Da Damn Outlaw--- What did I say to upset you? These are the beliefs I've had the whole time.... I'll go with the church so if they change their position on homosexuality I will too... Dude- You seriously wouldn't believe my school. I felt like an outsider because my family only had 3 kids... There are things you can do, like natural family planning (which is frowned down upon by some Catholics, I haven't studied it enough though to have a strong stance on it, I think its ok though), or you can just love having a big family.... my best friend comes from a family of 14 and she's the youngest! Embrace life man! I think you have an excellent understanding of peace. St. Augustine says, "my heart cannot rest until it rests in you (God)" One cannot have peace and happiness until they learn to love God. I truly do wish you piece (d'oh B-ob!) peace in all you do... We are all given things to struggle with in this life. Your burden is great, so I expect a lot out of you man! Oh, and contrary to what you read in Newsweek and Time articles, most priests aren't gay...I will admit that there is a problem in the average American diocescan seminary... but that is getting a little bit better now, some stricter Bishops are moving in.... I just had two friends go off to a monastery on Friday and we were checking out girls in a bar on last time before they became novices. They will never get to have sex with a girl their whole life, unless they do something bad or what not.... And again, I'm not trying to force you away from your style life. Thats your own choice man. I don't expect you to become Catholic or anything (all though those things would be pretty freakin' cool) but I think we can all benefit from having a deeper understanding of love, seeing how it is love that permeates existence and makes it that much more worthwhile to be alive rather than dead... find as much beauty and joy in a simple flower as you do in everything you do...
Hey I was in Roma for the jubilee year too! I studied at my school's campus there for a semester. It was the single most life changing experience I've ever had. Petrarch writes that one does not need to climb to the top of a mountain to have a change in them. I argue that that's good and all, but climbing to the top of St. Peter's really did enact an actual change in who I am.... breathtaking...
I'm upset because you said you supported civil unions on Wednesday and then totally reversed your position on Thursday. I just wish you could at least give it more thought than that. If you hold love in such high regard then why are you trying to stop people from expressing and celebrating it? Is there a right and wrong kind of love?
really??? I'm Christian, too...Protestant, though. Do you believe the church to be infallible?? I personally do not...there are things the church might very well support which I think God wouldn't be too cool with. just curious....
Yes, love for the rockets -- very good!!!! love fort the Jazz -- very very bad!!!!! -------------------------------- Sorry, I couldn't resist.
Is that the "official" catholic position? I´d think a majority of catholics didn´t share this view, but maybe that´s just me being prejudice against catholics.
The "official" Catholic position is that being homosexual is not a sin, but the homosexual act is a sin.
The majority of Catholics dont know everything that there is to know about their religion. Concerning being a Christian-a Follower of Christ its a very difficult narrow path to follow for the majority of us and we are bound by laws of the Church, concerning our religious life and morals as given to us by the Pope and his Bishops. We cant decide which ones we like and which ones we won't consider. The Pope is the representative of Jesus Christ on the Earth and is Infalable [Doctrine of the Church and the Morals of our life] . To be a practicing Catholic one organises ones life to stay on the narrow path by obeying the commandments of God and his Church. All this effort and prayer towards God is to try to place ones self and ones neighbours in an accepatable position of Holyness to recieve Gods Graces and through HIS Divine Mercy find just the right path to Heaven. Catholics Christians are most fortunate becuase they have the Sacraments which were given by Christ to his Apostles. (The first Pope was the Apostle St.Peter). Through the Sacrament of Penance and having given a full and true accounting with deep sorrow and firm resolve with a promise not to repeat the sins, a Catholic is cleansed of their sins and becomes enveloped in the Graces of God. Heaven is not only the goal of Human Life, its going to our natural home . Existence in complete harmony and love with the Maker of Life, the Sustainer of Life, The Light of Life. The Creator and Maker of all things out of nothing.The one God of all. There are other paths to take and we all decide which one we must take. These paths are leading away from Heaven and all of them dont have a positive ending. This is why Christians pray for enemies and 'all' of the Billions of Brothers and Sisters not on the narrow path, that they also might have an opportunity of being saved and that they might also go to Heaven.
