Can we have a serious discussion about Jeremy Lin?

Man, you want to seriously discuss about Lin but you are putting out nonsensical or illogical post after post.

You pick and choose games to fit your view. Beverley only had ONE playoffs game in which he had a significant impact. He didn't do much in Game 1 -- no one did. He played great in Game 2, and that's the game you pick. He didn't do much tonight. You blame it on foul trouble. And at the same time you totally dismiss Lin's injury.

You said you were in the game as if being there made you see more clearly than the TV camera. We all saw how the injury affected his movement. You are not helping in serious discussion about Lin because you are not putting out intelligent points and thus discrediting legitimate criticism of Lin's game.

 

cause you have to give it a go to see how you can do with the injury. He went out...saw he couldnt do much and got taken out. Again if JKidd is bench for poor play, you want me to blame him for a knick loss rather than freaking Carmelo even if he did lead the team in scoring and assists but threw the ball away twice and missed big ft's?

you cant win arguments with hippocrits like you because if he doesnt play you shout "he's not tough!! I expect more!!"

and when he goes out and plays with the injury doesnt perform you're gonna scream "well he's hurt, he shouldnt play in the first place!"

 

Here's the interesting situation with the whole Lin thing. He decided to go back to a team with a coaching staff that didn't believe in him enough to find a spot on the team last year. To me this could have been a big mistake by Lin and his agents. We'll see though. I think there might be a ton of internal back and forth between ownership, management, and the coaching staff over where Lin fits in this off season. You can probably bet Les is a Lin guy and Mchale isn't a Lin guy, but that leaves Morey. Where does Morey fall? It's going to come down to this. Morey is either going to be the guy that convinces Les that Lin doesn't complement Harden well or the guy that Les orders to find a new coaching staff with someone that can make the two work which is going to have to be someone who favors a more conventional positioning of players based on skill set. I also think that thinking James Harden can be this do it all type of player like Lebron and the type of player that always has the ball in his hands can actually hinder his offensive progression. I think it would suit James well to learn to play off the ball a lot more and hone his spot up shooting because he has good touch and great form but he expends so much energy cutting and slashing often with the single minded intent of getting to the free throw line. Also like Kobe and Mike he needs to learn how to post up a little and work the mid range game in order to make the other parts of his game even more deadly. It's going to take a lot of work.

 

This is hilarious. I watched the first half and Harden couldn't hit a bucket and had a hand in it as well.

 

Jeremy Lin 1-6 FG, 0-2 threes, 1 assist, 1 turnover, 2 points in almost 20 minutes.

-23 plus/minus on the court. BY FAR the WORST of ANYONE in the game. By FAR

So if the game starts with a score of 0:-23, its ALL Harden's fault for not pulling the team ahead? James Harden has to shoot 24 free throws to MAKE UP for that

(No it doesnt happen EXACTLY like that. But its just to highlight that Lin had a MEASURABLY BAD effect on the game)

 

? I never said he played well today. Once again you're making the argument to blame by all accounts in this thread an average pg over the franchise player.

Once again, this is the equivalent of a Knick fan going off blaming Carmelo for a loss and you come back with "well what about raymond felton and how bad he played!!!!"

DO you see how silly that is?

 

No one's talking about Beverley's upside? You obviously did not see the Beverley threads.

Yes, we should judge Beverley the same way we judge Lin, that is, WAIT AND SEE for another season.

They both have upside. Why do people say "Lin is what he is and Linsanity was a fluke," yet at the same time say "Beverley has better future than Lin"? Why?

 

30/8/6, 9-22 shooting, 2 blocks, 2 steals, 2 turnovers.

Harden choked in the last minutes but blaming him for the loss is a joke when he did everything out there tonight.

 

Wait. Harden in a 3pt game was net 0. Parsons in a 3pt game was a net -5 and asik a -13. I can guarantee you this that up until the point Lin was in the game all 3 of the guys +/- was way in the red just like Lin's was. Lin's only problem was he couldn't be on the floor during the surge in play. Those guys were afforded the luxury of being in the floor when the team actually started to play better.

 

I've been a fan of his since his senior year at Harvard. But I've been a Rox fan longer.

