Can you be a Christian and Support the Death Penalty?

No, Jorge. Actually I wish very much that everyone would behave as Christians are meant to do. I do my very best to do that myself, although I fail like all Christians and people who seek to act as Christians do. I don't dislike Christians. I honor them. I dislike hypocrites. Like Bush and like you.

 

Great question, Meowgi.

I struggled with the death penalty for years. Right now, I'm very much against it. I have a very hard time squaring it with the compassion I see from Christ. And I have a hard time squaring it with the very real "new creations" i've seen of people who've been transformed by Christ. People who many of you would say are worthy of the death penalty.

I think of people who would have deserved the death penalty. Mary was with child...she was to be stoned to death, because she was not married. Joseph stood by her...gracefully. She gave birth to the Son of God.

Saul called himself the worst of sinners. He watched as Stephen was murdered. He ordered the murder of Christian after Christian and became so feared. Christ transformed him..even giving him a new name...Paul. The Apostle Paul. Who changed the face of western civilization with his witness for Christ.

I can't square the death penalty with the God of second chances. That's the God I know. But I'm very hesitant to say someone isn't a Christian because they support a different political position. Following Christ is an everyday process. Like any relationship, it evolves. So, no...I can't say someone isn't a follower of Christ because they haven't arrived at the same conclusion I've arrived at.

 

Hypocrisy is more of a human failing than a Christian or conservative failing. It just so happens that ultraliberalism has so few absolutes that there are seemingly no opportunities for hypocrisy.

 

And incidentally the acts I listed are not acts supported by all Christians. I would venture to say twhy doesn't support any of them. Max might not either. The acts I listed were not ridiculous. Many of them were things that happen every day and are perpetrated by both Christians and non-Christians alike. But they were all things that, according to commonly accepted understandings of Christianity are against Christianity and against God. There are some I agree with and some I don't. Read the list again. I guarantee you don't agree with all of them even though a pure Christian (as we understand scripture) would. In fact, I'd venture you're for less than half of them (and that I'm for more than half) and yet you try to defend Christianity here. It's a fakeout. You don't care about Christianity or God. You just care about the fight and about Bush. If you truly cared about Christ or God or religion you'd argue this on its merits.

 

By your reply I can only assume you appreciate the "absolutes" of Christianity, some of which are:

- No death penalty
- No war, especially preemptive war
- No rubbers

I'll believe you if you say you don't use rubbers. But I'm pleasantly surprised to hear you're against the death penalty and preemptive war.

 

I'm more Christian than most Christians I know.

And I don't believe in anything.

And I don't support the death penalty.

 

Yeah, I got that MEOWGI. It was a great instinct. The thing is there's a loophole implied. Yes, you can be a Christian and be for the death penalty; you'd just be a 'bad' Christian that would later need to seek forgiveness and change his ways. That's the trouble with the wording. There is no way at all you could be a good Christian and support revenge killing. Word it that way and see what you get, cause that's what it is.

 

I feel the exact same way, thad. Are you drunk?

 

Can you be a Christian and swear? Can you be a Christian and lie? Can you be a Christian and steal? Can you be a Christian and cheat? Can you be a Christian and kill? Can you be a Christian and obssess?

To me, it seems that the majority of ALL people (Christian or not) are guilty of some of these things, whether small scale or large. When you ask a Christian how they can be one and do any of these things, you'll just hear something like, "Because that's what I believe." Truth is, it's hard to find anyone who is straight-up, non-sinning Christian these days....

 

Counting down to Batman calling all Christians 'dumb' or saying that the religion is a farce...

 

Meanwhile it's incredibly easy to find a self-identified Christian that opposes turning the other cheek or helping those less fortunate than themselves and approves revenge killings and elective wars. Let's not even talk about condoms. I'm not a Christian, but if the Republican party truly represented Christian values, I would be a Republican in a second. I'm more a fan of Buddhist values than of any religion. But that said, I'm more a fan of (and my ethics are more in line with) Christianity than any political party. That's why I'm a Democrat.

 

goad, goad, goad...

 

I agree with you there.

It seems that most non-religious people are some kind of fans of Buddhism.

I, myself am not a Christian either, but I hold my ethics and morals also to something that I would identify with Christian beliefs.

 

Jorge, I answer your posts all the time. I just did so in fact. Why don't you try answering mine? Your credibility (A HAHA HA HAHAHA OH... OUCH.. WAITAMINUTE, LEMME CATCH MY BREATH.... OH HAHAH HOHO HO HAH... OKAY... No waitaminute... okay... okay...) is on the line.

I have never said religion was a farce.

And if you care at all about Christianity, talk about it.

I presented several commonly held (and strongly held) Christian values. If you refuse to talk about them, defend them, debate them, you're a hypocrite, a fraud and a fake. (I woulda said coward, but we all know you're that.)

CLUCK

CLUCK

CLUCK

CLUCK

The only reason you care about Christianity at all is as a tool against liberals (Christian or not) who might get between your money and your greed. You ought to thank us. If Christians are right, there's no doubt you're going straight to hell.

 

No, goading is dropping the inflammatory language that Batman has been using in this thread. Totally unnecessary. Pediphilia? Pre-emptive wars? Please. Talk about goading...

Edit: Hilarious, look what I found!!! Thanks Borracho.

 

Audience members after a show: Hey buddy, we're Christians and we didn't like what you said.

Bill Hicks: Great. Forgive me.

 

Jorge, since you sometimes take pleasure in pointing out irrelevant mistakes, it's "pedophelia." Pre-emptive war is a policy created and defended by the president and administration you supported. If that's inflammatory language, your guys invented it. If you want to run away from it, well forgive me if I say that's just characteristic. You run away from everything you pretend to believe in.

I put pedophilia right next to abortion rights, gay rights, contraception, the death penalty, aid to the rich over the poor and war. I included things I support and things I don't support, but each of them were things that Christians OFFICIALLY don't support. How you spin that to me being anti-Christian blows my mind. And I have to say again, as I did a week or two ago, are you really that dumb? I mean, really? I'm arguing FOR Christianity here, you freaking dork.

And if by any chance you're not that dumb, do you want to have this discussion or do you want to run away like usual and just declare yourself the winner? I'm sure that'd be easier for you, but I still hold out hope one day you'll actually answer a charge and be man enough to have a debate. No? No? Really? Okay. My bad.