Aw c'mon brehs don't do that. We're just a couple of fcking idiots talking **** on a basketball forum, don't make it personal guys. We're not bad people, Tilman, Manchin and Sinema are bad people.
As a independent who voted for biden this past election its progressives like you that make me realize why I never label myself as a democrat. You'll curb stomp him? Lmao you folks are so hilarious and delusional. Manchins family owns WVY and he was hugely popular as governor. The last Justice dem that tried to primary him in 2018 got his ass kicked and he was well funded. Theres no leverage biden or ANYONE has over Manchin. Its hilarious watching how literally how stupid progressives truly are and their lack of how a democracy works. Manchin allows you to steal a senate seat in a state Trump won by 60%. He lets to confirm judges. He lets you pass nomination. Its hilarious watching morons yell at biden for not eliminating the parliamentarian like he can convince Manchin. Progressives literally just live on cloud 9 pretending everything is a hypothetical situation. You have idiots like this Lets piss off Manchin purposely 6 weeks in biden administration in a 50/50 senate LOL. Theres a reason no progressive will ever be in the white house. ZERO political smarts
You are confusing the importance of Joe Manchin's vote with the merit of his ideas and decision making. No one here is ignoring the importance of his vote. We are discussing the merit of increasing the min wage to $15. If you can't differentiate between something so simple, then we are fine with not inporessing you.. Is How Manchin's going to personally read this and get offended? Is that what you are worried about? You are right. He owns WV and his state has one of the lowest median wages in the nation with some of the worst opioid addiction rates, poverty rates etc in the country. A "proggressive" might not sniff the White House or have its legislative agenda passed not because of a lack of "political smarts" but rather the signficant undue influence of corporations on our legislative process that places signficant resistance to that type of change.
As expected the parliamentarian ruled against including the minimum wage increase addition to the COVID relief bill for reconciliation. It would've been a real stretch to try to include that. Further if Harris overruled it that might endanger getting the bill to even the 50 vote threshold. It also pretty much would mean that reconciliation would end up being used for all sorts of things. While I understand many here would like to see that next time the GOP is in charge of the Senate you could see them doing things like adding anti-transgender legislation or late term abortion bans to budget bills. There is a very good argument to increasing the min. wage but I don't think the COVID-19 relief bill should hinge upon it. As other posters have noted this should've been taken care of already. https://thehill.com/homenews/admini...in-senate-parliamentarian-ruling-but-respects Biden 'disappointed' in Senate parliamentarian ruling but 'respects' decision BY MORGAN CHALFANT AND JORDAN WILLIAMS - 02/25/21 09:27 PM EST The White House said Thursday that President Biden is “disappointed” that the Senate parliamentarian ruled a minimum wage increase could not be included in a coronavirus relief bill, but said the president would respect the decision. “President Biden is disappointed in this outcome, as he proposed having the $15 minimum wage as part of the American Rescue Plan. He respects the parliamentarian’s decision and the Senate’s process,” White House press secretary Jen Psaki said in a statement released Thursday night. “He will work with leaders in Congress to determine the best path forward because no one in this country should work full time and live in poverty,” Psaki continued. “He urges Congress to move quickly to pass the American Rescue Plan, which includes $1400 rescue checks for most Americans, funding to get this virus under control, aid to get our schools reopened and desperately needed help for the people who have been hardest hit by this crisis,” she said. The statement makes clear that the White House will not look to overrule the decision by Senate Parliamentarian Elizabeth MacDonough earlier Thursday evening to nix a provision to increase minimum wage to $15 per hour included in the $1.9 trillion coronavirus relief bill. White House chief of staff Ron Klain said on MSNBC on Wednesday that Vice President Harris, as president of the Senate, would not try to overturn the decision if the Senate parliamentarian decided the minimum wage could not be part of the bill. The decision Wednesday evening represents a significant blow to progressives who saw the minimum wage increase as a critical part of the coronavirus relief proposal, which will face a House vote on Friday. Democrats have moved to pass the relief bill using budget reconciliation, which allows them to pass a bill with a simple majority in the Senate. The parliamentarian ruled on Thursday that the minimum wage provision did not meet guidelines needed to move forward with the upper chamber’s reconciliation process. Still, progressives called for Harris to overrule the decision after the Senate parliamentarian’s decision Thursday. “The Senate parliamentarian issues an advisory opinion. The VP can overrule them—as has been done before,” tweeted Rep. Pramila Jayapal (D-Wash.), chairwoman of the Congressional Progressive Caucus. “We should do EVERYTHING we can to keep our promise, deliver a $15 minimum wage, and give 27 million workers a raise.” “I’m sorry—an unelected parliamentarian does not get to deprive 32 million Americans the raise they deserve,” Rep. Ro Khanna (D-Calif.) tweeted. “This is an advisory, not a ruling. VP Harris needs to disregard and rule a $15 minimum wage in order.” “We were elected to deliver for the people. It’s time we do our job,” he tweeted. However, the development may ultimately make it easier for the measure to pass in the 50-50 Senate, where moderate Democrats like Sen. Joe Manchin (W.Va.) have been cool to the idea of an increase to a $15 minimum wage.
And his constitutes dont give a rats ass if he helps with the opiod crisis or not. Look around you and see the political climate were in. Its 99% all about culture wars and Manchin is the ONLY democrat with a chance of wimming. Biden cant even force Manchin to vote for Neerda and somehow hes going convince him to overturn the bryd rule LMAO. Its impossible having any sort of debate of a progressives. No doubt they're full of good ideas that we can all agree on but have ZERO political will to do anything substantial then whine and b****.
