HAHA Doc! Nothing like legal action to get people to see things your way! ------------------ Dream a deadly Dream. . .
Man, I keep harping on this, but no one...not the Cat haters....and strangely enough, neither the cat supporters.....seems to acknowledge it: Cat doesn't just go for the shot; he goes for the foul. Not every foul is called. Sure; he misses some wide open shots with no one touching him.....everyone does. But he also misses some shots where he's fouled and it isn't called. STILL: HE GETS THE OTHER TEAM IN FOUL TROUBLE QUICKER THAN ANY OTHER ROCKET. And that my friends, is the best part of his game. ------------------ stop posting my damn signature
Exactly! How many times have we heard guys like Vince Carter say they tried to guard Mobley but that he was just to quick, and that he was aggressive going to the basket. I wonder if people know a good thing when they see it. I know there are people who would trade Cat in a second for Antonio Davis, because I've seen people begging to trade Cat for a big man up front. Well now that you have that big man, where is your second go-to guy? Where is that other player that isn't going to be afraid to take the last second shot? To take guys to the basket, and get guys in foul trouble? Shot selection improves with time, you can always get patience. But you can't just suddenly get heart, desire, the willingness to improve, and the fire to step up and take that big shot, and not get down when you fail. And you don't just get a player everyday that doesn't back down from anybody. We have that in Cuttino Mobley, and a lot of people want to trade that. Weird. ------------------ Dream a deadly Dream. . .
Guess what? Mobley has only taken about 40 or so more shots then Francis YET Francis is only shooting about 1% higher then Cat. That's because Cuttino is a better shooter & scorer than Francis. He can get to the bucket better, and he can shoot better. The reason his FG% is lower than Francis', is that he mixes dumb shots into there and drags his percentage down. If he'd stop doing that, he'd absolutely be the best shooter/scorer on the team. ------------------ Is it any coincidence that the Cato is the only Rocket with a temperature scale named after him? I didnt think so!!!!
Shanna, I think that is what frustrates people most about Mobley. The stupid stuff, whether it is bad shot selection, trying to dribble through double teams, not passing to the open man, etc. I don't disagree with your post one bit. He had a great game last night, and yet two plays made me cuss out loud. One was when he tried to dribble between a double team, turning the ball over, of course. The other time was when the Rocks had the ball on a little break. I cringe when it is in his hands on the break. Cat had the ball in the middle with Shandon on the wing. If he had passed the ball to Shandon when he should have, Shandon could have taken it all the way to the hole. Instead, Cat keeps the ball until Shandon is stopped by the end-line and no longer has an angle to the basket on his defender. Then Cat passes him the ball! Shandon has no place to go with the ball, so passes it back to Cat. Advantage and opportunity lost. Its something like this every game. As good as he can be one on one, he really hinders ball movement. At least he has improved from so much pointless dribbling before he does something with it. He could be so much better. ------------------
The thing that frustrates me about Cuttino's mistakes is often times they lead to points for the other teams, whereas when Francis makes mistakes, and he does, they dont lead to other teams scoring. I disagree about Cat being a better shooter than Francis. Cuttino is a STREAK shooter. He may hit 7 of 8 shots then go 0-4. The whole rockets team is, for the most part, streak shooters, but some are more consistent than others. You can tell when Cat is off, and when he keeps on shooting in those situations, that's what pisses people off. I wish they would run 24 high for Cat more, because I like him taking that shot at the free throw line.Also, he is one of those rare players nowadays, who can get your team out of a scoring drought and get to the free throw line. He is great at getting to the free throw line. I think alot of people dont give cuttino respect, me included, when he gets 20 plus points in some games because its the ugliest 20 points I've ever seen. He will shoot horribly, but FORCE it and get the calls. I wish some of you would stop criticizing Francis or other players, just to make your argument for Cuttino. ------------------
If Cuttino Mobley is a streak shooter, what do you call Francis, they are shooting practically the same percentage? And you talk about Mobleys mistakes are causing other teams to score points, same could be said about Francis who has over 50 more turnovers then Mobley. Again, I think people are so used to criticizing Mobley that they get upset when he actually has a good game. And nobody is criticizing Francis, I'm praising him. I'm saying that Francis makes the same mistakes as Mobley because they pretty have the same amount of experience. I haven't criticized Francis yet, just pointed out facts. People complain about him being streaky, well he shoots about the same percentage as Francis. People complain about his ISO, Francis does ISO. People complain about his mistakes, Francis makes mistakes. People complain about Mobley's plays hurting the team offense and giving other teams the ability to score, Francis' turnovers do the same thing. Why are people ripping Mobley and praising Francis? As far as I'm concerned both are the heart of this team and both MAKE MISTAKES, that we have to live with while they grow. ------------------ Dream a deadly Dream. . . [This message has been edited by RocksMillenium (edited February 09, 2001).]
