They were granted immunity as long as they told the truth. The info was sealed and not susposed to get leaked. I wonder if they will catch the person who released the info. IMO MLB needs to take a stance on steroid testing. During the last labor negotations MLB backed down on testing and now there going to pay for it. Dont stop here, go out and get to the bottom of this and put a real program together.
Where do you get 10 percent? Did Ken Caminiti get an extra 10 percent? Caminiti told SI that he began using steroids midway through the 1996 season after injuring his shoulder while playing third base for the San Diego Padres. Then 33, Caminiti had never hit more than 26 home runs in a season. But he hit 28 alone after the All-Star break that year, finishing with 40 homers, 130 runs batted in and a .326 batting average. All were career highs, and he was a unanimous choice for the MVP. http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/si_online/special_report/steroids/ Btw ... bnb, is that sig from a children's story? We have a book at home that says that. I noticed you have a 2 year-old, so maybe so.
The 10%? Made it up! (though i do remember reading something to that effect at one time). Point is...steroids do give you an advantage...but Bonds has been so much consistently better than even his juice-up colleagues, that you just shouldn't dismiss his talent. Giambi didn't put up Bonds numbers and he was juiced too. The sig? Yup. "Where the Wild things Are" -- or something like that. That's pretty much the extent of my reading these days...Newspapers...BBS...and kids books.
That would be a big fat NO... There are probably a lot more guys that juice up, but we'll never know unless something like this happens to them... Sad...very sad for baseball... * is coming...
Would Bonds have been as good without using steroids? No. Would Barry's head be so big without growth hormones? No.
so how do y'all think fans will react to all of this? i don't think many people thought bonds was innocent as it was and yet people still came out to giants games to see barry hit. and booed when he got walked. and as much as he still isolates himself, he's become so awe-inspiring people root for him it seems. now that it's official he was doing steroids, is he gonna get booed everywhere? will he get the kind of support pete rose got a few years back before he came out with his book and turned the public against him? hell, on espn they just had a poll asking if you would take steroids to make the millions of dollars athletes do and it was split 50/50. 50% basically said they would do the same as these guys. i think people will still make a huge deal out of bonds passing ruth and eventually aaron. if bonds wasn't on roids what would his stats be? it's clear he was going to get to 500 and at least 600 homers by now. hell, give him back all those walks and even with a decrease in his HR/AB ratio he's still way up there. he'd still be a 600/500 all time guy with massive numbers. it's not as if there's an asterisk on his whole career. and as far as people acting like this whole era of homers is b/c of roids, that's ridiculous. it's not the steroids era, it's the "oh, that's what a weight room looks like" era. the whole league isn't on steroids, the whole league is more built than ever. and that's the single biggest reason people hit more homers. maybe some of the records wouldn't have fallen* (although mcgwire was just waiting for a healthy season to break 61) but the overall homer trend would have been way up. and i doubt it'll ever come back down unless baseball does something to make guys leave the weight room. *maris' record may have fallen in 2001 anyway. something was clearly different about that year. barry 73, sosa 65 i think, luis freakin' gonzalez 57 homers. the whole league didn't start juicing for one year but homers for the top guys went way the hell up.
haha, no kiddin. i wish i wasn't so out of the loop on baseball - because this news really doesn't excite me. i'm just worried about the NHL lockout - but at least they're startin negotiations again. i mean, 6 months ago it was "will the NHL survive todd bertuzzi"...2 weeks ago it was "will the NBA survive Ron Artest"...this week it's "will MLB survive giambi/bonds"...honestly - they need a new story line - something without players being corrupt or something.
I've never understood people pointing to Luis Gonzalez as an example that players are on steroids anyway. Even during his amazing homerun seasons, Luis was never anywhere close to as built as the other guys in the discussion. He just hit the crap out the ball that season.
As for did he know, c'mon... The guy said he trains five days a week and watches everything he eats, then how is it possible this one training fact slips past him. "I'll just start putting on this topical cream tho I have no idea what it is or what it does." I don't buy it. It doesn't add up. He knew. The guy was a user. The only question is how much did he use. I think Guys like Giambi, McGwire, Caminit, Bonds, all prove that steroids make a difference. I mean we had 4 MVPS and all of them used body enhancers. What more evidence do we need. I believe the added quickness is what makes the difference. The power helps too. Shame. What to do? If I were Bonds I would retire if I knew in my heart that I used a significant amount. If I used maybe once or twice then no big deal. But a long time user. Retire. The gig is up and you could tarnish the whole game. Not worth it. Be a man and do the right thing. As a commisioner I'd let him play on, but never put him in the record books if steroid use was banned during that time. I'm not even clear on that fact. But if it was, elminiate those seasons in which he was a user. A compromise would be to remove his steroid home runs from the books. But even that is a sticky thing. I wonder what Willie Mays and Hank Aaron are thinking right now. I'd love to hear what they have to say.
I've gotta disagree here, Max...Cheating is cheating, regardless of who else is doing it. * or even straight-up deletion from the record books?
one of the more fascinating mysteries is that the Giambi story broke before Bonds. Almost a day or two before. Yet both stories conceivably leaked at the same time.
What's the penalty for other forms of cheating, like a corked bat? I know Sosa got like 8 games for getting caught with a corked bat! You get caught ONCE with a corked bat, and you're out 8 games! They need to kick Bonds out of the league NOW before he breaks any more LEGITIMATE records.
This is America folks. This thing will blow over in a matter of months and Barry will run down the babe and Hanky with us watching closely and following it with above average interest. We here in America forgive and most importantly forget so easily. So baring any major major shoe dropping again before ST next February, the baseball body and Barry's people will force us to look the other way and we will. I have no qualms with Barry. I had my little suspect for them all including Mcgwire, Sosa, Jason Jiambi, Jeff Bagwell, Kevin Brown, Shef etc. But I have little problem with it because baseball officials in this country refuse to do anything about it especially the player's union. If I get tired of watching I will quit. According to MBL, Barry has been tested randomly in the last two seasons and he has been found clean. I trully believe Barry's output and production has more to do with his God given ability than performance enhancing drugs. So far I have not seen steroids or any other performance enhancing drugs for the cornea. PS. Despite the concensus that using certain steroids in baseball is illegal, I still have not seen one transparent study saying that it helps you play better baseball. Please if you have seen one let me know. Just my 13 cents
how are you going to have a study on if steroids help you play baseball? purposely let 100 guys juice and make sure 100 others don't, let them all play an MLB season knowingly cheating, and then compare? yeah. and steroids build muscles. muscles make you stronger. being stronger means you can swing the bat faster (or use a heavier bat but i'm sure most would go for faster). swinging faster means you get to wait longer before swinging. waiting longer means you can lay off bad pitches or find out where hanging curves are going. this means you can crush the ball more often. this means you hit more homers. oh, and plain swinging the bat harder means the ball goes further b/c of that whole momentum thing. there's a reason brad ausmus doesn't hit homers like jeff bagwell. b/c he isn't as strong. and of course having a good eye helps. barry has had an insane eye his whole career. but i could have the best eyes ever but if i drag my bat through the zone so slow i'm having to swing before the pitcher lets go of the ball, it doesn't matter. combine amazing eyes with roids and you've got superhuman. and i thought they tested in 2003? or was it testing where they couldn't do anything to you. actually, i'm pretty sure that was it. if bonds was taking them then it seems like there should be some positive samples lying around. it's not like them being confidential will keep them from being leaked or anything.