Lin is streaky player that can be set off on good streaks and bad streaks. But there's a striking pattern of when Lin goes on a good streak vs. when he stinks it up:

When there are low expectations of him where he's being counted out, he often goes off. Something about being the underdog that let's him play free and loose. To wit:
1) Palo Alto HS vs. Mater Dei in the California state championships
2) Harvard vs. UConn: one of the only legit programs Harvard played against NBA-level talent (30 pts against Kemba Walker)
3) Undrafted, coming off the summer league bench vs. #1 pick John Wall (played him head to head)
4) As a 4th string PG whose contract was likely about to expire, coming off the bench on a desperate Knicks team that had lost 7 in a row, precipitating Linsanity--which was objectively just craziness.

When there's a lot of scrutiny of him and high expectations, he shrinks:
1) Miami Heat game last year
2) Beginning of the year shooting slump after signing the big contract
3) First playoff game against OKC

I think he's not used to being in the established position since he's always been a bit of an outsider. He's much more comfortable when he's the insurgent, overturning low expectations of him. Being the 8Mil starting PG carries a bunch of expectations and a role that he does relish as much as other players that have more of a sense of entitlement. It's a bit of the imposter syndrome where he himself doesn't have the confidence in himself that he's worth the contract/position he's got. If he is to become a great NBA player, he has to move from the mentality of always needing the insurgent mentality to owning the established position so he doesn't have moments of self-doubt and implosion like we witnessed in Game 1.

That said, let's keep this post season in perspective. We were never supposed to even make the playoffs this year with how young the roster was. Certainly we had no chance as the 8th seed against the #1 seed. So for me the playoffs are really just gravy--a great time to develop our young players and to see who we should keep and who we should make available.

So the poor performance in Game 1 does worry me a bit. I do think that if he gets his head straight, becomes a more active defender, improves on his finishing, and keeps getting better at his 3 point shooting, he can outplay his contract and possibly become a legit piece to a contender. He's still young and I think growing into the starter's role next year may help him, but I do worry that he may never be able to improve in these areas.

If I think only from my perspective as a Rockets fan, I want every player to bring way more production than their salary. Lin's stats this year were about fair value for an 8mil/year PG. But I want this guy to exceed his contract, which he has yet to do. That's the only way you build a championship contender--with a bunch of players that outperform their contracts. So he should be one of our guys that should be shopped around if he can get us the right high value piece. My hope is that he develops into the top flight player we wish he were though.

 

you dont even think jeremy lin is any good so get over it!!
Here's some perspective. Remember when LeBron was not winning championships in Cleveland?? Well you're the guy that's going "dont blame the 30/5/6 guy...what did Boobie Gibson do today?!?!?!"

 

Read the post again. I'm saying that Morey and Mchale probably think Harden can carry a Lebronlike load.

 

Lin couldn't even lift his arm after the injury in game 2. In game 3, he was in an arm sling, and he was wincing in obvious pain every time he shot the ball. Who are you to say you don't think he was really that injured, or that his poor performance was not due to the injury? I bet if Lin didn't play in game 3 due to injury, being a LOH you would probably make this same post blaming the game 3 loss to Lin for not playing because he was too soft.

 

The way this thread is going it seems as if people expected us to beat the Thunder. Before this series, you could have gone to anyone of us and told us we'd be in the hole 3-0, and no one would have been surprised.

Lin played bad this series, but let's at least wait until the series is over before any serious discussions. The way I see it, the team OVER-achieved, so everyone, including the coach, gets a free pass for next season. If we are an 8 seed next season and down 3-0, then totally different story.

Also Lin's bad play this game did not lose us the game. You can go back and look at his stats and say things like "If Aaron brooks played more, we would have won" but we all know how pointless that is.

Bottom line, with a minute left, the game was there for the taking and we blew it. Lin had nothing to do with the fluke-y baskets that the Thunder made, and the 3 turnovers we did.

 

He gave you 82 games while recovering from surgery, wasn't 100% until feb/mar, played through multiple sprained ankles, and tried playing through this one but that decision back fired, and you're questioning his toughness?

 

Just about everyone sucked in game 1 and that's what happens to young teams. They usually struggle in their first playoff series, esp when they go against a #1 seed. Tony Parker, in his 2nd playoff season went 2-13 in game 1 vs the suns and then 1-7 in game 2.....sure he had some great games later, but he had some real duds too.

I agree he may never improve in every area that you mention, because if he does he's pretty much an all-star point guard if he does everything you say.

 

Give me a pair of those homer glasses you're wearing.