Gray But I would only give up Perez/Martes not both. If you're talking Hector Perez or Cionel Perez then yes. Gray for Martes/Musgrove/Paulino/C. Perez. Do you think the A's would do it. I do, TOR guy in Martes and 2 potential 2/3 guys. Paulino/Musgrove. Talented wildcard in C. Perez seems like a great haul for Gray.
So give up two starters in our rotation for Gray? Not happening. Sure, A's would do it but the Astros wouldn't. Kazmir only fetched some propects who were a tier below Martes and Musgrove. Yes, Kazmir is older and was a rental. Yes, Gray is better and has a favorable contract. But I'm not trading both guys for a guy who hasn't been his complete self since 2015.
In a vacuum I think that Oakland makes that deal. However with Chicago getting involved, it may not be enough. The Cubs are hell bent on adding a top of the rotation starter and are willing to move guys like Jimenez, Baez, Cease and possibly Happ or Shwarber for pitching.
Lester, Arrieta and Lackey aren't enough? I see they are down so far this year but that's pretty strong no?
Lackey is old and his stuff has eroded... Hendricks is potentially missing a lot of time and Arrieta is battling injuries and his mechanics are a mess. They want another starter to put next to Lester.... they also are unlikely to resign Arrieta and will need a replacement.
Fair enough, but Gray appears healthy and back to the playoff tested veteran with great stuff. Paulino is just a fill in. Musgrove is who Gray would be replacing. My problem with this trade is having to face Martes/Paulino/Musgrove in the same division for the next 5 years.
They'd really give up Jimenez in a package for Gray? Would Schwarber even be considered a centerpiece after his poor year so far and would that be selling low if you not only have to give him up but multiple other prospects as well? And Happ is actually contributing right now for them. I doubt they want to move him. Baez and Cease have upside but they're guys with flaws that the Astros could match in value.
I'd think any deal with an AL team will have Schwarber involved. He's a pure DH, calling him a butcher in the field is an insult to butchers.
A deal built around Jimenez and Cease would be tough to beat, but a combo of Tucker and Martes should easily do that. But if Chicago is offering those 2 guys for Gray, Cole, or Quintana then I'm fine with Houston bowing out. I don't see Chicago offering Happ, Baez, or Shwarber. That would be akin to Houston trading Bregman.
I don't see why Astros would bow out. There will likely be more than one SP that can help. Pretty sure Astros can offfer a trade better than any team other than Cubs and Yankees without Tucker and Bregman. Means Astros would likely get their third choice at worst if they hold off on giving other team a prospect shopping spree.
After the conclusion of the 2017 MLB draft, no way I trade Kyle Tucker. In today's game with shifting & scouting reports, I'll keep this stud. Whitley has also shown that he has Ace potential. Love his make up and stuff. He is only going to get better going forward, which is scary.
Right, I should have clarified. I meant bow out on whichever player Chicago is offering Jimenez/Cease for. If I'm Luhnow and teams are demanding Tucker/Martes for Cole/Quintana/Gray, I wait the market out. He can start fishing for a BoR guy like Vargas, Garcia, Santana, Volquez, or Cobb to have a backup plan in case prices don't come down. I wouldn't mind if Luhnow went ahead and acquired Jaime Garcia now (assuming the price is 1 prospect outside the org top 10) in order to gain leverage. If he's able to get a ToR guy then Garcia can always move to the bullpen and function as a 2nd lefty or long reliever.
Bregman, Paulino, Fisher, and Perez for Archer or Qunitana. I really like what I see from Martes. Once he gets in shape I could see him chewing up some innings.
Essentially, any ball in the field of play is, technically, playable. But obviously some balls are more playable than others - hitter quality, hit speed, defensive proficiency/positioning, weather, etc. - all things beyond a pitcher's control - can have an impact. If a pitcher has a man on first, one out and he induces a ground ball that his no-range SS can't get to, why should the pitcher be punished? He did exactly what the team needed and the team failed him. A pitcher can only control balls & strikes and keeping balls in play. Everything else is subject to a variety of conditions. That's the rationale. No defense, no matter how good, can stop a 470-foot home run.
That is a monumentally lopsided deal. The Astros almost certainly view those four as worth tens of millions of future dollars. There's no way they'll make a deal of that magnitude. It would gut their system. The dynamics have changed significantly; teams are no longer *as in* the dark when it comes to predicting success/failure for their prospects so the notion they would deal them irresponsibly because "who knows?!" is an antiquated idea.
Yes, the Cubs are willing to deal Jimenez. I didn't mean the Cubs would give up ALL those players in a deal, only that those are players they are willing to trade in some combination for a starter. Schwarber still has a lot of value if you believe what scouts say about him. The Astros can match any deal that the Cubs put out there, but I am not sure they would do it.... it could come down to who is willing to pay more.
Odd, I think you are going to be extremely excited when Astros make a trade as long as you don't have you heart set on a specific player. I'm not sure Buck will be happy though.
That deal would be extremely lopsided for the Astros if it was for Quintana. Not as much if it were for Archer, but still lopsided. If you're giving up Bregman in a trade for Archer, there's no reason to include more than either Paulino or Perez in addition to Bregman.
Actually, I don't really care, honestly, because I trust the front office as they're infinitely smarter than me. If they decide that's a fair deal for Gray, cool - I'll support it. But I don't think there's a pitcher in this market that would coax them into giving up four arms of that caliber. That is a tremendously lopsided deal. You're talking about trading away tens of millions of dollars of future value for, what? 1.5 years of Sonny Gray? If that's how rich the market is, I think they'll either look for BOR pitchers or stay the course.
