But that's not what I said, and it is certainly not an argument I made. I said he was the second best rebounder on the Rockets (true). Rebounding to me is an offensive stat. The defensive stat for a player is his opponent's field goal percentage (i.e. look at Rasheed Wallace's fg % versus Eddie G in the last game). I'm also on record as to my feelings about the defense of a rookie. Ming's a rookie. His defense will suck.
Batman, I understand your point about Ming's defense. I am not defending his defense (pun?). What I don't agree with you is you seems to suggest that loosing a rebound within your grasp is worse than not even able to get your hands on the ball (thus my missing shot on the rim and air ball analogy). The "rebound attempt" idea is misleading, as if you are better off not to "attempt" a rebound if you are not able to get it. EVERY missed shot is a rebound attempt for EVERYBODY on the floor.
I certainly wasn't suggesting anyone shouldn't attempt a rebound. I was responding to the notion that Yao's already one of our better rebounders. The stat which says he is doesn't tell the whole story. I've already said this enough, so this'll be the last time, but considering how many times Yao's in position to touch the ball (due largely to his height) he rarely comes up with it. Remember, everything I've posted in this thread is a reaction to the idea that Yao's rebounding stats are an argument for more minutes. If Yao's not in (and not defending the post), Griffin or Thomas is. And they're currently better at fighting for boards. That was my point. That's all. Not that controversial. I predict that by year's end Yao will be our best rebounder, but neither his current rebounding skills nor his current rebounding stats are solid arguments for increasing his minutes. They will increase when he becomes more familiar with the gameplan.
Batman, I'm not trying to pick bone or anything. But I think your point is still confused. The numbers dwmyers put up show that Ming has more rebound per minute than both Griffin and KT. If the numbers is any indication of the chances of a player getting a rebound, than Ming's chances of getting a rebound is clearly better than Griffin and KT according to the numbers. How does it matter how he didn't get the ones that he didn't get? I understand your point about his rebounding skill still has a lot of room to improve. That is not the point of contention. Everybody knows that he can be and should be a much better rebounder. Having room to improve does not mean he is bad now. A player with better size but worse technique might get more rebounds than a smaller player with better technique. Size itself is certainly an assess for rebounding. A good rebounder is a combination of BOTH size AND technique. I know numbers don't tell the whole story. But at least the numbers show that he has helped the team grab more rebounds per minute than anybody else except Cato.
Batman is arguing Yao's rebounding skills relative to what he/others think it should be. At his size and his relative mobility, there are a lot of balls he is either getting his hands on and losing or is getting pushed slightly out of the way and losing. Relative to the rest of the team, though, he seems to be doing quite well, and this is what he should be judged on when deciding when to give him PT or not. Another thing is it is hard to not judge his every move with a microscope. You really notice those times when he's out there and a ball quickly bounces right over his head, even though it may be happening to other players similarly.
Well, Do you think Yao will be starter tomorrow night? As Cato won't be back and Yao played well last game, possibility will be big.
This kind of falsehood is exactly why I jumped into these arguments in the first place. There have been a ton of people who seem to believe that because Ming isn't a very good defender as of yet, his rebounding must suck. Yet, his rebound rate is higher than anyone on the team other than Cato. So, in fact, he's a good rebounder, if not a great rebounder. Definitely he's rebounding in the Rick Smits range, which is where I expected him to be in his first year. The problem is, Batman, that you want to give some kind of statistical credit for style points, that the basket that somehow bounces off a 7 6 guy counts for far more than the baskets he gets. Ming doesn't look good rebounding, so in your eyes, his stats must be a lie. I just don't buy that.
Dude. Whatever. Take a breath and relax. Then search on my name and Yao and relax more. I'm a huge Yao booster. There are many other big Yao fans in this thread explaining why he isn't getting more minutes or starting yet. You (or someone else - can't remember) posted his rebounding stats to somehow prove I guess that it was a boon to keep him in. My posts, re: his rebounding, have sought to explain the fact that since he's not acclimated enough yet to fight for the ball and come up with it on big possessions, it makes more sense to have guys in there who can. I never said the stats lied -- I said they didn't tell the whole story. And they don't. And having Yao in for more minutes than he's been in would not have improved our chances of winning. It just wouldn't, no matter what your stats say. If you want to argue this back and forth for the rest of the season, okay. I don't really see the point. I'm a Yao fan, heypartner's a Yao fan and Rudy T's a Yao fan. We are also Rockets fans and we want to win games ever so slightly more than rushing Yao's development. If this is the biggest issue you can find to generate outrage, I envy you.
Batman, from your responses, you seems to still not understand the confusion in your argument. Look at JayZ's post. He hit it right on: BTW, nobody is accusing you or heypartner or Rudy for not being Yao's fan.
I see no reason that collier is startin....When ming played, minus marbury breakin his ankles, he played really well last night....but we play collier........They shouldve played ming more last night......but we move on......
