1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

can we win a title without any superstar

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by matthappy, Dec 29, 2009.

  1. Dave_78

    Dave_78 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2006
    Messages:
    10,809
    Likes Received:
    373
    This team is two players away from being a contender. Neither have to be superstars but it needs a SG along the lines of a younger Rip Hamilton and big man who can guard the paint and score a bucket when nobody is paying attention to him.

    If Yao returns healthy and a move is made for a SG who is an efficient scorer and who understands how to get his shots by moving off the ball then this team is good enough to beat any team in a 7 game series. If Yao doesn't return it can still happen although I would expect it would take a near All Star level wing player to make it happen.
     
  2. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2007
    Messages:
    39,183
    Likes Received:
    20,334
    I consider Billups to be a superstar.
     
  3. matthappy

    matthappy Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2009
    Messages:
    273
    Likes Received:
    3
    yao/gortat
    scola/landry
    martin/battier
    ariza/bundinger
    brooks/lowry

    could this lineup work?
     
  4. Spacemoth

    Spacemoth Member

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2007
    Messages:
    9,908
    Likes Received:
    4,692
    The NBA is a star-driven league because of how it's officiated. When the going gets tough, the tough get whistled for breathing on guys like Lebron and Kobe. Reputation reigns supreme. This is why, in spite of sound play and superior teamwork, it is still very difficult for teams without marquee names to make it far in the playoffs. So to answer your question, it's possible, but very very hard. It would be like the humans winning Mortal Kombat.
     
  5. Angkor Wat

    Angkor Wat Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2007
    Messages:
    13,150
    Likes Received:
    997
    Championship talk already? I love it.
     
  6. flamingdts

    flamingdts Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2008
    Messages:
    11,630
    Likes Received:
    4,729
    In this league? No

    Before? Maybe

    They will never let a bunch of no names win a championship. Never. Ever.

    The 2004 Pistons were a deep team. 4x defensive player of the year Wallace 1, a top 5 PF in Wallace 2, the best moving-without-the-ball player in the league in Hamilton, a great iso defender in Prince (with good offense as well) and lastly the all-star player in Billups.

    Our team is not even close to that at this stage.
     
  7. Cstyle42

    Cstyle42 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2008
    Messages:
    22,703
    Likes Received:
    14,304
    Look man this is what we need to do...


    Trade T-Mac, Battier and Dorsey to Detroit

    in exchange for Rip Hamilton, Ben Gordon and Chris Wilcox.


    BINGO!
     
  8. fallenphoenix

    fallenphoenix Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    9,821
    Likes Received:
    1,619
    if everyone is healthy i think this would be a very good lineup
     
  9. Cstyle42

    Cstyle42 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2008
    Messages:
    22,703
    Likes Received:
    14,304
    Another scenerio would be this trade:



    Rockets trade T-Mac, Battier and Dorsey

    in exchange Heat gives us D-Wade, Q. Richardson maybe Haslem... if they want to keep Haslem or give him up it doesn't matter.
     
  10. Air Langhi

    Air Langhi Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2000
    Messages:
    21,941
    Likes Received:
    6,695
    1 team in the last 30 years (3%) has won w/o a superstar so it isn't likely.
     
  11. Dave_78

    Dave_78 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2006
    Messages:
    10,809
    Likes Received:
    373
    It's not as far off as people think. Winning made those players appear to be better individual players than they were. Those Piston teams didn't have Landry and Lowry off the bench either.
     
  12. wakkoman

    wakkoman Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2003
    Messages:
    2,935
    Likes Received:
    80
    Until the Rockets can get a PG the caliber of Billups, please stop citing the 2004 Pistons as an example of how you can win a championship without a superstar.

    It just isn't going to happen. Billups was not a superstar as far as recognition by casual NBA fans is concerned, but he played just as good as the other superstars in the league did.
     
  13. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    128,993
    Likes Received:
    39,475
    Perhaps Brooks?

    DD
     
  14. Dave_78

    Dave_78 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2006
    Messages:
    10,809
    Likes Received:
    373
    I don't think people realize how many special players we have. This roster is loaded with guys who have a beast mentality. Many teams would love to have just one or two guys with the mindset that almost every guy in our rotation has. They have talent too! Sure, it's not 2004 Detroit Piston talent but it's close enough that an acquisition or two could suddenly have this team standing eyeball to eyeball with the Lakers and Celtics of the league.

    Get a wing player who is efficient, aggressive at the rim and who knows how to move without the ball and a Center who can guard the post, block some shots and throw down a dunk every once in a while and this team would be scary good. No more Battriza combining to go 5/20 and no more panic button when Chuck Hayes picks up two fouls and we have to rely on Andersen to guard Dwight Howard.
     
  15. ColomboLQ

    ColomboLQ Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2007
    Messages:
    530
    Likes Received:
    2
    No but they had players like Mike James at his best and Memo Okur on their bench. They had talent everywhere.
     
  16. Alvin Choo

    Alvin Choo Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2007
    Messages:
    3,466
    Likes Received:
    152
    No. Rox still lack pieces. There is no go to scorer and someone to protect the rim.

    Its fun when there is someone different everyday that will pick up the pace and score 20 winning the game for rox, but its not fun when nothing just seems to click and rox get blown out.

    To start a fast break, its starts from a steal, a block or a defensive rebound. Other from steals, rox is still lacking on the other aspects.
     
  17. Dave_78

    Dave_78 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2006
    Messages:
    10,809
    Likes Received:
    373
    Mike James averaged 6 ppg in 20 minutes on 40% shooting for Detroit. Lowry is better than Mike James was. Okur was a solid backup but not on Landry's level.

    Again, I'm not saying Detroit was not more talented because they were but this team actually has pieces that Detroit didn't have and is in a position to add a few more.
     
  18. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2002
    Messages:
    38,176
    Likes Received:
    29,656
    I think some people get carried away by the surprising "success" of the current team. Don't get me wrong. I love this team and have not been so captured by a group of players since the championship years. But let's be realistic. We are 18-13, on pace to a season of about 50 wins. The fact that we feel so giddy about a 58% winning record just tells us how far away we are from being a contender talent-wise.

    As noted, the 2004 Pistons were the ONLY team in NBA history who won without a real superstar. But they had FOUR all stars. And most importantly, they had a great PG in Billups. I think Billups had been grossly underrated as a play maker until he came to Denver. Now we all realize how much of a difference maker he is.

    Unless Brooks develops into a genuine play maker (which is not very likely IMO), or unless Lowry learns to shoot (a little more likely), AND Yao comes back to his pre-surgery form, we are going to be a perpetual 1st or 2nd round exit team.

    Adding more good role players (even good scorers) won't make this team a contender. We need an elite-level play maker. I think Morey knows it. And I think that's one of the reasons why a TMac trade still hasn't happened yet.
     
  19. bjshot

    bjshot Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    912
    Likes Received:
    4
    Pistons didn't have a superstar, But all of their five starters were at all-star level. All Houston has now are role players, with very deep benchs, 9-10 player rotation. Some of them like AB,Scola, landry, TA maybe become a all-star, but not today.

    This team can make playoff, but will have no chance pass the 1st round. They will have no chance play the 7th game.

    I am sorry for this. TMac is the best chance let the Rockets advance in playoff. Coach RA might blow it. Let's see if DM and the owner are patient enough waiting the right one to trade for.
     
  20. rocksclo

    rocksclo Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2009
    Messages:
    110
    Likes Received:
    1
    I think even we dont have one know, if we ever make it to the finals, the Media will make one for us.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now