This could go under any number of threads, but becasue of the potential immediate effects, it deserves a thread all its own...
The water problem is not a joke. Current human water policies are no longer sustainable within the hydrologic cycle. See, I told you rimmy!
Yes, rhad... but we're not arguing. Water is a critical resource and we'll see these kinds of problems popping up in the near future... but it is also inextricably tied to climate.
No, we're not arguing - yet. I will argue that not all water problems are tied inextricably to climate. The inability of certain areas of the country to understand the serious problems associated with irresponsible water policy *cough* western states will cause these issues to pop up more and more in the next several decades. You could argue that climate has perturbed the hydrologic cycle to the point of diminishing, for example, groundwater sources. But I'd counter that even with nominal rainwater replenishment, water usage (and the policy that enables it) is far exceeding the regenerative capabilites of these systems.
The power requirements are ludicrous. Unless we all go Australian and power our desal plants with wind energy, the emissions represent a point of considerable "diminishing returns". I'd rather see more conservation, but that almost never seems viable to the masses.
With existing technology that's the case. But where there's a will...or more importantly, where there's a dire need...there's a way. I'm all for conservation. I'd still look for more efficient, effective ways to get the salt out of saltwater.
And this leads to one of the more interesting points that Jared Diamond iterates in his books about collapsing societies. There is a tendency for people to over-rely on technology to bail out humanity from ecological problems, problems that more often than not were caused by technology in the first place. It's not impossible. But it should be carefully thought about.
I'm not sure how I feel about that. Using resources at your disposal to make life better for people....and using them responsibly (which is key)....doesn't seem to me to be a hallmark of a collapsing society. In my mind, that's just working smarter. Again...I'm not arguing against conservation.
Sorry - I guess I was not clear. I was simply remarking that when people say things like "we should not worry - technology will solve this crisis" I get nervous. History consistently teaches us that the planet is far more complex than most people consider. Technology can solve problems, but it can cause new ones in the process. What effects on ecology and environment will huge increases in desal operations cause? How will these plants rectify water damage to the environment as a whole? Do we even remotely understand the problem enough to answer these questions?
Instead of imposing restrictions on water use and the like why not allow water prices to be determined by the market? Surely higher priced water would be better for society (and water conservation) than the government telling us when we can and cannot wash our car right?
Depends on if you think water is a human right, or merely a commodity. In the US, it's an ugly psuedo-mix of the two. I'd hate to deny someone water (water they need, not car washing) simply because they could not afford it.
Well of course if one is unable to pay for water they need it will be given to them, that seems obvious to me. But a pricing mechanism seems far more efficient to me than the government arbitrarily telling its citizens when and how then can use water.
Creating potable water from the oceans is within the realm of scientific and economic grasp. In fact, the brine would yield a number of precious metals from gold to zinc. However, the problem is brine and what to do with it because of the risk of turning the oceans into another Great Salt Lake. Also, we could drag icebergs down (or up) but IIRC scientists say this would speed global warming. At any rate, there are more solutions than just pumping it out of the ground. Show an American entrepreneur how to make a dollar on it, and the solution will be found! God, I love this country.
I was going to say "just have Michael Vick beat the piss out of some dogs", but I think I like your response better.
we would have to use a hell of a lot of water and then somehow ensure that it NEVER found its way back to the ocean for this to happen, right?
