I will rephrase and manipulate my sentences to get very specific results in order to play out my agenda... The majority of Muslim countries that start with the Letter S have more problems than the few that start with T
Just getting some clarity. So you dont think Muslim Terrorists should be killed? Since you say No muslims should be killed, you disagree with the execution of Saddam, and you wouldnt give OBL the death penalty right?
No, that would not be like you saying that. Your comparison is flawed because in one case you argue genetics (not chosen), whereas in the other case you argue about membership to a religion/following an ideology (which can be chosen). I am not saying that extremism is "in the genes" of people who are Muslims, just as I would not say it is "in the genes" of Germans - in both cases, I would say it is not, at least not more or less than in anyone else's. If you want to compare apples to apples, you would have to compare ideologies, which I don't really want to do because comparing a horrible fascist ideology (Nazis) to a religion/ideology which certainly has many positive sides does not make too much sense to me either. But you and some others keep bringing up a comparison between Muslims and Nazis, which baffles me. So, anyway, while the Nazi ideology was basically 100 % bad and terrible, I would not say the same thing about Islam. All I wonder is if there are some elements to Islam that make it susceptible to being abused, and if some of it is based on its roots, its core (the Quran) and in need of reform.
Your posts are just stupid. Other posters at least try to address the issues, you just make immature posts. Are you the same person as asidd1990? That poster was similarly stupid. I am against the death penalty in principle, which is why I disagreed with the execution of Saddam. But if killing Osama would help at all to prevent future terror, I would not mind personally. Anyway, either you are playing dumb or (what I suspect) you are. Obviously, what I am saying in response to your stupid question is something very obvious, that nobody should be killed or in any other way harmed because of their religion, be it Islam or some other religion. To deduce from that that I would have said "no Muslim should be killed and OBL should not be killed" is just plain dumb.
You're completely missing the point. I'm saying take anything, religion, ideologies, genetics, IQ, shoe size, or weather....the major cause of any extremism is environment. A 100 years ago, Islam was present and unchanged and there were no terrorists or extremists. I'm interested to know why you think there is a difference from the then and now. If it's not environment, then what is it?
"Environment" is too much of an easy excuse. Islamists have fought expansionist wars before in Islam's history (they are not the only ones who have done that, but it is not like Islam's history is all peaceful). Saying it is all "environment" conveniently frees Islam and all Muslims from any responsibility. While this reflects the general attitude of most islamic posters here, I don't think it is appropriate. Who created that "environment"? All external? What about their own responsibility?
Its crazy how annoying "stupid" and immature posts can be. Just a taste of your own annoyingness. And your closed questions that you pose to trap other posters. To deduce is just plain dumb... Thank you, and that is exactly what you have been doing all your career on CF. ALL OF MY CRAZY DUMB POSTS ARE IN THE NAME OF AroundTheWorld.
And what makes you say that? Turkey has been becoming more secular each year, are you against that? Turkey has been fighting PKK terrorists from northern Iraq for quite some time, are you against that? ATW is unfortunately trending in the wrong direction... again.
I recommend the linked excellent article by Professor Bassam Tibi (a Muslim) to you. Erdogan and Gül are crass Islamists, and Erdogan is a dangerous populist, too. http://www.meforum.org/2047/islamists-approach-europe
Absolutely. I thought you and I had already decided to agree that every country would likely be better off with a secular government.
That's a fair question. I think Islam does have some elements that make it susceptible to being abused. I think every religion does. Any time something can be used to divide people and make one group think they are superior to another group, it has the potential to be abused. Unfortunately, this is the nature of religion. Pretty much all religious groups think they have some insight into the truth that others are lacking. I think the reason we're seeing a lot of extremism among Muslims now is because Islam happens to be the dominant religion in certain parts of the world where a lot of people have really *****ty lives. The elite in these regions want to use the masses for their own ends, and everyone knows that the promise of some eternal reward is a strong motivator for a lot of people, especially those whose lives suck.
There is an Islamophobia in Europe, in particular after 9-11, and people who are not educated, they do not distinguish, and they equate Muslims with Jihadists with Islamists. And we need here some education. -Professor Bassam Tibi (a German)
I agree that it's not ALL environment. But most of it is. And in no way is anyone pardoning anyone's responsibility. Bin Laden is just as responsible for terrorism as Hitler was for genocide or any other figure or idea in history that got people killed. But change the environment around and do you seriously believe that the results would be the same or even similar? Now both of us can sit here argue all day but there's no empircal evidence for one way or another. We're all too busy b!tchin about the present to really go back in history and learn our lessons. Terrorism is the favor of the month.
I cannot really blame people for being suspicious of what look to be Islamists, because it is not only 9/11 - imagine you being a Londoner and commuting every day to work, and a bunch of trains get blown up by Islamists...same in Madrid. I read a statistic today that more than 50 % of Brits equate Islam with terrorism. While that is a sad statistic and education is necessary that Islam does not equal terrorism, moderate Muslims should also think about how to improve that perception - have they done enough to do that?
If people have the perception that black people are lazy and commit crimes, is it up to successful blacks to work hard to prove that wrong? Does any group - religious or ethnic have a responsibility to defend themselves against what others in their group may or may not do? I am not sure. I think it would help. But if a bunch of people said who I was...was some kind of criminal or terrorist - that my beliefs which I held dear and brought me joy - which is part of my heritage and family - if someone attacked that as being less or criminal...my first reaction would be to think they are an idiot - not that I need to go out and prove to them that's not the case. And sadly, the burlington coat factory mosque was just about that. It was moderate muslims trying to make a statement against extremists and showing the world the true side of Islam. They have worked hard to build bridges. If I were a Muslim...I'd be ready to just give up on trying to persuade people of anything. You're dm'd if you do and dm'd if you don't.
There are about 500 threads that I have seen SJC/ATW derail, troll, and abuse posters in. If you don't understand the sarcasm/cynicism behind my posts, please don't bother responding or quoting me. It's fun giving him a taste of his own medicine... P.S - Stop sucking up to ATW. You dont have to "please" him, it just supports his agenda...
Your weird obsession with me is slightly amusing. As to the "taste of my own medicine", you clearly lack the intellectual capacity to do any of that.
I think the poster has shown exactly the types of deceptive techniques you engage in when posting. You word questions to get the answers you want to hear. You misinterpret other users' posts. You are, for lack of a better word, intellectually dishonest.
