If KT committed himself to using his strength and physique to be primarily a banger and enforcer, one where he takes whatever offense falls in his lap and does the dirty work (like Najera) I don't think we would have traded him. Obviously Brand is the class of the banger/enforcers, but he will get the max so a S & T is the only way possible. Others... Brad Miller and PJ Brown are out of reach do to salary (unless Brown would sign for the MCE level--I would explore with him). I am interested in Swift, but he will not be a FA until 04. (same is true for Foyle) Guys we could give a try for less the MCE level include Skinner, Gadzuric, Baeteer (minimum only), Don Reid (min), & Ty Hill (vet min, which we have not seemed to have an interest). There are a couple more PF or PF/C FA like Clarke, Campbell and Ratliff (has a player option this year though) that I would not say are at all close to enforcers but nontheless could be interesting to talk with at around the MCE level.
Deuce - Some major differences. ALL of the players you listed made well below the MCE for the 2001-2002 season. What I derive from that is more a question of player ability than approaching the LT (with the exception of Clark who went to a team having little regard for the LT). By contrast, Campbell, Coleman, Lenard and Barry all make at or above the MCE now. It is not realistic IMO to expect any of them to go wanting for 2003-2004 especially since all but Lenard have Bird Rights. If you think Seattle will let Campbell walk to the Rockets for the MCE without matching the offer we will just have to disagree. They would be better served by keeping the two best of Elden, Potapenko, Booth and Drobnjak and dealing the other two to the EC. It is similar for for Philly and Coleman especially since ToddMac's career may be over and they have KT and KVH as forwards and are way above the LT level now.
You mean like a pubic hair, not sure what else either of them have over the other in that dept. Jon Barry is a great sub but will not get MCE money. He only got 3 mil/year when the gettin was good in the league for FAs and he was in his prime. I'd sure offer him a 2 year deal at 7.5 mil or 3 year at 9 though--he would provide a lot of intangibles this team needs (poor mans Danny Ainge).
This team needs a SHOOOOOOTER !! Either of the Barry boys will do, altho I prefer Brent. Every time I see him play, he's hitting a trey or two. Both of them would be super. Until we get someone who can hit the outside shot consistantly, the middle will be clogged & our offence limited to outside ISO's.
Gater, I don't think your scenario will play out. Why WOULDN'T Seattle let Campbell walk? They're rebuilding, and will not be able to trade Booth or James, because they have no tradeable commodities. As for Coleman, if Philly wasn't going to let him walk, they'd trade him at the deadline. I find it HIGHLY improbably that any of those guys makes 4.5M this summer, ESPECIALLY with such an overall rich FA class. Also, will we really re-sign Posey if he pushes us near the tax? I very much doubt it. If he makes those demands, we'll let him walk, and sign T-Mo to a small deal.
I agree with Sane. That's exactly what I was saying in my post. In terms of the Sonics situation, the Sonics were going to let Anderson walk for cap room anyway. They traded him for Campbell to add more bulk up front. but the Sonics are grasping for straws in the front court. They have a ton of mediocre front court players and some of them have large contracts that will make them tough to trade and get value back. Campbell just clutters up the mess. I doubt he will do enough this season to warrant coming back. There will be a number of decent role players available for the MCE this summer. And I expect some teams can still get 2 decent players with the MCE split. Chris
Cat + EG + Collier would be about 9 million, wouldn't it? Just about the amount of Brand's first year, right? And...and...the Clips could do it because if there's any team that's under the cap and need not worry about BYC implications, why, it's the Paper Clips...pant, pant....smack drool.... *sigh* But would we even entertain the idea of three max contracts on this team?
I think we'd have to make a bit more appealing for them..Something like this: Cato Griff Mobley for Brand Q Richardson Rooks (bad contract i think)
So because the Clips will be under the cap could they take on Francis+EG via a sign and trade for Brand+Miller, or is such a deal about a contract impossibility?
Wang ZZ is not a bad shooter. 44% FG and 41.4% behind the arc last year in Dallas. He is 7 foot 1 and 275 pounds. A team player with good fundamentals. He needs to improve his defense.
