https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...border-patrol-desert-weapon-immigrants-mexico Again building a wall will not stop anything reform the current immigration policies will fix the visa problem as well as those coming over for the free.
Yes, that's the current talking points, but as I pointed out earlier in the thread, that wasn't the position Democrats took before Trump. You had prominent Democrats on record supporting physical borders and talking about how they'll do some good and help curb illegal immigration. Your new talking points are directly a result of "orange man bad" politics and that's why so many of you are doing the mental gymnastics required to oppose what is obviously a positive idea. Now sure, you can say building a wall would only be part of the solution, we'd agree even, but you can't say that it would do no good if you are being honest with yourself and not just giving in to "orange man bad" mentality. If it makes you better, you can rationalize being honest as agreeing with Obama's past statements and not agreeing with "orange man". Either way, this discussion could use a bit more honesty.
For me it's not about which President said what and when i have always believed that if the system was fixed there wouldn't be as many in the country removing them is impossible at this point the only way is to fix the system get rid of the free.
Is "orange man bad" Bobby's new "he said, she said" or "nothing burger"? So hard to keep up with his ever-changing catchphrases.
It's funny though that none of you guys spoke out against it when Democrats were seeking billions for physical borders.....you guys never called them racist for it. I wonder why that is? You were perfectly fine with it when it was Obama, Hillary, Biden, and Schumer pushing for it, but now that the talking points have changed, you guys act like it would cause the world to end. I'm just asking that you guys drop the faux outrage.
I fully expect all the 2nd amendment militia fetishists and JADE HELM!!! paranoids to be all over this. Right? This is their chance to shine!
Now the wall has to be built because dictators do like wall. It is symbolic. It is meaningful now. Give him the wall.
I'm not calling what the orange man is trying to do racist at all as i have stated before and will continue to say it get rid of the free and fix the system.
Well that's fine, but others in this thread have called building a border wall racist and Nancy Pelosi has called it "immoral" so since those hot takes are out there, I'm responding to them as well as you. When it comes to your position, I very much understand it, but you weren't bringing that opinion up back when Democrats were building and supporting the building of physical borders. Also, I don't disagree with you that the system needs fixing, but I agree with Obama that building a physical border will do some good and help stem some of the tide of illegal immigration in this country.
This is a legitimate question as I wasn't following this stuff back then... Back when the Democrats were supposedly building and supporting the building of physical borders, were you banging the drum to get it done like you are now? And other than that one tweet that showed that someone who is opposing the wall now (I can't remember who it was) was all for a physical wall back then, is there other evidence of the Democrats who are against the wall now previously supporting a physical border?
I too would like to see that i'm sure that it maybe true both sides play with other people lives and way of life.
I too would like to see that i'm sure that it maybe true both sides play with other people lives and way of life.
I supported it then as I support it now. I thought they should go further than they did, but the 700 miles they funded was a nice start. I've spent time near the border when I was stationed in Fort Huachuca which is in extreme southern Arizona Spoiler Just a map to show you where I'm talking about. Anyway, border patrol was constantly on the base and there was a steady flow of illegals that you'd run into on a nearly daily basis. It was obvious that without anything there on the border it was just too easy for people to pour into the country....even onto a military base. At the time all they had was a blimp rigged with sensors to detect when people crossed the border, but it was obvious that they needed more to do the job so I've supported a physical border for quite a long time now. As to the Democrats who supported building 700 miles worth of physical border, it was nearly everyone in the senate at the time, so Obama, Clinton, Schumer and 23 other Democrats in the senate and it passed by a vote of 80 to 19. So yeah, there was VERY little opposition to building physical borders just 13 years ago. Full disclosure though, while it passed the house 283 - 138, Pelosi did vote against it. I'm curious if Nancy Pelosi told Obama or Schumer that they were "immoral" for doing so....I'm guessing not. It's inconsistent to suggest that building 700 miles of a physical border is a good thing that will help and that finishing the job is immoral and ineffective. Either they were lying to everyone back then, or they are lying to everyone now.....but you have to pick one, and I know which one is the most likely.
This made me curious, so I went to the archives. I found this thread from 2007 when Congress was debating a compromise immigration bill: http://bbs.clutchfans.net/index.php?threads/proposed-immigration-bill.129795/. In retrospect, it's really too bad it didn't pass. The bill include several hundred miles of fencing, but almost nobody had much of an opinion on the fence pro or con. You'll also notice, though, we were also much more collegial then and didn't just call each other names.
Huh, not one mention of a $5 billion Mexican financed border wall between either one of them. What was your point, again?
