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CA Supreme Court Rules Illegal Immigrants can Have In-State Tuition

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by rocketsjudoka, Nov 15, 2010.

  1. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Contributing Member

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    Sure we can. Assuming that those who don't are arrested for tax evasion, we have an acceptable (but not bulletproof) rationale to claim those taxes have been paid.

    I wouldn't do it period, on principle.
     
  2. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Contributing Member

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    Does this really surprise you given the poster in question? He is a grand source of comedy though.
     
  3. Major

    Major Member

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    For sales and property taxes, how is this the case? There is no filing of sales taxes. For property taxes, illegal immigrants are almost exclusively renters, which means they just pay it as part of their rent. There is no tax evasion aspect to it - unless you're homeless and don't buy anything, there's no way to avoid sales/property taxes. There's no difference for those two taxes between a legal citizen and an illegal immigrant. The only differences would be with income taxes, where you do have to file and can functionally evade those taxes.
     
  4. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Contributing Member

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    True. And in states with a state income tax (like california) I would still protest this decision accordingly. I suppose Texas et. al. may be exempt from this conclusion, but I still think the concept is perverse.
     
  5. SunsRocketsfan

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    Umm did I blame the liberals? why did you bring up conservatives? It has nothing to do with conservatives/liberals but everything to do on how crappy this state has been run. From both conservatives to liberals from democrats to republicans.
     
  6. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Contributing Member

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    Of course not! Your intellectually pristine analysis of the situation in California is well documented!
     
  7. SunsRocketsfan

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    sure keep at the personal attacks...
    anyways I'll take that as a complement. Glad I can entertain you. Don't know about you but the reason I post and browse clutchfans is for entertainment. Some of you guys take things way too seriously and spend way too much time on here. Do you guys think your opinions/voices even matter?
    I really don't understand how some of you guys can spend what seems like all day on here. Maybe you are well off and retired but I'm pretty swamped with my ventures and startups and only browse over here when I need a break
     
  8. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    If California doesn't like it, the legislature can amend the law to require US citizenship. I'm sure the courts would have no trouble accepting it. I could see such a change even passing in Texas. It isn't the CA SC's job to make **** up to make the state do something the legislature obviously did not want to do.

    As for the law itself, I think it's likely a net benefit for the state. The increased cost of education on the illegals will deter some from getting their college education and they will enter the workforce as another generation of underqualified unemployable workers. They would produce less wealth with their labor and have less money to participate in the economy with. Being in a low tax bracket, they are likely to consume more in public resources than they pay for in taxes. Without college degrees they are more likely to work under the table, participate in a cash economy (and dodge taxes) and have less incentive to correct their legal status. And, since they grew up in California, they are morely likely to stay there and remain Cali's problem.
     
  9. SunsRocketsfan

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    Again unlike you I am not going to spend my life analyzing politics. I have much better things to do with my time. Politics is not my life and I have no interest in spending my life on it. I will admit I do not spend as much time on these issues like you and I dont want to. I have my core beliefs (mainly libertarian) and I'll stand by it but I am not going to waste my life away worrying about this crap. You can choose to ignore me and that is fine.
     
  10. bnb

    bnb Contributing Member

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    even with a college degree that whole 'illegal' thing might still contribute to an 'unemployable' status. :confused:

    i don't know how hard it is to 'correct' their status. i could tell you really bizarre stories about US immigration for people who've lived in the US for years trying to get a green card or citizenship. (these are people who were there legally under a work visa of some sort -- but wanted to change jobs, or otherwise change their status) -- but I guess that's a different discussion!
     
  11. SunsRocketsfan

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    Also just love it how you and samfisher seem to have so much time on your hands that you guys remember and then spend the time to dig up old posts. Not going for a personal attack but to me that just seems so pathetic. What do you guys do for a living? Live on these boards? Love clutchfans for the Rockets but this board is so insignificant. It's entertainment. I admit I am a casual poster and sometimes I'll just post statements for kicks...
     
  12. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Contributing Member

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    It took me about a minute. There is this cool thing called search.

    Ho-hum. The standard "I'm cooler than you because I don't take this so seriously; in fact, I take it so not seriously I'm going to post two consecutive posts about how not serious I am and how pathetic you must be" gambit. Yawn.
     
  13. SunsRocketsfan

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    I don't think I am so much cooler than you and you know what I apologize for what I posted earlier. I guess I just don't take this board as seriously as some others. My bad...

    Also I do not have the search or edit functionality. Otherwise I would go back and edit my two previous posts. Anyways guess it's about time I donate to the tip jar :)
     
  14. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Contributing Member

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    It's cool man.
     
  15. Major

    Major Member

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    And my point is that it has nothing to do with California - the courts and legislatures in all sorts of other states have the same position.
     
  16. Master Baiter

    Master Baiter Contributing Member

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    No they do not. I know because when I met my wife, she was here on a student visa and she had to pay out of state tuition. Once we were married and she was a permanent resident was she able to get in state tuition. Of course we didn't get married until she already had her degree. Later after we were married, we were planning on going to Italy and she wanted to take an Italian class. She went to the local community college and was able to get in state cost for the class.

    After going through this, I think it is complete bull**** that people that are here legally, like my wife was, have had to pay out of state costs while illegals would get now get in state costs.

    I do not have a problem with people coming to America but the way they are making it so easy for people that are doing it the wrong way and continuing to screw the people that are doing it the right way really irritates me. We had to jump through every freaking hoop. We had to pay a TON of money. If you want to make it easier for illegals, you damn well better take care of the people that are doing it the right way first.
     
  17. asianballa23

    asianballa23 Member

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    we're the only country in the world that treats illegals better than our own citizens if not the same. Thus US will always have the highest population of illegal aliens compare to any other countries, both currently living and invading.
     
  18. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    The problem that I see though with your argument that in state tuition should only be for (income) taxpayers is that CA in state tuition also applies to legal CA residents who are poor and pay no income taxes. Under your reasoning then should those people also not be eligible for in state tuition?
     
  19. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    I myself wonder how some people spend so much time here. The only reason I have of late is just because business is slow and even then I suspect my time could be spent in more productive pursuits. That said though I find this a rather lame defense. You posted a blanket provocative statement and the least you should expect is for it to be challenged. Rather than making a substantive argument you have ducked the subject and criticized others for spending so much time here. Now granted you apologized but I still haven't seen a substantive follow up on your point regarding CA..

    To get back on subject I presume you also lean state rights. In which case this ruling is completely in line with state's rights. The state of CA cannot enforce Federal immigration laws as that power is reserved to the Fed., that is why parts of the AZ law has been struck down. It can though decide how it runs its own university system. If the state of CA wants to give in state tuition to someone that is a state issue unlike immigration.
     
    #39 rocketsjudoka, Nov 16, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2010
  20. Major

    Major Member

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    This is the CA standard:


    The California Legislature passed the controversial measure in 2001 that allowed any student, regardless of immigration status, who attended a California high school for at least three years and graduated to qualify for in-state tuition at the state's colleges and universities.


    How exactly does this treat an illegal better than a citizen?
     

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