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Beyond 400

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by rimrocker, Nov 15, 2003.

  1. FranchiseBlade

    Supporting Member

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    I know you aren't really serious with this, and I don't know if that makes it better or worse.
     
  2. Woofer

    Woofer Member

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    Just use the Republican tactic, change the question -
    When's the last time a conservative honestly grieved over the death of American soldiers in Iraq and did not use the occasion for political opportunism?

    Never, chickenhawks never die, they never sign up, but are only too happy to sign up other peoples' children.
     
  3. Rashmon

    Rashmon Member

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    If you read TJ's posts as comedy, as I do, he is hilarious. Believe it or not, he's one of my favorite posters.

    He's like LHutz's savant brother...and it wouldn't surprise me if he isn't laughing at you for taking his comedy seriously.

    Now for some gasoline...

    I think that if Jimmy Carter or Bill Clinton were still in office, we could have ended this war already.
     
  4. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    (or Al Gore) we would not have been in this war in the first place and we would have finished the job in Afghanistan.
     
  5. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    There is no draft.
     
  6. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    Then he would be criticized for something demographic or political about the one he chose and lambasted on all the ones he overlooked. It's just not a practical consideration unless he has some personal connection.

    You all would run him up the flagpole for his opportunism on the coattails of tragedy. It's a no-win situation.
     
  7. RocketMan Tex

    RocketMan Tex Member

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    LBJ did.
     
  8. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    You are wrong.
     
  9. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    Details please. How about Kennedy?
     
  10. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    How so? I don't mean to imply that every single living soul who is a Bush critic would scathe him, but the majority of his critics give him credit for almost nothing and seize or manufacture opportunities, both large and small, to criticize him.
     
  11. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    But other Presidents who did visit the families of slain soldiers were immune to this?
     
  12. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    Hell, I'd settle for just some real acknowledgement that there are soldiers who died. He only makes veiled references in his speeches to "sacrifice." If you want to avoid the family thing, you could always pick a day and welcome the caskets back home. I don't expect him to be Clinton, but a bit of decency would be nice.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    Of course, Clinton only did that for politically motivated reasons.
     
  14. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    This does seem to be a new era for piling on politically...
     
  15. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    Your Clinton photo is more analgous to Bush visiting Ground Zero in New York.


    "I don't expect him to be Clinton, but a bit of decency would be nice." WOW. The guy is a certified skirt-chaser.
     
  16. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    The other thing that is being completely overlooked is the military's well-known dislike of Clinton and their appreciation of Bush. How does that square with these criticisms?
     
  17. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    Let's remember that Les Aspin resigned, in the most part, for not sending more troops to Somalia. Now we have this. Somebody ought to walk the plank... (and why not much publicity on this?)
    ___________
    Army used copters known to lack defenses


    By Dori Meinert
    COPLEY NEWS SERVICE

    November 15, 2003

    WASHINGTON – For 18 months before it was deployed to Iraq, a combined Illinois-Iowa National Guard helicopter unit reported to the Army that most of the unit's helicopters lacked basic missile defense systems.

    Despite that, the Army sent the Chinook helicopters to Iraq and used them in missions.

    "There is clearly a dispute about the information that was given from the Guard to the Army before mobilization," Sen. Dick Durbin, D-Ill., said yesterday. "I cannot understand how that unit can be activated with only three of 14 helicopters properly equipped."

    Since at least October 2001, the Bartonville, Ill.-based Guard unit had reported that 10 of its 14 helicopters lacked basic missile defense systems, a spokeswoman for the Illinois National Guard said.

    "We clearly reported it and showed the unit's deficiencies," said Lt. Col. Alicia Tate-Nadeau of the Illinois National Guard. "The information was there for them to view."

    She was responding to the suggestion made this week by Army officials that the Guard unit had misrepresented itself as ready for deployment to Iraq, setting off a last-minute scramble by the Army to find missile defense systems for the helicopters just before they were shipped out from Corpus Christi, Texas. Several of the newly acquired systems, however, arrived damaged.

    Six of the unit's 14 helicopters flew for three months without the basic anti-missile protection system, Army officials told Durbin in a private briefing Monday. One of the helicopters was shot down Nov. 2, killing 16 soldiers, including Staff Sgt. Paul Velazquez, 29, a former San Diego resident. That unit had the basic missile defense system, but not the more advanced system that regular Army and some Guard Chinook helicopters have.

    Durbin had requested the briefing after receiving several e-mail messages from Guard members in Iraq contending that they didn't have the same equipment regular Army helicopters had received. Durbin said Army Col. William Crosby suggested the state National Guard might not have had the money to equip its helicopters with the ALQ-156, a basic anti-missile protection package.

    But Guard officials contended that funding was not the issue. The missile defense systems are within a category of equipment that must be bought directly by the Army, Tate-Nadeau said.

    "Not only was the unit's hands tied . . . (but) the Illinois National Guard as an organization, our hands were tied in that we could not use any discretionary dollars that we had to buy that piece of equipment," she said. "It's not like we said, 'I can buy 300 backpacks or one of these.' "
     
  18. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    Poor Ole Dubya, can't go visit any families of slain soldiers because his wittle feewings might get hewt by the bad wiberwals. :(

    :rolleyes:
     
  19. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    That a majority of military folks votted for Bush in 2000 is true. The percentage will not be as high next time.
     
  20. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    This is so dumb. Do you know how readily they could identify a family who would be supportive of a presidential attendance at one of these funerals?
     

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