Freak, HeyP Its not lack of sleep but looking at things objectively. Yea,Cuttino has a great first step. Yea,he can light it up when given a chance. But there is not excuse for shooting when 5 people are all on him. NONE. Not youth. Not lack of whatever. Not him being undersized. NADA. His shoots too much. He doesn't pass enough. END OF STORY. If you fail to see THAT then you are not paying attention. Did I say trade him? NOPE. Did I say don't start him? NOPE. In fact, look at my posts LAST YEAR and I said put him in the starting line up. THIS IS OUR BEST LINEUP. But that doesn't excuse lack of marbles many, many, many times during the game. And those mistakes clearly lead to fast breaks most of the time because when he shoots, they are off balance, front of the rim shots that the opposing team can outlet for fastbreak points. Again, I am just saying he shoots too damn much and has bad shot selection. I don't want the man ran out of town. I AM GROUCHY! ------------------ Sleepless in the Bronx
Moe, just mark down the time on the clock and the quarter next time you see Mobley split a double team. Also, mark down the times Francis does it. You'll see that Francis does it at a much higher clip. No, this is not rocket science. I'm simply trying to get everyone to agree on terminology. Beating your man and splitting an exposed crease in the hellllp defense is not taking on a double team!
Rocksmillenium, read a little closer. I said the rockets are basically a team of streak shooters. If you dont think Cuttino is a streak shooter then you're crazy. What bring his shooting percentage up, is games like last night where he'll only miss like 3-4 shots. What bring him down is the games where he goes 4-15 or so. Also, I even said Francis made mistakes, I just thought it was stupid to point out another player's flaws to make a stronger case for someone's argument for Cat. Also, people get mad at Cat when he doesn't use his strenghts when ISO'ing. Seeing him force it so badly in the New York game made me cringe a few times.I have no problem with Cat ISO'ing, in fact on nights like last night, I wish they would ISO for him more, but if he throws up a fadeaway fading to his offhand, I cant help but be pissed. I could point out all of Francis' flaws but whats the point? We're talking about Cuttino Mobley. I am thrilled with both of them. Also,Francis doesnt make the same mistakes as Mobley. He may make as many mistakes but not in the same context.Also, I think people here are too critical of both players. For instance, last night I thought Francis had a bad game considering his play of late , but in the eyes of George Irvine he had a good game. ------------------ [This message has been edited by tacoma park legend (edited February 09, 2001).]
shoot with 5 men on him? the exaggerators have won again. look, mobley is what i call a machine. as in SCORING MACHINE. see also: vinnie johnson (old skool, i know) kobe bryant allen iverson michael jordan when you crank that machine up, there is no ONE player that can stop them. so, you have a defense literally - flying - to get at them once they've broken their man down. if all he does is pass when their is a question - THE DEFENSE WINS. in order to be a scorer, almu, guess what? YOU HAVE TO FORCE SOME SHOTS. it's a way of keeping the defense honest. if you'll notice, all of those players are accused of "JACKING". all of them DO force some shots. and all those players come from winning teams. get ready to add cat to that list. btw, there are a few things i WOULD like to see cat improve on: 1) run the wings 2) work on post game 3) work on right hand drives/finishes 4) play the passing lanes more aggressively IF HE DOES JUST THOSE THINGS, IN ADDITION TO HIS CURRENT GAME LEVEL...HE'S A HALL OF FAMER.
