Clinton actually fulfilled 95% of his campaign promises. You have to go back a long way to find a better percentage than that. If you want a President who'll do well in policy, Clinton's your man... if you want a man who goofs on policy but probably won't screw an intern... Bush. Easy choice for me. Bush's argument that the scientific data is a complete farce. I've debated and read most of the extant literature on the subject, and only people being PAID BY THE FOSSIL FUEL INDUSTRIES really believe global warming is not a result of human activities. Carbon dioxide is most certainly the culprit. We *know* this. We also know that clean forms of energy are not MUCH more expensive than fossil fuels. Just have to provide incentive. I'm sick of our government allowing the power producing industries to externalize the costs for greater profits when all of society will pay the price later on. ------------------ Boston College - Big East -East Division Regular Season Champs Worst to First in 2001! [This message has been edited by haven (edited March 14, 2001).]
The best solution to pollution that I've ever seen was on The West Wing. Basically, make mandatory guidelines on emissions, but allow companies to buy and sell "extra" pollution. For example, if Company A reduced its pollution levels beyond the necessary levels, then they could sell the "extra pollution" to other companies who might not be able to reduce their emissions as easily. The price is determine by the open market. What this does is create incentive to lower pollution. If you don't lower pollution enough, you're going to have to buy the extra pollution limits. Companies who focus on on R&D and reducing emissions can then profit off of those companies that don't. Better yet, if not enough companies reduce their emissions, the value of those extra pollution levels increases (since demand increases), meaning the companies that do manage to do it are even better off. You end up getting the results you want while offering rewards for going above and beyond your duty and encouraging research in the area. (As opposed to people just going down to the minimum requirements) ------------------ http://www.swirve.com ... more fun than a barrel full of monkeys and midgets.
Without getting into a huge debate here, do you have documentation on that? I doubt any President in history achieved 95% of what he promised he would do, because it's just not possible. Clinton left a lot of promises unfilled, but like every president (past, present, and future), he just didn't talk about them, concentrating on what he did accomplish. On the policy part, it's Clinton's lack of an energy policy that created the problem. Also, he had 8 years, and obviously didn't put in place any policies to regulate carbon dioxide emissions. ------------------ Stay Cool...
On the policy part, it's Clinton's lack of an energy policy that created the problem. Also, he had 8 years, and obviously didn't put in place any policies to regulate carbon dioxide emissions. Just to clarify, he signed the U.N. Kyoto Protocol that's being discussed here. The Senate never ratified it, though. Without getting into a huge debate here, do you have documentation on that? I doubt any President in history achieved 95% of what he promised he would do, because it's just not possible. Clinton left a lot of promises unfilled, but like every president (past, present, and future), he just didn't talk about them, concentrating on what he did accomplish. This is something I don't think anyone can ever get an accurate read on, simply because Presidents make promises all the time, sometimes in little campaign stops, etc. There's no way to even tell what promises were made, let alone kept. With Clinton, though, I think a strong argument can be made that he (and Congress) came through on most of his pledges. The way to look at it is just look at the issues from 1992 vs. 2000: 1992: Economy, Health Care, Education, Welfare, Crime, Budget Deficit 2000: Prescription drugs, Tax Cuts, Social Security/Medicare, Education The fact that Crime, the Economy, the Budget Deficit, and Welfare are no longer high priorities says something about the last 8 years, whoever you want to give credit to. The fact that minor issues like Prescription Drugs get major play also says how many of the "top priorities" were dealt with. Health Care was the major failure in that bunch, and Education has made good progress, although there is still a long way to go. ------------------ http://www.swirve.com ... more fun than a barrel full of monkeys and midgets.
I guess the middle class tax cut would be in that 5 percent. Can anyone else name another broken Clinton campaign promise quickly so haven can get busy giving us 48 that he kept? ------------------ "There's a lot of things you can say about playing with Dream, but I get to say, `I played with the Dream.' That speaks for itself." --Walt Williams "****!" --Kenny Thomas [This message has been edited by TheFreak (edited March 14, 2001).]
that didnt affect me. thats his personal life. the enviroment on the other hand affects everyone. ------------------ http://www.democrats.com
I'm pretty sure that is the way it is for some types of pollution, at least in Texas. Two years ago I took a class where that system was discussed. It was implemented through a lisencing system, where a company was given so many credits of air pollution possible. I seem to remember that the problem was that there was a real incentive to get lisences for non-operational factories for the sole purpose of selling those credits to the heaviest polluters, who would buy the credits because it was cheaper than actually obtaining the emissions-controlling equipment. It was even more expensive for the smaller factories to buy the pricey, environmentally-friendly equipment, due to economies of scale. Of course compounding the problem is the fact that so many older companies are grandfathered in under the new standards and don't need to put up with any of this. ------------------
I guess noone's going to come through with that second, Freak. Clinton was one of the great BS-artists of all time, but he did the work (for the most part) that he promised he would do. His line of BS only strengthened his foreign policy. Foreign leaders actually respected him...something George W. can't say. Also, Clinton failed to pass a major health-care bill, but that was not for lack of trying. His bill was shot down in Congress. Too radical, it was thought. I find, overall, that all of you Clinton detractors hate the person, but can't find too many points in attacking the president. Your boy Bush is only proving to be a chip off the old block, as far as I'm concerned. ------------------ "One ring to rule them all, One ring to find them; One ring to bring them all and on the court unite them. In the land of Houston where the Rockets lie."
bush broke a promise...admit it people.. those of you that want to talk about clinton like 'timmy threw sand so i did' what kind of sh*t is that?...because clinton did does that make it okay or more acceptable? weak. ------------------ "no matter how good she looks someone... somewhere..is tired of her sh*t"
"I find, overall, that all of you Clinton detractors hate the person, but can't find too many points in attacking the president." exactly ------------------ http://www.democrats.com
btw great post jeff i actually agree with you jeff..right on..and i am a womanizing chauvanist..imagine that.. ------------------ "no matter how good she looks someone... somewhere..is tired of her sh*t"
Does anyone know how to get the catalytic converter out of a 1997 Accord? I already took the muffler off, which I hope increases pollution, but I believe in being proactive in doing my duty. ------------------ Pollution rules! Clean air sucks! I hope you're coughing, where ever you are!
