Dude, I'm not saying the risk is not there that Miles could blow out. It's a high-risk. Understood. But what is also understood is he is still only 23 or 24 years old and he still has great upside potential. We could strike out or we could hit a triple with Miles or anywhere in between. But when you compare him to somebody like Juwan. We have 3 MORE YEARS of Juwan's contract. Is Juwan going to get more minutes??? (If he does, then you know we are in serious doodoo.) Or is Juwan going to get less minutes? (I hope so. Practically anybody you could plug in would be better.) Is Juwan going to become more effective or even less effective over the next 3 YEARS?!?!?! Find me another deal where we can trade Juwan and have any opportunity to upgrade and improve the team.
The other difference between Maxwell, Sprewell, Rodman (and maybe not Wallace so much) besides the fact that they produced is that come tip-off they brought some fire. Last time we played Portland it was truly shocking how lazily Miles started the game.
I agree. I watched it. He looked pathetic. He looked just as pathetic as Vince looked in Toronto. Next.
What you have to remember is this is the NBA, this a player's league. Like it or not. That's the way the cake is cut. Players can and do "cross the line" many times and they are still given 2nd, 3rd, 4th, and nth chances to change and make a career in the NBA.........if they have talent. I'm not saying it's right. I'm saying that is the way it is. Miles will be given another chance somewheres else.....and he will get another chance somewheres else to make himself a valuable teammate. And it's obvious that he needs to go to a team with leaders already in place that can help keep him in line and with a strong head coach and winning organization to take away all his excuses. All you guys that don't want Miles on this team, how many of you want to see Juwan for the NEXT 3 YEARS!?!?!?!!??? All you guys that don't want Miles on this team, how many of you want to see him defending TMac on a team like the Mavs or Suns if he makes good??!?!!!??!!
Vince looks great now though, Maybe all dmiles needs is a change. 14 points in 30 minutes is impressive lazy or not. Ive seen more than 1 game of Darius and he can do many things well. His 12 to 18 footer is nice and he runs the wings unbelievably. With the right deal, I would give him a chance.
Juwan's presence on the team isn't detrimental to other players. It's all about performance. Plus, he adequate as a (very high-priced) backup. On the other hand, Miles can be very detrimental to other players and team morale. As we have seen, it could get bad enough that he's even kicked off the team. I don't see great upside potential. Players like him don't have greatness in them; simple as that. He won't develop into a 30+ mpg above average player. That is a pipe dream I'm not willing to bet 4 more years & $34MM on in exchange for a shorter contract. I liked your proposal in another thread to take Fortson for one year in exchage for Juwan. If Danny the nutcase got too flaky, we could just cut him.
Miles is a nutcase. Stay away. He's not even worth the trouble. Juwan might not be a great professional basketball player, but dude handles himself pretty well and I'd rather have that than sell my soul to take a POS such as miles.
Don't even go there. Vince was a 25ppg scorer before he quit on Toronto. Even in his worst year he scored more than Miles while having a 3:1 assist/to ratio. People knew what he could do. What the heck will Miles do? People take chances on stars, not underacheiving malcontents. Vince was a superstar, still is. Miles is a never-was. I'd love to see him on the spurs or suns because it'd make it that much worse for them.
At the time those players were traded, Rodman had won multiple Defensive Player of the Year awards and rebounding titles, and two rings. Maxwell had won a championship ring, twice led the league in 3 pointers made, and was a lockdown defensive player. Rasheed was a 2-time all star and one of the most talented PFs in the game, and had twice been the conference finals. What has Miles done? Darius Miles has never played on a winning team at the professional level. Those players were all much more talented than Miles and worth the risk. And because he's a better option than Miles. Unless Miles comes here and plays worse than Juwan would. You're getting way too worked up over a mediocre player. Darius Miles is not that good.
Even if the rockets did get Darius Miles, I can gurantee JVG wont play him more than 10min a game. Ask Swift and DA....
Don't even go there. Vince Carter makes $13.8 million this season. Darius makes $7.2 million. Last year, when he decided he wanted out of Toronto, his ppg dipped to 15.9 and his shooting percentage went down to 41%. Yeah, people knew what he could do and they knew what he was doing. He was stinking it up, intentionally. He even admitted it. Have you forgotten? You wanna compare stats. Vince is giving the Nets 24 ppg and making $13.8 million, all the while playing with Kidd, who hands him 8-10 ppg. Darius is averaging around 14 ppg, while making a little over $7.2 million and playing on a lousy team with no Jason Kidd. Vince in Toronto was an overpaid brat superstar who had and has done nothing in this league. He hasn't won anything. And he has never had a 3:1 assist/to ratio. Vince was the definiton of underachieving malcontent in Toronto.
