's market value was artificially lowered by virtue of the fact that most teams were over the cap and the most they could offer was the MLE.

It comes down to the fact that MJ was worth what Minnesota paid. The Rockets' blew it; they should have offered the same thing. As for setting precident, that is way overblown. Every negotation is different, every player's value is different. If the collective bargaining rules provide for a trade kicker, there is nothing wrong with offering it, if the market dictates that the player deserves it. If all of the owners band together and agree not to ever offer trade kickers, even though they previously agreed to allow them in the collective bargaining agreement, that smacks of collusion.

If trade kickers are bad, then negotiate them out of the next collective bargaining agreements. It is hypocritical for management to say they never give trade kickers on principle. The rules were set up so to gives teams some control over player movement by allowing the free agent's last team to give higher raises and a longer contract. It works for owners, and top players coming off rookie contracts rarely leave their teams, but instead accept the extention before even hitting the free agent market. The trade kicker was put in place to correspondingly give the players some control over player movement. If giving the team an advantage in retaining its own free agent is fair, giving a player a right to insist on a trade kicker is correspondingly fair.

 

I don't know if I can believe that. He'll never admit it publicly, but I think the Rockets would have had to go above and beyond what everyone else offered for him to come back. James is too selfish and has too much personal pride to NOT hold it against the Rockets for trading him.

And there were no 'wrongs' to 'right'. We traded him because we needed a distributing PG, and because we knew James wanted to get paid this offseason. Should we have kept him, we would have either had to give him a trade kicker or payed him more than the MLE (since we can go over the cap to re-sign our own players) to keep him. Otherwise we very well could have been without a PG right now, or we'd have a very expensive role player.

James definitely leaks his personality through the media...and you can tell that he is the type of person that would hold being traded against a team. I'm sure there are parts of him that wanted to be back, but his pride wouldn't let him. His emotion took over.

HTML:

So true. We are not that much better than Memphis even when Yao amd TMac are healthy.

Classic moment in the making. How many playoff games has Memphis won?

We were a game away from winning a series. Yao is a much bigger force than he was at that time. I think a lot of you are looking too much into this and forgetting that we have the most dominant big man in the NBA. Maybe you stopped paying attention the 2nd half of last season, but Yao has turned the corner. Our roster is already better than what it was to start last season, provided we still need a SG. Last year we thought Derek Andersen and Stromile Swift were the keys...we got better just by losing those two.

There is reason to be disappointed, but not to this extent. This offseason is not over either. We traded a potential project 19 year old for a proven, tough, good shooting veteran. We lost value in the trade by including Swift, but that's not going to break our team. Getting James would've been big, but we are not doomed without him. I feel a lot better about this team right now than I did during last season.

 

If that is what CD said in the interview, I'm not buying what CD is selling. It's hard for me to believe that the Rockets were dead even in negotiations yesterday until the last minute, and then MJ's agent sprung the trade kicker on CD at the last minute. If this was what happened, how do you explain MJ's interview Monday night on his return from Vegas where he was clearly upset with the Rockets?

 

Obviously, at least, one side lies, CD or Mike James.
From the previous words from both of them, I'd like to believe James lied.

 

Some of you can't even entertain the possiblity we got played? Seriously?

Reading his quotes, watching his interviews, listening to him on the radio, watching this come down to the last minute, hearing CD's side of the story...

I think there is more than enough reason to doubt James was going at this honestly. To me there are some simple facts:

Mike James thinks very highly of himself.
Mike James likes money.
Mike James believes he should be making more than he does.
Mike James was angry at the Rockets for trading him.

Do any of you dispute this? If not, how can you take all that into consideration and think that this was all a mistake on the Rockets part? I mean, the deal itself even backs those facts even further:

By going to Minn: James gets to be one of the big dogs on the team. James is making quite a bit more money. James, if he plays well for a couple of years, leaves himself open to make even more money. James gave the Rockets some hope, then the finger.

You know what? I ain't even mad at him. He wanted the attention, he wanted to be in control. He wanted the money. He worked the offseason perfectly and got pretty much exactly what he wanted. Who's to say they wouldn't do the same.

I just don't think he's worth it. He's not some multiple time all-star. More importantly, why should be be given more control than some of the superstars of the game?

I would have enjoyed having him here. He would have helped. But he's still freakin' Mike James. We didn't miss out on LeBron. And just from everything we've seen from the guy, that some of you want to put this entirely on the Rockets....you've got to be kidding me.