HeyPee, I don't know if you read my post too quickly or what, but if you want to agree on terminology, please read carefully. I don't call a double team above the arc help defense. I call help defense when cat beats his man and is on his way to the basket or lane. What I saw last night in the 4th quarter, I believe, was Cat double-teamed above the arc. He tried to dribble between the two defenders several seconds after he had been double-teamed. He lost the ball. He had Mo available out at the top of the arc and I believe Mooch available on the wing. Now please, read this carefully and tell me if you call this "help defense". RocksM, you have the most non-sequitars of anyone I've ever seen trying to make a point. Similar percentages have absoultely nothing to with whether someone is a streak shooter and someone else is more consistent. A player could go 10 for 10 for 4 games in a row, 0 for 10 the next 4 games, 10 for 10 the next 4 and so on. They would have exactly the same percentage as someone who went 5 for 10 every game. ------------------
What's the point we're talking abotu Mobley!? How many post of people started and contributed to saying Mobley has cost us 6 ot 7 games, and that he hurt our offense and makes mistakes. How many have I read about Francis!? And if you don't think that what you are saying about Mobley is exaggerated think about this, Mobley just had a monster game, shot well and helped his team win, yet people are STILL upset with him and complaining about him. That is what I'm talking about. Mobley is damned if he do, damned if he don't. ------------------ Dream a deadly Dream. . .
I don't know what non-sequitars means but it must be an insult! Sure Mobley struggles sometimes with his shot, but would most other 3rd year SGs still average 20 points a game? I don't think Mobley has gone 0 for 10 in 4 straight games. He has had some off-nights shooting and STILL found a way to score though. And Mobley only attempted about 40 or 50 more shot attempts then Francis. Look at the other SGs that are shooting about the same as Mobley, how many of them are averaging 19 points a game with ANOTHER backcourt guy averaging 19 points a game? Some people are just overreacting sometimes about Mobley. ------------------ Dream a deadly Dream. . . [This message has been edited by RocksMillenium (edited February 09, 2001).]
RocksM, I can't tell if you are responding to my post or not, the way you ramble. In case you are responding to my post, if you read my posts, you should see my point. If you are responding to someone else's posts, you should make that clear. I am not a Mobley basher. I posted what I thought most people find frustrating about Cat. I said he played a great game, but still illicited out-loud cussing for doing things I would be disapptointed in an eighth-grader doing. Then the knee-jerk Cat apologists come out trying to make me feel bad. Sorry, it didn't work. All it did was goad me into posting 3 or 4 more times to point out what I said and not what you want people to think I said. ------------------
RocksM, you are nothing if not persistent. You take an example I use that illustrates how it doesn't make sense to compare percentages to prove if someone is a streak shooter or not, and you try to imply that I said Mobley had shot 0 for 10. You are pitiful. ------------------
rocksmill: "Mobley just had a monster game, shot well and helped his team win, yet people are STILL upset with him and complaining about him" I think this is because in the early posts everybody comes in and starts asking where the mobley bashers are at now that cat had had a good game. and other peaople who's name was called out offcourse have their "pride" so they come out to "prove" they weren't hiding or anything and on and on and then we have another argument going on.. oh well.. good game cat.. ------------------ against all odds
I agree that Mobley is streaky. To me he's nothing but a streaky role player. I'm sorry, I don't see how some of you can say how Mobley is such a great player, he's too inconsistent. Yes, Francis makes mistakes at times as well, but the bottom line is Francis has more talent then Mobley, end of discussion. Mobley has had his head blown up by the coaching staff, and he thinks he's a superstar or something. Mobley's far from being a superstar. Francis is on the brink of being a superstar, and I'm glad he has taken more of a leadership role lately. Francis taking a leadership role, along with Hakeem's play of late, have been the major reason for the teams improvement. ------------------
Moe, I respect that you saw what you say. I just want to talk about the same things. Are you sure that wasn't Mobley bringing the ball up court to face a half-court trap (which is quite often beat by splitting it), or maybe it was a busted play. Was it a 2 Shakes where he split the double. I only try to measure how they run plays called for them. I would like anyone to mark down the game and time of Mobley taking on a double team of 2 Shakes or 24 High, especially 2 Shakes. And while you are at it, mark down how many times Francis does it in 2 Shakes and 24 High. You will find that Mobley is more conservative than Francis when facing a double team.