Don't worry. I'm not worked up. I'm just pointing out that the difference between what Darius gave Portland this year and what Juwan gave us this year is ......nothing really. Throw professionalism out the window. Juwan got his you know what handed to him night after night. I do not expect us to acquire Darius Miles. Just don't think it will happen although I would be for it if we could dump Juwan's contract. I wouldn't trade McGrady or even Luther Head in a deal for Miles. It's not worth that kind of risk. But I don't see why it isn't worth the small risk of dumping Howard's contract. See, I don't think we can get much worse than having Juwan running out there and playing 30 mpg for us. I don't see how it can get worse than bringing Ryan Bowen off the bench to clang up a 20 footer for us. ANYTHING would be an upgrade over those two. You're right Darius has never played on a championship team or even a contender. He has never been surrounded with championship type players like Rodman was. Rodman came into the league at age 25. He was a rookie at age 25 and he didn't even reach his peak until 3 or 4 years after that, while he was surrounded with championship players in Zeke, Dumars, Microwave, and company. Those guys are on a different planet from Zach Randolph, Martell Webster, Telfair, and Joel Przybilla. Take Dennis Rodman at any point in his career and put him on the Trailblazers teams of the last 2 or 3 years and you have a total disaster, a total wreck. Take Darius and put him on those Pistons teams and he becomes a contributor. Rodman was a contributor to two championship teams in Detroit and Chicago. In between, he played for mediocre teams and caused all kinds of trouble. Darius Miles is 23 years old. Yeah, he's a wack job. But he's not even close to being as wacky as Rodman was. Rodman was anything but a leader, and he was/is totally self-destructive. I expect we will be reading his obituary sooner than later. But Chuck and Phil got everything out of him on the court. He was a significant and much needed contributor to both of those teams.
So Juwan has three more years of contract. Is that why JVG said Tmac has 3 more productive seasons left? Maybe he is hinting of trading Juwan. You know, JVG has always praised Juwan, maybe it's because he wants to raise his trade value? I don't know about Darius. Will he step on Yao's left foot when he is drunk, or wrestle with Tmac and messes up his back?
This thread is getting a little stale but one more comment. I'm no VC fan and I've blasted him on this forum quite a few times, but comparing Darius Miles to VC is silly. VC has demonstrated his superstar talent over several seasons. To say he's flamed DURING THE PLAYOFFS is one thing but to dismiss him as having "done nothing in this league" is extreme. Averaging 24 points over 8 seasons IS something by itself. He's definitely no leader but I'll take him as a 2nd fiddle on my team any day of the week. What he did those 20 games in Toronto last season was wrong and inexcusable, but it's nothing compared to Darius Miles. Not even close. If Miles had ever demonstrated serious NBA output to resurrect I could see your point. But he just doesn't compare to VC, Rasheed, Rodman (or anyone else who has actually DONE SOMTHING in this league) to justify the risk. I think your negative feelings toward Juwan are clouding your judgement about taking this complete loser (and possible alocoholic) and his 4 year deadweight contract. It would be better to have a corpse (like Juwan, LOL) on the roster.
If Miles were traded here, he would not even be the second fiddle. He may be the third fiddle, possibly. The only way I was comparing him to Vince was to show how bad a Superstar as good as Vince tanked it when he didn't want to be in a negative situation. Miles hasn't done anything thaat at least 2 superstars have admitted doing over the last season or so. One of those Superstars plays on our team.
No, I haven't forgotten. Vince was terrible that year, but he was still better than Darius Miles. Everyone knew he quit and that's exactly why the nets took on that massive payroll, because his problem was with the team and not his talent. Vince didn't have personal demons, he wasn't damaged goods. If Carter had Chris Webber's knees, the nets never would've taken that contract. If Carter had Tim Thomas' record, the nets wouldn't take it either. Let me make this clear to you: Vince was a superstar before he was bad. Darius Miles has always been bad. On multiple teams, no less. Which one do you gamble on? I know you think it's a smaller gamble, but it's really not when you know you're going to lose. Wanna know a secret? Miles is having a career year because Portland sucks, not in spite of it. A sign that Vince Carter was good was that the raptors sucked when he sucked; they did well when he did well. As Miles' role increases, a team's fortunes fall. He's one of those guys that puts up good stats on terrible teams. And on top of that, I just don't like his game. EDIT: Oh, and Vince had 3.1apg and 1.1topg in that terrible year in Toronto. I know the ratio's not exactly 3:1, but I didn't feel like whipping out my calculator to post a 2.81A/TO ratio. But hey, if you're that exacting so be it.
