And the list is inaccurate: A lot of these guys actually play C for their team. Also, it is doubtful that guys like McDyess is actualy better defensively than Chuck. If somone is going to make that argument, he needs to give a basis for comparison and apply to each player. Otherwise, it's a bull**** list.
I would take Chuck's defense against any big, back to the basket, power forward who has post up game. I would take Chuck as the best help defender at power forward because of his quick feet and ability to set for the charge. The only area he is weak at defensively is against long face up players. He's just not tall enough most of the time against them. That's why I was okay with him sitting last night. Golden State does not have a post up threat. But against a guy like Boozer, you gotta have him out there. There is no better defender in the league against Boozer and guys like that. In fact, Chuck does a great job against Duncan. He keeps him off the low block and turns Duncan into a face up bank shooter (which Duncan is mighty good at). Overall, outside of KG and possibly Big Ben, I don't know of another defensive PF I would take over him. I would normally say Big Ben but he's looked like trash this year. I still think he's got something left so I may pick him over Chuck. Chandler and Camby are playing the 5. I'd take Camby over him in a heartbeat if he played the 4. I think Camby may be the best 4/5 defender in the league. He contests everything. Rasheed?? No way. McDyess???? He ain't even in the top 30 defensively. His teammate Maxiell is a better defender than he is. Chuck is a unique player because of his strength, and his penguin like body that allows him to get so much leverage on tall guys but still have the ability to help defend by moving his feet. He's also got the best pair of hands defensively. He accounts for just as many blocked shots as Camby by slapping the ball out before his opponent can even get the shot up. It doesn't go down as a block statistically, but it has the same effect. And we get all that for less than $2 million per. Look at what designated defenders like Battier/Bowen get paid. Hayes is a bargain. I don't care if he is a situational player. Heck, I don't care if Scola starts. But I want Chuck on my bench for those games when we need a guy to stop the opposing big. He totally goms up the paint defensively for the opponent. ................for less than $2 mill per. Can't beat that value. What do you think he could get on the free agent market if he could knock down the 16 footer??????? (I would bet he would make $10 mill +.) We get the defensive half of a great power forward for less than $2 mill. Sorry, great value.
i'm not the one riding chuck haye's scrodum lol. Top 5 defensive pf lol oh my god You need a reality check!
2007 November 1 Rockets - Jazz Carlos Boozer 13-25 16 rebs 30 points I agree with Hayes being our best PF post defender. I'd put him on low post pfs IF they start to tear things up. I suggest not using regular season stats for indication in the playoffs. They are different breeds of animals. Once Tim Duncan scored 5 points in a regular season game, it doesn't mean his defender can hold him to 7 points the next game. Can Hayes defend Boozer in the playoffs? I hope he can and will be interested to watch if two teams meet.
I remember that game. Chuck wasn't in the rotation first game of the season (JVG was using Battier at PF in game 1, because he wanted 3-point shooting at that position). JVG did put him in the game for a short while, and he definitely did the best job on Boozer of anyone. I actually recorded defensive responsibility for Boozer in that game in detail in this post, if you're interested. I'll reiterate: if Yao, Okur, and Boozer are all on the floor, Yao is going to guard Boozer every time regardless of who the other PF is. This rule applies for Adelman as it applied for JVG. And that decision has nothing to do with Chuck's defensive abilities.
ok it has been mentioned on this board that Morey believes Chuck is a top 5 defender in the post position It's on the tenth point or so down http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=141051 You can discredit the poster, discredit the interview, or even discredit Daryl Morey if you want. But there exists the idea of Chuck as an elite defender.
That's just your rule. Not Adleman's rule. You are not one of Adleman's crews are you? If you want to pass it as Adleman's rule, then provide proof. Just repeating your opinion doesn't make it Adleman's rule.
And here's more, from Jonathan Feigen: [rquoter](I don't think he is the problem at all, although I thought Scola should have played much more than he did in Boston and against New York. Hayes obviously he has the usual difficulty with Kevin Garnett and was overwhelmed by Zach Randolph. But most of the time, he does so many things people never seem to notice. Funny thing, I talked to two people I respect in the NBA yesterday, both former scouts now in management. I never mentioned Chuck. I was not talking about anything even related to him. Both gave me the usual long speeches about how much he brings the Rockets, the second going on for almost 10 minutes, most while I tried to stop him so I could get to the reason I called. I've always said that the Rockets are fine with him and Battier at the forwards, if Battier hits a good percentage of 3s and the guards help Yao carry the scoring load. That does not always happen. With Rafer rarely being unable to do that, it didn't work. Rafer has lately, though, and the Rockets have been winning. Obviously, if they could get someone to defend and rebound like Chuck, have the savvy in the lane like Scola and Bonzi and shoot from the perimeter, that would be better. But Karl Malone retired. -- Jonathan)[/rquoter] RudyT is also known to have been extremely complimentary towards him. Bob Hill, in a post-game last season, singled out Chuck as a player he really liked who does a lot for his team.
