The problem with the CCP is, first and foremost, accountability. There's nobody to account to, and if you say the people, well, that's what propaganda is for, so that the people don't know when the government screws up. China needs more transparency. Economics growth is very nice, and to me that's the only thing sustaining the CCP for now, but sooner or later the government won't be able keep the engine known as China from reaching its full potential. There are still too many state-companies which prevent China from bursting forth.
If there truly was no accountability, China would be just like Cuba, North Korea, or old Iraq. Pure dictatorship. But it's not. Just because it's a one party system doesn't mean its leaders aren't being scrutized. Just as the Republican and Democratic parties have various factions and beliefs, so does the communist party. And those at the top must can easily be replaced by others within the party. I believe that in a perfect world, the American government structure is superior to China's. But from a practical standpoint, after looking at both countries first hand, I find that they're more alike than most people can imagine. And the accountability issue is just as much a problem in America as it is in China. Or there wouldn't be so much complaining in the D&D.
What does that have to do with anything? I think the title is misleading, should read "Beijing to jail dissident for 11 years". From the article it says the guy was recently convicted.
It has to do with your nonsense reply. The was sentenced to 11 year jail and you are telling me the time hasn't started on Liu. Well thanks for pointing that out, Mr. Chicken little.
My problem is that Western diplomats are two-faced snakes. They take any chance to denounce China and then they try to get their corporations in for the cheapest labor and try to establish new trade links that entrench the CCP. Their words are empty and useless and the CCP knows this. National pride is tinting my glasses a bit, but I just don't like it when people are hypocrites.
Yes China is in such a desperate need for more transparency, yet somehow us sitting across the ocean here in the good US of A are all China experts. They're sure keeping their info tight.
There are certainly insincere criticism toward China. For example, you have seen various types of it in this very thread. I don't pay much attention to them. However, for me, this is not about China against the world at all. I see incident like this one as an issue for Liu and the Chinese people only. I welcome constructive external pressure such as the one made by the state department. Is west hypocritical? Maybe. But I don't think a trade embargo against China would help the issue any better. So I can take a little hypo criticism as long as the criticism is well-meaninged and try not to get side tracked by the hypocriticism.
Interesting thread. It will be interesting to see when China will have a Glasnost. Is China a one party state or really more of a dictatorship? I don't follow it much. Granted China is developing well economically and a lot of people are content to let it be repressive. Why does China have to be so threatened by a few dissidents if they have not much support. I think the US policy of engagement towards China is about right-- as opposed to the stupid blockade against Cuba and our Middle East policies which are distorted by our blind support of neo-cons in Israel.
It is a one party totalitarian state that is akin to a political system obsoleted in the West several hundred years ago. China is unlike other dictator's countries like North Korea or Cuba such that there is certain level of democracy within CCP. Also I think most of the CCP bosses at the top are good intentioned in terms of advancing the country not just their personal agendas. Basically I think what China is now politically is an evolution from its empirical past. The underpinnings of CCP's political philosophy run deep in China's tradition core of running a state, and some of them can be traced back to Confucius. So CCP is not your stereotypical political dictatorship. However, the CCP's political ideology are increasingly facing challenges in this day and age and often run afoul with Chinese's basic human rights. Just like China's economic system 30 years ago, China's political system is backwards and incapable of resolving some of basic problems.
Again, you are way off base. Slavery have nothing to do with political figures like Liu or Debs. Jailing people like Debs created stability in US politicals and government. I'm sure the Chinese have their plans for the future, so why have them ruined by people like Liu? BTW, Liu has not been jailed for 11 years, he was sentenced to jail for 11 years. Big difference.
Debs was arrested and convicted under the espionage act of 1917 for obstructing draft. Liu is arrested first w/o charge and convicted of "inciting to subvert " state power for publishing his manifesto on the internet. If one can categorize "political crime", these two are not comparable and I don't know why you bring Debs up. Your point of political stability is a brainless overreaching statement for any tyrannical government can jail anybody under the name of political stability.
In an alternate reality where you might have had half a brain, the province of Taiwan had its fair share of dissent jailings (along with massacres, propaganda, alteration of history) over the years. Unfortunately for morons like you, the CCP does not have a monopoly over such things. Actually China is a one party AUTHORITARIAN state, not that I'd expect you to be able to tell the difference. And those "obsoleted political systems in the west" were some of the most efficient, competent and often, legalist systems that ever existed in the west. Incidently the rise of democracy eroded the efficiency, competence and economic prospects. This part is just funny, I think. Either that or it is so completely sad. Authoritarian governments have existed ever since humans have been around, even before their later evolutions. They have been just fine for much of history before suddenly someone decided they have some inalienable rights without which a state/country/civilization would collapse into a dark abyss, doomed to failure. Well excuse me for a moment, when did such human privileges turn into human rights and how come we were fine without them prior? China's political system incapable of resolving some basic problems? Well well, so America's/Canada's/whatever's democracy is perfectly suitable to solve those same problems? News to me. All things considered, the CCP have not done too badly at all.
Yet again we see those who predictably, and rather instantly, show up to whine about how unfair it is to say anything critical about the Chinese government and its actions against the people who are brave enough to (gasp!) say something the government doesn't like. We see the same responses from the same people here every single time. One would think that a country of 1.3+ billion people, with an ancient and storied history, wouldn't have such an inferiority complex, as evidenced by the paranoia of its government to any dissent, and those here who share, in my opinion, that same paranoia. Get over it.
Um, you do know that Debs was arrested and put in prison during a presidential election? THat had nothing to do with political or government stability, just pure coincidence. But he was the poster boy of the socialist movement and during and after WWI there were a lot of governments that went down in flames, but mostly just monarchies.
Lol, clutchfans in-house political etymologists strkie again. I demand you show your diploma. I feel sorry for your inner struggles. The best cure for you might be living in a true authoritarian country like Singapore where man gets whipped for chewing gums.
I have a lot of respect for Justice Holmes but I don't agree convicting Debs was justified even though it might've been more substantive than Liu's "crime" This goes back to my first response that wrongs committed by US don't mean China is also entitled to committing wrongs. You brought up the political stability point. You have to show me evidences that Debs' conviction contributed to the great achievements of this country.
I can't tell if you're referring to authoritarian or totalitarian governments, but the latter which is what I think you're to were never exactly efficient powerhouses. None of the totalitarian states were anywhere as efficient as that of the democracies, which is why they fell apart. Authoritarianism on the other hand depends on the rulers, and authoritarianism under an excellent ruler can be superior to democracy, but depending on that is of course mildly iffy. I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "fine." Humans were alive back during the reigns of kings and tyrants, but life back then was hardly a great thing, even for those at the top.
