athleticism vs fundamentals: which is more successful?

What about small forwards who act as point forwards...like DET THE THREAT or (ugh) Quitten...

 

Maybe they don't pass it to you because you suck.


J/K

 

Does the trade of KVH for TThomas fit this discussion? Bucks and Knicks each believe they 'won' this deal.

Does comparing 'unathletic' Mavs and 'not-so-athletic' Lakers with 'unathletic' Kings fit this discussion?

What about the historically 'athletic' Clips and the historically 'athletic' Blazers with the 'athletic' Wolves?

Fundamentals? Athleticism? Let's start with HoopsIQ then add commitment to team, ala 2003-04 Jazz (imagine a Clips/Jazz 'merger'? Wow!) or 2003 - 04 Griz.

 

Well, point forwards are unique players. It's not that small forwards CAN'T have smarts, it's just not as important as it is for point guards. Richard Jefferson is a perfect example. Nobody is confusing him with Pippen, but he uses his athleticism and feeds of the great passes by Kidd.

 

Agreed.

BUT - moving without the ball also requires some basketball IQ...or at least a good understanding with the PG or C who dominate the ball in most systems.

 

It is a mix of the two. You can know what to do and where to be, but if your body can't do it, it does you know good.

A player can see a lane to cut through, or see a pass to make, but if he isn't 'athletic' enough to make the vut quick enoough, or pass the ball quick enough and accurately enough, then he can't make the play. Conversely, a guy won't make a play unless he knows what play to make.

 

NBA vs. foreign leagues?

It depends on size. Robert Horry had decent athleticism with his blocks, but it was his fundamentals and basketball IQ that made him last in the NBA despite his tendinitis and tweener status.

Fundamentals increase longevity, and every coach wants fundamentally sound players on the bench, but it's the athletic cats that hold most of the starting positions.

 

At the end of the day, I think you want basketball players period... I can think of a non-athletic team (at least non super athletic like MJ, Wilt, TMac, Kobe, KG etc) whom I'll be willing to throw against just about any team out there:

C - Sabonis/Yao
PF - Larry Bird/Barkley
SF - Peja/Dirk
SG - Reggie Miller/???
PG - Magic Johnson/Stockton

And that's without much thought... OK, granted some positions like SG is difficult... and defensively, it might be a challenge... especially if the athletic team has Shaq at C, MJ at SG, KG at SF and/or AI at PG, but offensively, I'm sure this team will more than hold it's own...

So it comes down to how much you are willing to give up on the defensive end... i think...

 

what exactly defines athletic? jumping high and running fast?

what defines fundamental? plays boring? good shooter? not fast? can't jump high?


i don't really get this argument even though it seems clear to everyone its not very clear to me

 

Athletic would be runs fast, jumps high, etc. Steve Francis, Harold Minor, and Darius Miles are all athletic players.

Fundamental is low turnovers, shoots well, boxes out, plays defense, etc. Tim Duncan, John Stockton, Reggie Miller are all fundamentally sound players.

 

so athletic players like KG, Kobe, Iverson, McGrady don't have great fundamentals...... booooooooo.... all the superstars of this league have great fundamentals

 

That's the point I'm making...Did you see Sabonis and Barkley when they were younger? Sabonis could score from all over the court and was also a monster shot blocker, and Barkley ran fast breaks like a small forward. He was also usually top 20 in rebounding despite being 6'4". I could make an "athletic" team with Sabonis, Barkley, Peja, Miller, and Magic...They didn't get "unathletic" until they were older....

...or perhaps they conveniently gained all their fundamentals when they became old and un-athletic...

 

i agree. Magic was very athletic for his height. just like nowitzki is and barkley was also very athletic. Also Garnett how do you discribe him? as athletic or fundamental? he is unbelieveble athletic. Shaq is also athletic and he was very succesfull

 

Oscar Robertson is probably the greatest player at combining both. Just throwing that out there.

 

In the sense that it is used in this thread:

athletic = black

fundamental = white


Flame r****dant glasses on!!!!!!!!!!

 

Best post in this thread. There is such confusion as to the definitions of both of the key terms here, all discussions just fly over the head of everybody.

Can anybody get the definitions straight before we carry on the debate?

 

most of the best players r athletic in this league:
But u have to combine ur athleticism with ur skill.

for example:
Kobe, KG, T-mac, Oneal,

Nowitsky is very very athletic for his size, so is Yao.

but one thing for sure, u will never be a class A player if u r not atheltic
(but fundamental is more important for everyone else)