Alright...let's talk pure talent, then. Mobley is clearly the better one-on-one player. End of my retort.
Not the last game! Mobley's shooting and Hakeem's closing, blew out Philly. You are so lame for not saying that. That is about as pure bias as I've seen in this thread. pooh...you've got no argument. You are just pure bias.
Francis is the only player in the NBA to lead his team in points, assists, and rebounding. He's a better all around player than Mobley. Oh, and he also has the highest free throw, and three point percentage on the team as well. Enough said. ------------------
heypartner, better one on one player? Did you see Francis's crossover on Iverson? It literally injured him, Iverson wasn't the same the rest of the game. Like I just heard on the radio, very few players in the league can make the person guarding them look as silly as Francis can. ------------------
Just want to add a little info to this debate. -look at the first 3 years of Kobes career and compare them to Cats first 3 years. -also note the minutes played. If you say comparing the two is impossible, than I ask you why everyone sites Cats physical ability as a strength and experience as a weakness. I am pretty sure that WAS how everyone talked about KOBE too. CAT http://espn.go.com/nba/profiles/stats/avg/3284.html KOBE http://espn.go.com/nba/profiles/stats/avg/3118.html They really are quite simular players so far. also. Cat has the same numbers in his 3rd year as Kobe had, and Kobe made the all star team that year. just wanted to point that out. peace ------------------ Hanta-Force Paintball www.hanta-force.com
I think you're bias for implying that Mobley is a better player than Francis. Anyone with basketball knowledge can see that Francis is the better all around player. ------------------
pooh, don't run away from the "more talent" argument that you started. Leave the stats argument out of it, because I agree he has better stats. But they are no measure of physical talent. talent for talent...Mobley is the better one-on-one player. Defenses fear the Mobley ISO more than the Francis ISO. That said, I will agree that Francis's leaping ability trumps Mobley's long, quick first step and long armed finish. But not by much. You calling him "nothing more than a role player" vs "a superstar" is sheer bias, or lack of recognizing talent. you have no arguments, only biased exaggeration.
while I agree w/ you heypartner, I believe you need to ask heyschweetie to introduce you to heyputie. ------------------
I never said Francis wasn't better. Boy, you Mobley bashing can't take any criticism of Francis. Just, tell me how much better. And please retract the role player vs superstar. I think they are both stars right now, based on the fear the put in the defenses. Neither is a superstar, right now. Everything else is talking about potential.
Only a few players in the league can make players look silly, and Mobley is one of them as well. ------------------ "GiddyUP!!!" Krammer from Seinfeld
HeyPee, if it was a half-court trap, it was closer to the arc than the half-court line. I remember two other he threw a bounce pass out of it to Mo who was positioned in the middle of the court beyond the arc. I don't think the play ever developed any time. Cat made the appropriate pass out of the double team at least twice and the dumb play once. He dribbled the ball for two or three seconds with two guys on him then tried to split them and didn't even come close. You know, you don't have to be a basher to point out something negative and you don't have to be an apologist to cheer something good. I think some people think otherwise when it comes to Cat. ------------------
Look, I'm going to say this, I'm just not as impressed with Mobley as some people are. Mobley's not a bum, but he's not all that. If Mobley would tone it down and play smarter most of the time, I wouldn't have as big of a problem with him. He's just so cocky and arrogant, and too selfish at times, and it really hurts the team, you can't deny that. Francis is more of a team player then Mobley right now. But he hasn't been hurting them lately as much with poor decisions. But I've noticed that more plays are being ran through Francis lately on offense and Francis has become more assertive, and low and behold, the Rockets are playing some of their best ball now. ------------------
I agree! I measure it based on exaggeration. Basher and Apologist should try not to exaggerate, to make their argument. Then we could discuss some basketball and how to use these two extremely talented, slam-dunking, no-look-backing, all-stars-in-the-making, shake-n-baking, Rocket's guards of ours. yeooooooooooooooow!!
I can too deny that. Clearly from your statement above, it is all personal to you. You like one personality versus another. And I think you are not reading Mobley personality and court character correctly anyhow. I'm sure you didn't like Barkley, Iverson and Kobe for their cockiness and arrogance either. It hurts the team. Hogwash. Mobley is not hurting the team enough to bash him like you are. Francis's careless dribbling, and continued lack of getting us into more fastbreaks, hurts us just as much. If you would notice how Mobley makes the opposing team focus their entire defense on him, you'd would appreciate what he does for the rest of the team. If you would watch the other teams kill us with superior fastbreaks for over 1 1/2 years, you'd see why I think our fastbreak is hurting our team. [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited February 09, 2001).]
heyparty-Francis is starting to do it more. I saw several times where instead of dribbling it slowly up the court he sent down a pass to try to catch the defense in transition, and pushing it up. He's getting better. Mobley is a GREAT person to have. Why hack on Mobley, who by all accounts is underpaid for players of his caliber and works hard day in and day out, when there's Cato making more, doing nothing. Steve will more than likely amount to more, but as far as getting to the hoop in a one on one situation goes, Mobley is 2nd to none. I'd rather have his fearlessness, than someone's fear. Take Vancouver-lots of talent, but Reef, Bibby, and Dickerson aren't guys that love to play in the clutch, or take the big shot. Mobley will take it 10 times out of 10, half the time driving us crazy, but he plays his heart out. He's got to be the best left-hander in the league. Kobe must be jealous he didn't get his dad's lefthandedness. ------------------ The Serious Police are watching. Follow the rules or be assimilated. Shandon is underrated.
Yes, I've seen him push it. And know: I would be very insistent on getting him to push it. Not only because of the success, but because that is why I bought tickets. I didn't buy tickets to see Mobley. I bought tickets for Barkley and Francis. Mobley has been one glorious surprise after another. I cannot believe what he is doing to this league. I am very hard on Francis, because he has more potential. For everytime he pushes the fastbreak, there are times he loses the handle. I am not a happy fan about our fastbreak. Francis is our man, our savior who is going to make or break our fastbreak. But, being a fastbreak lover, I am going to expect more. Right now, I'm skeptical to whether his dribbling skills are up to the test. [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited February 09, 2001).]
I see what you're saying Voice. In the funny thing is, right now Kobe isn't really any more mature then Mobes, he is more talented all-around, and he happened to have the most dominate player in basketball last year on his team. Besides how many times have we heard about KOBE jacking up 30 shots a game. You know what the announcers and media say? He'll grow out of that and mature. Same thing with Cat. ------------------ Dream a deadly Dream. . . [This message has been edited by RocksMillenium (edited February 09, 2001).]
I actually think that Cuttino has been taking much better shots lately. He has taken lots of mid-range jumpshots, and driven to the basket much more lately. I still think he hurts the team with his 3-15 shooting nights, because he doesn't know when to stop shooting. Lately though, Cuttino has shown a lot of improvement. Even on the defensive end. The whole team has done that, actually. ------------------ "Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning how to put food on their family while being put to death."
I always comeback to BBS but i may not celebrate bad performances by players unlike yourself, for some stupid reason that doesn't seem like being a fan. What i lover recently when he has struggled from the field the rebounds and assists have been up and as usual he gets to the line plenty. ------------------ CUT Tino These Heaves are just getting Ridiculous!
