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Carter: "What has happened to the United States of America?"

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Batman Jones, Nov 13, 2005.

  1. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Contributing Member

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    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051112/ap_on_go_pr_wh/carter_bush_1

    Carter Rails Against Bush During Book Tour

    Sat Nov 12, 4:28 PM ET


    KANSAS CITY, Mo. - Former President Jimmy Carter questioned the direction of the country and sharply criticized the Bush administration in a book tour stop here.

    "Everywhere you go, you hear, 'What has happened to the United States of America? We thought you used to be the champion of human rights. We thought you used to protect the environment. We thought you used to believe in the separation of church and state,'" the Nobel Peace Prize winner said Friday at Unity Temple. "That's not the case anymore."

    Carter is promoting "Our Endangered Values: America's Moral Crisis." It is his 20th book, but Carter says it's his first political one.

    "I felt so disturbed and angry about this radical change in America that I have always loved and still love," he said.

    Referring to his latest book's title, Carter said the Bush administration is responsible for the country's moral crisis. He railed Bushs pre-emptive war policy; the erosion of the church-state separation; a ballooning budget deficit; inadequate attention to the environment; and the use of torture against some prisoners.

    "This administration has injected into the American political system a dramatic, unprecedented and profound change in the basic values of our national policy," Carter said.

    Some 1,200 people waited to have books signed by the 39th president. Also at hand were Rep. Emanuel Cleaver, a Kansas City Democrat, and Rep. Karen McCarthy (news, bio, voting record), his predecessor.
     
  2. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking
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    Oh this book is truly groundbreaking -- reading about how a liberal doesn't like the actions of the party that has thoroughly whipped them over the past several elections. Man, haven't seen too many of those books lately... And to see it written by the worst president in modern history is just further reason to ignore this crap. Oh, and remind me, which party is trying to divide America? Does this book bring us together? That's funny.
     
  3. FranchiseBlade

    FranchiseBlade Contributing Member
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    This book unites about 2/3 of America. That is better than Bush has done. Tell me was the nation more or less divided before Bush took office?
     
  4. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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    the left lost it's mind in an orgy of self-pity, self-rightousness, sense of entitlement, and ultimately irrelevance.
     
  5. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking
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    Who is dividing a nation?

    A President elected two times in a row who is serving the people that voted him into office?

    The minority party who does nothing but complain, highlight negatives, take national tours criticizing the majority party, try to erode support for the troops, and attack (and insult) Christians' values?
     
  6. FranchiseBlade

    FranchiseBlade Contributing Member
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    The party that has insulted christian values is the party that started a pre-emptive war, wants to make sure it can legally torture people who haven't been proven guilty of anything, discriminate against homosexuals.

    Carter, recognizing that our nation's traditional moral leadership in the world stage has been stripped away, isn't what is dividing the nation. The administration who sold those morals down the river are the ones who divided the nation. I'm not talking about what happened a year ago. That is the past. Currently the majority of the people in the U.S. say Bush is not honest, and they believe he mislead them into a war they don't approve of.
     
  7. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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    the why do you constantly spout th ebush lied meme?

    you're right, and since polls are historically so reliable, i suggest we abolish elections all together, and just left zogby, gallup, et al, rund a poll on what ever issue needs deciding. polls show 60% of americans favor restrictions on abortion, and disfavor gay marriage. who are we to disagree?
     
  8. FranchiseBlade

    FranchiseBlade Contributing Member
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    I talk about bush lying because some people prefer to pretend or make themselves willfully ignorant and claim he didn't lie. That action in the past also has a negative effect on what is happening today.

    I wasn't claiming polls relace voting or anything else. They are merely a snapshot of general opinion for a certain time. At this time they are a dark prison cell for the Bush administration.
     
  9. thadeus

    thadeus Contributing Member

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    In the time since Carter was president, he has won the Nobel Peace Prize, and with good reason.

    He is one of the few politicians I actually respect. Although, I don't think I'd consider him a 'politician' anymore.

    ..and he's telling the truth. This isn't some mind-numbing liberal/conservative debate. He's just telling the truth.

    It's funny - if anyone criticizes the actions of the Bush Administration, the supporters come out and immediately start blaming 'liberals' and trivialize the critique as if it's just another down of some football game. Does this mean that no critique of the Bush Administration is legitimate? That it's all just part of a shouting match where all sides are equal and either could be right at any given time so neither is ever actually right? That the only reason any criticisms happen is because people are being loyal to their 'team,' and that there is no honest critique possible outside of this little libs vs. cons game?