Alright, I'll put it this way. It is my opinion this is a rule that Adelman will follow, as JVG did before him. I think it's a matter of common sense, but obviously we disagree on that. If he ever chooses to assign Yao to Okur defensively and use a PF to guard Boozer, that view will be proven to be false.
Sigh, folks, common sense doesn't work all the time, that's why it's called common sense - the commoner's sense. Rick Adleman isn't a common sense coach, who would've thought he would put 3 rookies on the court in the same time in key moments of playoffs hunt? Did you?! If everything is followed by common sense, then we really don't need to pay coaches millions a year, just follow armchair coaches opinions then all will be dandy and fine.
Maybe common sense isn't the right word. Playing Brooks, Landry, and Scola together doesn't strike me as a terrible plan. All three have played well. On the other hand, willfully choosing to sacrifice the integrity of your entire perimeter defense to get a better one-on-one defender on Boozer doesn't register as a sensible decision. You're basically replacing a tough one-on-one matchup with an impossible matchup that endangers the entire perimeter defense (one less player to make necessary rotations to 3-point shooters or find shooters in transition). As I said ... if Adelman proves me wrong and does what you're suggesting at some point, I'd be absolutely shocked. And if it actually works, I'll readily admit I was wrong.
Chuck and Battier do about the same things for the team as far as intangibles go.... I like them both, but not on the floor together with Rafer....that is 3 very questionable shooters......not good. DD
LOL, you are one over serious dude. Look, you tried to pass it off as Adleman's rule by repeating your opinion. When I asked for proof, you resorted to common sense. When I rebuked common sense, you went to repeat your opinion. YOU are running in circles! You are only saying three rookie lineup works in hindsight, I wonder if you ever thought that Adleman would've done it in advance. Armchair coaches don't know what Adleman's thinks, that's why Adleman is making millions and we sit here typing. Excuse me if I don't want waste my time running in circles with your exaggerations and self made golden rule for NBA coaches.
I did not see the Jazz games but I have seen other games and I would not categorize Hayes as an incredible defender (he only played 24 minutes) Boozer had a 30 pts, 16 rebounds against Hayes at the start of the season, as I said before he is a good defender. From looking at the games played some PF has had good games against him and bad games against him. Its hard to blame him when a opposing PF does well or credit him when an opposing PF does bad because Hayes plays limited minutes (21.9) a game this season, and in our last stretch of 9 games prior to the DNP, where the Rockets have played well for most part (easier schedule) he is only averaging 18 mimutes a game. If Adelman felt he was an incredible defender he would getting more minutes like what Battier is getting (36 mpg). We can argue all you want but it does not matter too much cause Adelman is a more offensive minded coach. Under JVG because of his good defense, Hayes would get more minutes.
If you had half a brain, you would realize that Boozer wasn't guarded by Hayes. You would also realize that Yao does not guard Okur, and that Okur almost always plays poorly against the Rockets. Can you take a guess at who guards Okur?
Agreed. Yao can't be hanging at the the 3 point line guarding Okur and he sure as hell isn't guarding the Jazz SF or guards. Boozer is the only option for him to take defensively. I'm not sure why some people are having a difficult time understanding this. Yao is great but the Jazz series would have been a completely different story if this team had just ONE other guy who could guard Okur so that Chuck could pick up Boozer. When you are facing a team with two big men who are very mobile and can hit the jumper like a guard you are in deep doo doo if you only have one mobile defender among your PF/C. Unfortunately, that was our problem in last year's playoffs. It isn't a problem anymore thanks to Scola and Landry joining the team.
I am not half brained , what are you implying you did not read my entire post or what. I said I did not watch that game, I only watched the first game in November. I was told by another poster that Hayes gave Boozer the fits. I know under JVG, that Yao would guard Boozer and Hayes guard Okur. All I am saying is as much as I think Hayes is a good defender PFs have had good and bad games against us in the past, so I would consider Hayes a good defender and not an incredible defender.
