which weird. He has talent but he will Only be useful on the team built around his weakness and where he is the 3rd best player. Which seems like a lot of work for Something that still isn’t optimal. sure if we get him for a steal great… but other than that ♂️
If I responded to you here, I would be repeating myself. So that's pretty much the end of our conversation on this. I have no new things to say. Let me just add this. It's not just Simmons wants out, which you seem to be focusing on. Everyone in Philly wants him out. I am quite sure that if this thing didn't blow over like this, Morey would have quietly shopped him. Simmons's future in Philly was doomed before Doc opened his big mouth. Giving him that humongous contract was clearly a mistake. And Simmons's attitude rubbing the whole team the wrong way even before all those comments came out made it inevitable that he would be moved. So it's not about Simmons wants out. It's about they want him out. Doc made the stupid comment that tanked Simmons's trade value making it so much harder to trade him. And the ensuing escalation just made it worse and worse.
Well it worked itself out because Durant decided he was going to leave anyway at the end of the year. It definitely could have worked itself out but I wonder and think Durant was gone any way since he had nothing left to prove there. Draymond was wrong for saying that of course and then it seems like based on that interview never really made a real intent on making it right and blamed the organization for getting in the way of it all while saying (during that interview) that they didn't do enough. I'm not really sure what his value is tbh because all rumors are of Morey wanting the absolute most for him, wanting not only future picks BUT good young players, these are not deals that will get done because only like 3 guys in the NBA are worth what Morey has been asking for, reportedly. I'm not really asking anyone to feel sympathy for him I'm just pointing out how bad what Doc said and Embiid and I don't think poor play gives them excuses to thrown Ben (or any other player on the team) publically under the bus like that.
Well we just agree to disagree. We have no idea what goes on in that lockerroom and I'm not going to pretend like I do but its clear both sides don't like each other very much. I just know what was said publically and from who and just because one teammate or two teammates come out against a guy doesn't make him a bad teammate, could just be bad team culture, just like what happened here when Harden was on his way out and with other star players.
This is semantics to me man honestly, most people took what he said as bad at the time and even the ones I'm arguing against said it was a dumb thing to say. He could have said any other thing. "We're going to have to go back to the drawing board but he's definitely a player we can win with," anything but that. Then the star player gets up there and is asked when the team loses the game and Embiid, after stumbling and not wanting to say it clearly...puts the feet at Simmons. He knew it was wrong to say that's why he was reluctant to say it, but it was said. Also, here is a report from a Philly reporter...the issues with Simmons or what made the whole thing worse... It's also never helped that according to reports way before this, Ben and Embiid never really liked each other much...now I know the thing to do here for people is to just side with the better player but personally...it is what it is, who knows whose in the wrong for that, it is what it is... But I think Doc handled that wrong. I think Embiid handled that wrong. I think Ben is completely in the right to want out of that situation. Doesn't like Embiid, reportedly, the two never got along really and now doesn't like the coach...and oh, not the first time Doc has drew the ire of players, so people can judge that how they like. I mean we can really sit here and make a whole thread of players that don't like Doc Rivers...including two Rockets Legends Josh Smith and Chris Paul...I'll let people make of it what they will, personally, I think Doc is the worst coach to ever win a title easily. If it weren't for all those solid vets he had on that Celtics team he'd be mostly known as a mediocre at best coach.
Pft! Lol, the only fan remark is always funny to me, I'm no 99er but I been here since 07...I just don't care what the trend is and will always be honest about my opinion. If 95% of the board thinks Simmons is trash it will have 0% impact on my opinion. I'm sure it annoys people but whatever. I'm respectful...most of the time.
It's pretty simple unless a player is shut you down Dennis Rodman style or anchor the best defense Gobert style then you shouldn't be making the max if you can't shoot. Guys who can't shoot are situational role players at best. Simmons got paid solely based on his latent potential which we all know is on the level of Giannis/Lebron but so far he has shown he is wasting that potential. What the Simmons Stans fanclub here always forgets is the mental makeup of that person. If Simmons had that Mamba attitude he wouldnt be in this situation. He also wouldnt go to Wimbledon with his GF and flex all his cars when Philly ran hin out for being scared to shoot.
If you're the 76ers head coach, after getting eliminated in the playoff and reporter Dave asked the same question, what would you say?