    C'mon.

    I'm not playing political football, and I haven't joined anyone's team. The Bush Administration is damaging this country in a way that shouldn't be possible, and wouldn't have been possible if 9/11 hadn't happened.

    I hope Jimmy Carter continues speaking about this in as many different forums as he can for as long as he possibly can.
     
  10. lpbman

    lpbman Member

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    When I was about 10-11 years old, my mother worked with an elderly German lady at Red Lobster and I remember being shocked when I asked her about WWII and the Holocaust and she just flatly denied the entire Holocaust and believed what she wanted to believe. No amount of evidence, no matter who presented said evidence could convince her otherwise.

    I remember thinking this was a smart lady, and not at all evil. She was just unable to accept something that if true, would hurt her so much. I suspect the same is true of the diehard Bush supporters in this room.
    I love my country, I will probably vote Republican in the next election. I want Bush to triumph in Iraq, Afganistan and the war on terror. I'm not a liberal who squirts himself every time a Republican fails or looks bad.

    But I'm not seeing anything close to victory in Iraq, we don't have Saddam, I'm tickled pink that the US hasn't been directly attacked since 9/11. Go George, however I demand a great deal more than what I've seen from this admin and I'm SURE I'm not the only one who feels similarly.
     
  11. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    Good story asbout the woman. I believe it gives us some inkling of why many Americans just cannot grasp how frankly murderous and unjust their country, the United States, has been during its two wars and sanctions on Iraq.
     
  12. HayesStreet

    HayesStreet Member

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    Speaking of being blinded to reality by your ideology, the first Gulf War and sanctions were UN actions. "Murderous and unjust" is frankly going overboard, even for you glynch.
     
  13. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Excellent post, and right on. Carter may have driven me crazy as President, but he is arguably the best example of what a former President should do once out of office. Couldn't agree more with what Carter said, or this post.



    Keep D&D Civil.
     
  14. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    Crap. Nobody knows the truth if he was misguided or not, let alone a president can not start a war by himself.

    You might be onto something here ... granted I know very little on this subject of debate, but speaking for every conservative, I know we all want to torture people after they confess to their crimes. :rolleyes:

    i didn't realize having an opinion against something was discrimination. Maybe I missed the part where Bush is gathering up the crowds into forcing homosexuals to sit at the back of the bus and removing their rights to vote.
     
  15. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Right, because what the US is doing is comparable to the Holocaust.
     
  16. insane man

    insane man Member

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    how many children did the sanctions kill? to say its not murderous is having your head up your ass and ignoring the facts.
     
  17. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    So then you support the war, since otherwise the sanctions would still be in place.
     
  18. insane man

    insane man Member

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    i dont support the death penalty but i dont support letting murderers go free.

    but mr. clutch do you still beat your wife?
     
  19. lpbman

    lpbman Member

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    Remember the oil for food program? The sanctions didn't kill people, abuse of that program did.

    That's like saying the US gov is responsible for starving children in the US when their mothers spend their welfare/assorted assistance program monies on drugs.

    There is some blame to go around and we probably could have made a bigger effort to crack down on the corruption, but to call it murder is ridiculous.
     
  20. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    Now really ... Think long and hard what you just posted here. We're "murdering" people who are walking into crowded shopping places with bombs strapped onto their body and trying to kill every man, woman and child possible in their vicinity. Maybe you hail them as heros for trying to stop the evil conservative machine of America.

    You're going to accuse Bush of murder by sending troops across the world and get killed? Just in case you forgetten, this is WAR. Nobody forced these soldiers into going into the military. You can't murder anyone with a weapon in their hand with the intent to kill. They signed up knowing they can get killed.

    The part that pisses me off the most about anti-bush supporters is 1) They refuse to be supportive of ANYTHING Bush does. 2000+ American deaths will not be justifiable if Bush miraciously accomplishes world peace and a cure for cancer. It doesn't matter what this guy does, right, wrong or your own personal opinion or agenda, you will be against him 100%. 2) The arguements against him are so far out and out of sight that it makes the arguement sad and pathetic. I don't agree that what all has happened in the last three years has been best for the country, but im not going to scream out "murder" ... maybe misguided and not doing the right thing. "He discriminates against homosexuals" ... not discriminate, but perhaps doesn't reconize that homosexual way of life is not in the definition of a marriage. Intentionally twisting a persons viewpoint is not worse than intentionally lying.
     

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