Well, this should fit within Senate parliamentarian rules. They got 1-2 weeks to get to 50 yes. “In the coming days, I will be working with my colleagues in the Senate to move forward with an amendment to take tax deductions away from large, profitable corporations that don’t pay workers at least $15 an hour and to provide small businesses with the incentives they need to raise wages,” Sanders said in a statement.
Dems have to have political cohesion like the Republicans do. You can give me the story about how your an independent and I make you ashamed to vote Dem and everything, I don’t know why you label yourself or assume I’m a Dem, but I won’t get into that. By curb stomp I mean to leverage their political power to ensure they vote with the party on the bill. I’m 100% with you and Jiggy fly I wish it wasn’t like that, I wish senate wasn’t a non partisan group of 100 people who honest to god represented their constituents to the best of their ability but that’s not what we’re dealing with. We need Chuck to be Mitch for the Dems, we need Biden to use his power and approval to push the blue dogs. Biden is a classic moderate, establishment Dem, we’re in the middle of a pandemic, the leadership that preceded him was showing dangerous levels of authoritarianism and disrespect for democracy... it’s really important that the Dems have their **** together, and get this bill for pandemic relief done without a Dem senator or two sabotaging the party and Biden’s presidency.
Don't confuse political will with corporate influence on our legislation process. Or is the revolving door a conspiracy theory now? Manchin and Sinema don't want it in reconciliation AND don't want to end the fillibuster meaning that 60 votes is required to increase the min wage which means it's dead on arrival. How much you want to bet it's not going to get done?
There's no corporate influence for manchin. Have you liberals ever thought some people may just be fiscally responsible without being a corporate shill? Manchin sincerely believes minimum wage shouldn't be 15 in WVY and there's not a damm thing any democrats can do . Work with the process. It's funny how liberals pointing the finger at Harris like she can somehow overturn it without all 50 votes. Progressives are clueless. What's funnier is if bernie would've been elected president he would have had same bullshit if not much worst. No moderate democrat in the senate would even listen to bernies proposals . The liberals forget we have a congress. The ONLY thing that matters in American politics is having power . Plain and simple
https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nyt...tive-ties-to-family-64717.html?pagewanted=all Seems like the revolving door to me buddy. If his ideas are based on principle, then does that make his principles correct? I can disagree and express my disagement on Manchin's "principles" and his insider stake in the coal industry. Manchin has always been the wealthiest kid in the neighborhood and his education is business administration undergrad, the official "I just need a degree" major. He was then handed a job in his family's business. He isn't a scholar of economic systems and the effects of minimum wage nor does he understand the struggles of living off a low wage so I don't care for his opinion. I still acknowledge that he has a key vote and that's a sad state of affairs. Did I offend you by desecrating the nobility and honor of Joe Manchin?
Not sure why you included me. But anyway... Yes, some may just be fiscally responsible although I would argue, hell no given the multiple big $$$$ packages since Covid and prior. The more likely case is being sensitive to the group that voted them in. Manchin's would have gone forward with $11 in 2 years, but not $15 in 5 years (if the Senate reconciliation process allowed it, but since it didn't...). $11 in 2 years with inflation adjustment might as well be $15 in 5 years and is politically safer for all. It's a good compromise in my book. The process allows what Bernie is doing now - suggesting a taxing method that should go through the process if he gets enough support (50 yes). I disagree on if Bernie is President... You can argue that Biden won on a diverse coalition and so he needs to be careful and govern as such (progressive don't like or want to face that reality). If Bernie won, he would have done so with less of a diverse coalition and he can govern with more aggressive progressive policies and would get more support.
I think proggressives are extremely aware of the immense uphill battle to get any proggressive legislation done. It seems like mere advocacy for these policies is marred by people as entitlement and not being pragmatic about its viability in being passed.
The whole concept of something like a 11 dollar hourly wage looks more asinine when you just consider someone working for an hour even doing the most mundane task. Imagine someone told you to move boxes from point a to b for an hour which requires zero skillsets and just an ability to pick something up and walk, it would be considered an insult to think their time was worth 11 dollars. But it becomes magically acceptable when it's 40 hours of work at 11 dollars an hour. It's just insulting to human labor.
Just because hes taken alot of money from that industry doesnt mean that he still cant hold his own independent views. He has more pressure back home from BIdens executive actions targeting drilling then he would have by any pressure dems can put on him for not supporting BIden. Im not protecting Manchin by any way but im not a moron and I understand how the senate works. Im not going to attack the guy at a time where the GOP are trying to lure him in any way possible. Its bad politics and BIden and his team arent fkin morons. They aren't going to put him in a spot where he has to choose in his caucus. As a democrat the solution to the problem is by electing more senate democrats and DEMS have a good chance at that in 2022. Look at what happened in 2016 with all the bernie morons who didnt vote. Trump nominated 3 supreme court justices and now they will control the upper body for decades. You think a conservative supreme court would allow medicare for all? Good luck overturning citzens united. Good luck overturning gerrymandering laws in Red states.Progressives NEVER think ahead and always focus on whats good for them today. Im a small business owner in Indiana and texas. I have a store front in Terre Haute and a store front in Houston. I have 6 employees that have been with us in Indiana who have been with us for years. Im in a business where my products are tied to a fixed priced and Its impossible for me to raise the prices (medicare products that have low margin). Raising minimum wage to 15 would simply force me to downsize. Forcing small business at a time where unemployment is 10% to raise minimum wage is the dumbest idea in the world. Im all for making publicly traded companies pay 15 an hour but forcing small business to do the same is going to lose you alot of voters. Alot of people in America work for small business not just for money but as dignity and as a hobby. You'll be displacing millions of those same workers you are trying to help.