"It takes a team to win a championship so it's not about one guy but he's definitely a championship player, we just gotta figure things out as a team, that's all."
The question was if Ben should be a guard on a championship team. This kind of political answer, Doc gave on Ben all year long. In a moment of honesty, he stopped covering for Ben.
Of course, Sixers would want a "fair" price. The guy you are defending just signed a super max or whatever and suddenly forgot how to shoot free throws and dunk on top of his known previous faults - a fact that you seem to want to ignore. If they don't get a fair price, then they are out of contention for four years over a guy who ostensibly promised them to make nice with Embiid and play up to a max player potential when signing his contract. We got rid of Chris Paul at a similar point of his respective contract and now have to pray for who knows how long that rookies pan out. The front office (which rightfully includes the marquee top-10 guy that leads that team) chose to show some public displeasure (and then deny it afterwards) to induce changes. For all you know, Simmons might be even more offended if those things were said to him in private, but directly. We don't know what these players prefer and should give benefit of the doubt to Rivers who's been in the business of handling players' egos for some 20+ years. If Simmons wants a public punishment of a coach, per your tweet, he is pretty much asking for the coach to be fired, because it is unreasonable at this point when the lines have been drawn. His response to people questioning his post season vs regular season drop off (after losing game 7) was "it is what it is" and "I'm not going to let you say that" - definitely not something that you'd want your top player you just signed to a long term contract to say.
So give it one more time but it clearly caused a big rift between player and coach or more of a rift and made the situation for Ben untenable. I'm just going to say this...Doc's bad history with players is a lot longer than Ben's is. Feels like the noly guys that actually enjoyed playing for him was that Celtics team. CP didn't like him, ran away from him, Doc's own words was that he couldn't even coach the guy anymore. PG/Kawhi didn't like him. Kawhi openly was screaming at him that one time which is rare for Kawhi to ever show proof that he's a human. Oh and then Doc blamed the players for the failure there...after blowing another 3-1 lead... There's a bunch of lesser players that don't have nice things to say about him and here he is again scaring a player away from a team. According to Doc he was also the reason Ray left the Celtics too... But maybe he's in the right this time or maybe he's just really bad at managing NBA players and saying silly things like this. He doesn't owe the press honesty, not if it's going to hurt his team at least.
Yeah...I definitely disagree with the bold. Outside of one place...and even in that one place Doc blames his own self for Ray's departure and letting things get out of hand...Doc is terrible at that...and according to a few Clippers players...mainly the top two guys, a bad X and Os coach too. Seems to cause locker room issues wherever he goes and scares away a star player or two just to be sure...and if you're the magic scare away Tim Duncan before you can even have a chance to get him. I really feel like Doc is a bad coach, mediocre at best, and I know actually most of this forum agrees with that because we were terrified when his name popped up to replace MDA. Not that this situation is completely on Doc, I don't think Embiid and Ben liked each other much, not sure why that is, not my business...and the last coach couldn't get the most out of Ben either although I don't think it got personal like it did with Doc, but Doc's a huge issue. I'm sure once Ben leaves and they flame out in the playoffs again Embiid will be looking elsewhere and so will Doc who can lean on that Celtic team to land another job. Hopefully not here. Maybe Doc can blow a 3-1 lead...again. But I agree, the lines have been drawn and maybe at that point Ben just wanted to get one up on him...or maybe thought it was fair since he felt he was insulted in public and thus wanted a public apology, but the Sixers had been shopping him. I feel like Doc has tried to make up for his comments and the team has but it's obviously too late for that now. Sixers should try and get the most they can of course...but made a lot harder now, I'm not forgetting Ben's poor play, I just said I don't think it should factor in to how they treated him I guess.
With the load that Embiid had to shoulder I would be pissed too. They literally lost two series when they could have gone to the finals because of Simmons. He didn't balk at taking the max money and accountability comes with it. Simmons has talent but not being able to shoot crippled his team badly. Everything else was there and Philly will never have a better shot. I don't see how anyone wouldn't be frustrated and tired of taking that crap.
The bottomeline..... Simmons is the type of person, who after having an embarrassing playoffs, isn't going to be accountable. All the Doc comment reinforced with me is how weak Simmons is. Build a team around that? LOL.
At some point you just need to understand it's Simmons. He hasn't put in the work to improve his game and that's why his team/ his organization feels the way they do. Nothing worse than being entitled and unable to produce.