ALTERNATIVE adj. Allowing or necessitating a choice between two or more things. Existing outside traditional or established institutions or systems: an alternative lifestyle. Espousing or reflecting values that are different from those of the establishment or mainstream: an alternative newspaper; alternative greeting cards. dictionary.com Well, then you deny who you are... you meaning the "G & L" community...... and guess what, you ain't the "establishment or mainstream." Just. Won't. Happen. Majority decides what whole gets. If majority decides against same sex marriage, then part of whole known as minority gets what everyone else in the whole gets. btw- the media is 2% of the population, but make up the majority of openly gay people... don't let the overplay in the news fool you... it's not "critical mass" gay acceptance time. Nature, i.e. natural selection, requires heterosexuality to keep the species going +which leads back to majority issue. And yes, I got married mostly for the financial reasons... 1) my family would look down on me "shackin' up. 2) so would my wife's family 3) We were in college at the time, both broke w/ no job. so yes, , we got hitched to be blessed with gifts and qualify for pell... was it greed? I wouldn't put it past that... doesn't any survivalist have greed towards the means of survival? We wanted our marraige to survive it's first year (been 7), so we followed "traditional or established institutions." I fell in love, however, for the fact that I felt love reciprocated. I don't think anyone's telling anyone who, or how to love. Marriage between a man and woman is a "traditional or established institution." The term "same sex marriage" is therefore a societal oxy-moron. Not saying it's the "reason" you're all seeking for "why not?"... But for lack of a better reason, that's the "why."
Rant all you want Iroc. Same-sex marriage can still be made a part of the establishment. You don´t seem to realize that being homosexual is not the same thing as having an alternative lifestyle. Does your hole life revolve around your sexuality?
Iroc it you apparently have never heard of a "vocal minority". You should take some time to learn how powerful a small group of individuals can be when they set their mind to changing policy supported by the majority of the population. Gays and Lesbians will eventually be able to have legal unions in the US it's only a matter of time.
Ah yes, the media isn't just "liberal" (sic), it now makes up the majority of the openly gay community! I always had a hunch about that Stone Phillips guy, and don't get me started on that queen Tom Brokaw. Legendary21, please edit your post. I don't want to know too much about anybody's "hole life" on this BBS.
Good post Yetti... Yeah I agree most Catholics don't know a whole lot about their faith... That was a good attempt to sum it up in a paragraph, if that can be done... I would have put a little more about the Eucharist in their and stuff but you seemed to sum it up nicely... Legendary, I really don't know how you messed up that post to have me saying that but thats not my quote.... outlaw, yeah there are wrong kinds of love, say if one falls in love with their appetites, becoming a drug addict or whatnot...
Do you really think the Catholic Church doesn't have arugments based on Theology and the Bible? I can't really believe you expect them to change their view of homosexuality after 2000 years of viewing it one way based on moral beliefs. What sense would it make for the Church to come out and say "Our bad, we thought all this time that homesexual acts were immoral, but you know, we've decided to be cool with it now." Why should I listen to anything the Church says if they just change their minds all the time to go along with the times? Hell, they might as well say that pre-marital sex is ok. The reason conservatives are supporting the attempt is because the Presidents' move is a pre-emption of a pre-emption. Any year now, some court (maybe the Supreme Court) is gonna come out and rule that homesexual marriage is a right. Personally, am not sure if I support it. If I knew for a fact that activists courts were attempting that scenario, then I would support it. If I knew they weren't, then I would be against it.
I have to stand by what the Bible says on this subject although I do not hate, dislike or judge anyone if they choose to do so. My pastor has always taught to hate the sin, not the sinner. As far as changing the law to allow same sex marriage, I can understand why certain groups would want this although I do not see it happening anytime soon Yetti - You refer to Peter as "Saint Peter", could you please show me in the Bible where he is refered to in this Title {King James version}?
Mr. Clutch, I actually don't expect anything out of the church... I was simply giving Catholics a hard time (dismissiveness b/c of their own difficulties lately). Instead, I'd suggest that we should let the church decide what the church will decide. If Catholics don't want to marry a man and a man, then so be it. The church should have a say in its own doctrine of course. I don't know the history of "gettin' hitched in the courthouse", but the state's role in marriage is seemingly secular. I'm not sure why they'd intervene in the ability (weird that republicans and democrats speak in the same language, but just on different issues) of two individuals to get married. incidentally, your response to my question about state rights seems to blow over the point of the question... that conservatives posit that state rights are these beautiful entities that should not be trounced upon by the federal government. I assume you simply don't respect state rights as much as other conservatives... or else you're just bobbing and weaving... "pre-empt a pre-emption" indeed. Why don't you just concede that state rights rhetoric is nothing other than conservative hogwash used to protect our country's racist South. If state rights are larger than that, then I wholeheartedly expect you to support Mass.'s ability to decide their own definition of marriage. Thanks in advance.
i'm guessing/hoping you don't really believe that. even if you don't agree with the concept of federalism, i'm hoping you don't think this is all there is to it. it really pre-dates those arguments.
