I guess that's why Sports Illustrated didn't list him, because there is no debate. I guess they are just incorrect.
It's not like they haven't been wrong before. Incidentally, for those wondering why they chose 8, it is because they could title their article "8 Men In" as opposed to the movie named "8 Men Out". Bagwell may not have made their list of 8 and it's hard to argue with those they included but that does not mean he is NOT a first ballot HOFer. The real question is what abourt Rafael Palmeiro? He could conceivably end up with 600 HRs, 3000 hits and a .290 career average if he can play 3 more years (not out of the question as a DH). Regardless, he should definitely hit 550 with 2850 hits. It seems he has posted high, consistent numbers with little notice.
First and Foremost First-ballot Hall of Famers with year inducted, primary position, ballots cast and votes received -- listed by BBWAA voting percentage: Player Year Pos. Ballots Votes Pct. Tom Seaver 1992 RHP 430 425 98.84 Nolan Ryan 1999 RHP 497 491 98.79 Ty Cobb 1936 CF 226 222 98.23 George Brett 1999 3B 497 488 98.19 Hank Aaron 1982 RF 415 406 97.83 Mike Schmidt 1995 3B 460 444 96.52 Johnny Bench 1989 C 447 431 96.42 Steve Carlton 1994 LHP 455 436 95.82 Honus Wagner 1936 SS 226 215 95.13 Babe Ruth 1936 RF 226 215 95.13 Willie Mays 1979 CF 432 409 94.68 Carl Yastrzemski 1989 LF 447 423 94.63 Bob Feller 1962 RHP 160 150 93.75 Reggie Jackson 1993 RF 423 396 93.62 Ted Williams 1966 LF 302 282 93.38 Stan Musial 1969 LF 340 317 93.24 Jim Palmer 1990 RHP 441 411 92.57 Brooks Robinson 1983 3B 374 344 91.98 Ozzie Smith 2002 SS 472 433 91.74 Christy Mathewson 1936 RHP 226 205 90.71 Rod Carew 1991 2B 443 401 90.52 Frank Robinson 1982 RF 415 370 89.16 Al Kaline 1980 RF 385 340 88.31 Mickey Mantle 1974 CF 365 322 88.22 Sandy Koufax 1972 LHP 396 344 86.87 Eddie Murray 2003 1B 496 423 85.28 Dave Winfield 2001 RF 515 435 84.47 Bob Gibson 1981 RHP 401 337 84.04 Ernie Banks 1977 SS 383 321 83.81 Walter Johnson 1936 RHP 226 189 83.63 Warren Spahn 1973 LHP 380 315 82.89 Willie Stargell 1988 LF 427 352 82.44 Kirby Puckett 2001 OF 515 423 82.14 Joe Morgan 1990 2B 444 363 81.76 Willie McCovey 1986 1B 425 346 81.41 Lou Brock 1985 LF 395 315 79.75 Jackie Robinson 1962 2B 160 124 77.50 Robin Yount 1999 SS 497 385 77.46 ********************************* This is a list of all first ballot hall of famers in the history of Baseball's hall of fame. Absent from that list, although it is ridiculous that he is, Jimmie Fox, a first baseman who won the triple crown, batted over 300 for his career with over 500 home runs. There are only two first baseman on the list, both have over 500 home runs for their career. First base is a power position, and Jeff Bagwell, even though he's hurt by the Dome plays in an era of juiced up stats. Right now he's not a first ballot Hall of Famer.
And "Right now" Alex Rodriguez is not a first ballot hall of famer. In other words, If Rodriguez's career ended today he would not make the hall of fame.
Except that if he retired right now, he'd be the best National League firstbaseman ever - and one of the top five first baseman of all-time. And better than both Murray and McCovey - the two first ballot Hall-of-Famers.
Now you are just being silly. Better numbers than Murray, and McCovey has over 500 home runs playing in a pitcher's era.
Am I? Murray didn't get on base at nearly the clip Bagwell did. For his career, Murray posted a respectable .359 OBP, against an opponents average of .328. This was a respectable 109% of the competition. For his career, Murray slugged .476, against an opponent's average of .399, 120% of what his opponents put forth. That's a nice career. Combined, we outperformed the league by 129%. McCovey got on base at a .374 clip for his career, compared with .326 for the league. 115%, that's good. McCovey hammered the ball at a .515 clip, the league managed a paltry .388 at Candlestick. 133% - damn that's good. Combined, he outperformed the league by 148%. How about Bagwell? Playing the prime of his career in the Dome, Bagwell put up an incredible .414 OBP, while opponents struggled to a .336 clip. 123% better than the league. I won't even mention that on-base percentage is a lot more valuable than slugging. But Bagwell's slugging is not to be trifled with - he has a .551 SLG%, compared to the robust league figure(even deflated by the Dome, as it were) of .417. 132% better. In total, Bagwell was 155% better than the league was. Better than Murray and Better than McCovey. But hey, maybe like those two he should hang around till he's 42 and barely a useful player so he can get some arbitrary milestone that people can parade around.
on espn's frontpage they have neyer's 12 picks for the hall. surprisingly he has biggio making it and bagwell missing the cut. catchers: piazza and pudge infielders: alomar and biggio outfielders: bonds, griffey, henderson, sosa pitchers: clemens, glavine, maddux, johnson missing the cut: bagwell, mcgriff, larkin, pedro, palmeiro, thomas. not yet: a-rod
Neyer is overrexaggerating the media's lack of notoriety for bagwell's accomplishments. Bagwell's numbers as pued exquisitely demonstrated, are first ballot worthy. Then when you have two years as a First Basemen like this 43 homers, 31 steals in 97 and 42 homers 30 steals in 99 he is a stone cold lock. 40-30? One of the rarest numbers ever? By a first baseman? Twice? Plus 7 other seasons of more than 10 sb's which is really good as a 1b and 3 of those over 15 which is excellent? He is a first ballot lock, no ifs ands or buts about it.
uhh did neyer get a memo about no first basemen being allowed in the hall of fame that i missed out on? and yeah, how exactly is biggio getting in if bagwell doesn't. since when i open the link i just get a blank window, did he give reasoning or was it just a list?
neyer missed the boat beeg time on this one. (btw, like the magazine from which it iminates, i'm not even going to acknowledge SI's contribution). he's in; there's no doubt about it. if it takes two tries, they oughta burn the damn place down. which is what makes bagwell such a special player -- he fits the stereotype and blows it all to hell at the same time. both his glove work and baserunning skills are nearly unparalleled among first basemen. he is the definitive complete player, exceling at every facet of the game. hell, i think he's more deserving than mcgwire. if he can maintain the .300 average, he's gonna crack 450 HRs with ease after spending, what? 10 years in the dome? that's remarkable. god, what he would've done had the red sox kept him....
I think Bagwell is a sure hall of famer, first ballot if he continues to put up numbers for a couple of years, but his playoff numbers hurt him. No series wins, .174 batting average, 2x as many k's as hits, 4 career postseason RBI's, no extra base hits. Winning a championship isn't as important to your hall of fame resume in baseball as it is in football, but a lot of people look at those numbers. Bonds gets ripped for bad postseason performances. His playoff numbers were terrible, until last season.