 

Am I the only one that thinks no-trade clauses and trade kickers are bad ideas? We hear around here all the time that teams need to stockpile assets, yet, if you give players trade kickers, you essentially eliminate them as assets.

Let's say we did give James that deal and he signed with us. Now, let's say it is the last year of his deal and he's making $8 million and breaking down. With his impending free agency, we'd like to use him in a deal to bring us a younger player from a team that wants the cap space. Oops, sorry, trade kicker.

What if in two seasons we have a shot to make a deal for a big time power forward and we need James to make the deal work financially. Oh, yeah, sorry. Trade kicker.

If any of those scenarios happened, we'd be cursing CD's retired ass into the ground.

We all want flexibility and young assets that can be moved at a moment's notice when opportunity arises. But, we're willing to give that up for Mike James? Seems like a bad idea to me.

 

I have lived in Houston since 74. I still pay Indiana state income tax on my share of the family farm in Indiana. If you earn money in a state with a state income, you pay the state tax on that money.

As a side note, I believe that California also taxes pensions, etc that were accrued in California even if the retiree moves out-of-state.

 

Where is the discrepancy in their statements?

 

great point. not often mentioned enough - I used to be one of those who overstate the value of stae tax when it came to pro athletes forgeting quickly that they pay taxes when they play games in those taxing states.

 

If you have to ask, then yes you're

You know Jeff, it's a small price to pay, man. It's not like he's making the max, he's an MLE player, a player who's getting FAR below what's considered 'fair market value', he's just unlucky to be a free agent this particular offseason. We needed his contribution/presence on the team bad enough that if we were SERIOUS about our 'win now' attitude (which btw I believe is merely a way for management to appease the fans and get 'em off their collective backs for the Gay trade blunder, it was the only way they could explain the Gay+Swift for Battier trade, IMO), then we would have offered him the 4 years (with right to opt out after 3) and the trade kicker.

May be I am wrong, but MJ's talent and what he brings to the Rockets (he was the perfect fit to the current team, IMO) would have been well worth it. Three years of MJ coming off his best career year is NOT too much of a risk.

This business is all about risk-taking, and the Rockets have always been too conservative for my liking. They either make 'minor' trades for secondary role players or make the 'safe' or 'obvious' trade/pick in the draft.

I have been on record for a few years now saying that I am not a fan of CD or anyone who works with him, I am not a fan of Rockets' management in general and feel like they are far behind the curve in terms of personnel who evaluate players/talents (i.e. GM, Coaches, Scouts, etc.)

What has been the goal all along, Jeff? Isn't it to become an 'elite' team and compete with the best, and ultimately winning a championship? Who are the elite teams in the league over the past few years? Well, we're talking Spurs, Mavericks, and Suns at a minimum here, right? OK, now answer this: How do the Rockets measure up to the Spurs, Suns, or the Mavs in terms of player moves/talent evaluation over the past few years?

 

There is a no need calling him a moron for stating that Yao is not a superstar.

I like the dude - I am quite a fan but I do not think he is either. He showed flashes of Superstardom after the toe surgery but superstars are not made over the course of a half season.

Yao is a bonafide NBA star player. He has to consistently pull the stunt he did post toe repair this past season. He is certainly on his way though but lets not count our chicken before the eggs are hatched.

I had to say this because fold are letting homerism get to their head at little bit.

 

I think Avery Johnson and Cuban did a number on him those last couple of days. He seemed fine up to the point he met with Avery on Monday. Then all the past bitterness started suddenly spewing out. In the end, I think he made an emotional decision while he was pissed (15 minutes), and will regret it later when he truly sits down and thinks about it.

 

I guess MJ forgot how last year's MVP got burned and traded by Dallas too

 

How are the following trades "minor"?

McGrady
Drexler
Barkely
Pippen
Francis (that was post draft if you recall)

How was drafting Yao "obvious" or "safe"? I can't even begin to remember how many people called it a horrible decision. How many on this very board said we should draft Jay Williams?

And, make no mistake, the Battier trade IS risky. Hell, just the dissent on this board and sports radio shows it is risky from a fan perspective. They've gotten killed by many media people and analysts. Many considered Gay the best overall player in the draft.

I can understand if you don't like CD or the front office. I disagree with you, but that's ok. But, to say they don't take risks is just plain false.

And, this isn't about risk. I argue that giving ANYONE a trade kicker is simply bad business practice in a league that demands excellence from a roster with a limited number of players and a salary cap. If a player can't be traded here without a monetary hit, it dramatically effects your ability to improve.