I think you just did. Thanks: haven can now name his 48 promises Clinton kept before we continue. ------------------ "There's a lot of things you can say about playing with Dream, but I get to say, `I played with the Dream.' That speaks for itself." --Walt Williams "****!" --Kenny Thomas
I don't see this one as a broken promise. It's simply adjusting to deal with the conditions of an economic slowdown in the midst of an energy crisis that is completely understated. What I do see as a broken promise is the fact that Bush is not rescinding the orders issued by Clinton to swallow up land under the guise of protecting the environment. That concerns me. Hydra offers an intelligent, rational post here, and no one responds. He lives in Calif and says his energy bill has gone from $100 to $600!! I'm sorry, but right now, there aren't a lot of people who could absorb that kind of increase. Offering up more regulation right now is not the solution. Jeff, you say that companies will just retool instead of shutting down, if forced to meet new regulations. You're half right...in a market economy, who pays for that retooling. The market does...they simply pass the costs along. We all want clear air...but at the same time we all want the economy to keep chugging along..and we want to be able to go home and have heat, air conditioning and lights for our families. But make no mistake, those desires are at tension with one another. Ask the good folks of California what that feels like. Quite simply, you don't get something for nothing. Until the technology is developed for cleaner production, I'm not willing to make the sacrifices necessary for clear air...I simply couldn't afford the kind of rate hikes for energy that they're having in California...as the owner of a small business already subjected to an increase in my commercial rent and as a family man who finds my power bill on the rise again this morning. Sorry. ------------------
BK...use a sledgehammer and a chainsaw. After you're done, you can buy one of them newfangled gas guzzling SUVs. You know, so your friends at the oil companies can get even richer! ------------------ "Blues is a Healer" --John Lee Hooker
"You teach a child to read, and he or her will be able to pass a literacy test.''—Townsend, Tenn., Feb. 21, 2001 George Bush Jr.
I never said it would be easy but the fact is that we are burning ourselves out and fast. Energy companies like Reliant are using every bit of fossil fuel they can get because we all continue to waste it thinking it will last forever. They then raise the cost because it becomes more scarce. It is a vicious cycle that we can either deal with now or pay for later. At some point, we all have to be accountable for what we will leave to our children and grandchildren. Do we want air conditioning so badly (every day of the summer) that we are willing to plow through every natural resource just to have it? Must we drive our cars so much and demand one's so large that it wastes fossil fuels and pollutes our air to the point it becomes unbreathable? Think of one simple option. Houses that are retrofitted with solar panels can live WITHOUT power from energy companies. A house around 2,000 square feet can be completely outfitted with solar panels for around $20K and NEVER have to have power from an energy company again. Even a FEW solar panels can reduce the amount of energy significantly if builders would only choose to employ them. If we all truly want clean air, water and ground, we have to make sacrifices. We have to make choices that will create that reality. You either want no pollution or you don't. If you support the constant cycle of waste and spend, which is exactly what chemical and energy companies do now, than you don't have to change anything. If you want to save and conserve, you have to change how you think. We have to invent a new way of thinking about energy. Unfortunately, no energy company wants to change because it might cost them money. However, through our habits and regulations, we can force the changes. For once, those of us who don't need the heat so much or don't need the a/c that much or don't have to drive our cars because we could walk, ride a bike or take public transportation MUST do those things, not because we necessarily want to but because it is our reponsibility to not only help out the rest of humanity and the generations to come after us, but because we CAN. If all you did was turned your a/c up a few degrees, turned your heat down a few degrees, walked or rode your bike to the store or took a bus or car pool to work, you could save yourself and others thousands of dollars every year in wasted energy. I personally am guilty of running the a/c too much. No longer. This year, I've made a pledge to drive less (working at home helps), use less a/c and heat and bring the costs of my energy uses down dramatically. I have no interest in funding more Reliant price increases just so they can justify their bottom line. Their CEO is worth a couple hundred million. Let him sweat it out some too! The point is, if we think the California energy crisis is bad, wait until our natural resources are really gone. If we think it costs us alot to deal with energy problems now, wait until we are FORCED to make the change. If you care AT ALL about what this world will be like in 50, 100 or 150 years, you need to start thinking about it NOW. ------------------ "Don't waste it. We're here."
I'm all for cutting my utility bill, Jeff, so I went ahead and "done did" this-- but unless I'm balancing my checkbook wrong, I'm not saving thousands of dollars by doing so. Unless you wanted me to leave the AC and heat off 365 days a year...? Now, you and I will not live that long, but I'm willing to bet you whatever money you want at whatever odds you ask that by the time we run out of fossil fuels and the like, alternatives far superior to solar power and bike-riding will have been discovered and implemented. ------------------ Pollution rules! Clean air sucks! I hope you're coughing, where ever you are!
Ah, the ol' "things will be better someday." That's realistic. I'd prefer to be a little more proactive. Hell, even I'm not leaving my a/c off. What is ya? Nuts? This is Texas after all. ------------------ I live to make Brian Kagy's life difficult.