Trade accepted! Nice dream! FYI, the only way to get Brand this year is in a sign and trade. He is a restricted FA this summer and his agent has stated Brand will not accept any FA deals as they feel the Clippers will match the offer. Brand will take the one year deal Kandi took this year and become and unrestrcited FA next summer. The Rockets ONLY hope is to convice the Clippers that he is gone after that summer and that they better get something for him before he leaves like Kandi will do this summer. It would be great to get him, but doubtful. We can always hope however! Chris
Come on Chris, we're giving up way too much talent for it to be a "this or nothing" offer. Clippers are without a starting C. So basically, we're giving them a QUALITY starting C, we're improving their SG position by switching Q Richardson with Mobley, and we're swapping Rooks bad contract with Griff. That's not worth Brand? Really? I mean, Mobley is underpaid, Griffin is underpaid (rookie scale) and Cato is getting payed almost 2M less than the average starting C, and is getting paid only .8M more than the average NBA C (backups included). I think we're pretty much giving them a lot. A starter, and improvement in 2 areas. Hell, if they want, they can alternate between Q Richardson and Corey Maggette, and they can also choose between Rooks/Wilcox/Ely. One out of each of those groups. If it's capspace they want (hard to believe, but whe have the Clippers been believeable), then we'd gladly offer Rice in the deal somehow. Rice and Cato for Brand and Rooks? I think a deal can be, and personally I believe WILL be, reached.
Sane & Deuce - The Seattle "mess" isn't that bad. Drobnjak is a team option so that clears one player right away if they wanted. Second neither Booth nor Potapenko have huge contracts. Both are within $1.2m of the MCE. Both are tradable especially to the EC. Granted Booth's contract is long but he young and not expensive - he will never top $6.8m. There continues to be a shortage of serviceable big men in the NBA. Many teams with cap space need bigs - Utah, San Antonio, Orlando, Miami, Detroit and Denver all have the ability to offer $4.5m and above with no fear of the LT. Also, IMO the argument that the Luxury Tax inhibits MCE contracts does not apply to all teams all of the time. The Kings were above the LT and signed Clark. The bottomline is IMO still value. If you two don't feel that a player like Elden Campbell, John Barry or Voshon Lenard will command that money, we will just have to disagree. I will stand by my original argument - all of them are at or above it now and I don't feel that any of them are substantially overpaid.
Gater, I may be wrong, but if you have capspace, doesn't that mean you don't have the MCE? If you're below the cap, you lose the right to use the MCE, don't you? Anyway, I find it impossible to believe that they will clear Drobnjak. Right now, out of all those C's, he's starting and he's playing very well. He is MOST likeyly to be there next season. Again, I'm not arguing against Campbell's quality, I'm just saying, for Seattle mindset (Payton trade, C situation), I have to think they'll let Campbell walk. Teams will never offer anything to him in a sign n trade, they'll just wait it out. If they do offer a contract, Seattle won't match it, because they have no place for him and would rather use the money elsewhere. But this is just an isolated situation. My overall point is that, these guys will go eye-poppingly cheap, because over the last 2 years, the FA (2nd tier) class has been a small pool, yet few (if any) have recieved the full MCE. Right now, there is a ;arge pool of these players, a large pool of better players, and less money to go around. It's nothing we can resolve because we both have a unique and valid take on the subject, so I guess we'll have to wait and see.
Sane - That is my understanding. No double dipping. That is why I didn't use "MCE" with the teams I listed with cap space. They flatout have the $ if they have the desire (without LT concerns). The teams I listed could easily outbid the Rockets for any FA that both teams wanted. As far as Campbell goes, I just find it hard to fathom that a 10-4-1 experienced backup C can't get more than $4.5m especially since it can be for as little as 1 to 3 seasons. Same with Barry's skill level as a guard. Maybe I'm wrong...
It's true, but do you believe that teams will blow pure cap money on these types of players? Most of these guys, they've had their payday, and teams know that they will play for less to win.
