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Are we a better "team" when Harden moves the ball more?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by hikanoo49, Mar 4, 2013.

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Are we a better "team" when Harden moves the ball move?

Poll closed Apr 3, 2013.
  1. Yes, our offense flows and we are tough to stop

    100 vote(s)
    84.0%
  2. No, we need more ISOs

    11 vote(s)
    9.2%
  3. Maybe

    8 vote(s)
    6.7%
  1. hikanoo49

    hikanoo49 Member

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    This is not bashing of any kind so hear out my reasons

    If you watch yesterdays game, that was probably one of the best TEAM wins of the year. We destroyed the Mavs and ALL of our players had great games (Chandler, Lin, Asik, D Mo, Robinson etc. etc.). Harden was hurt so he didn't try to do too much and still scored 20 points by letting the offense just flow but more importantly had 7 assists and ZERO turnovers!

    I know that many of you will say Harden gets alot of assists but that is not a sole indicator of playing proper team ball as many of you will recall, guys like Marbury, Iverson and Francis would actually all get quite a bit of assists in past.

    What I mean by moving the ball is sometimes you pass to a guy that may lead to another pass for the assist (like in Hockey). OR just not trying to dribble too much and just pass the ball and move around so there is flow to the offense.

    I remember Jordan in his prime and he would always pick his moments very well. 1st 3 quarters, he would just let the offense flow and have the team offense create shots for everyone. Come 4th quarter or instances if the shot clock is low, he would then dominate and create via one on one. But I do feel Harden at times bails teams out by going one on one too early and just need to move the ball and let the beautiful team offense take course.
     
  2. hikanoo49

    hikanoo49 Member

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    so far, 16 people for Yes and 0 for no
     
  3. HamJam

    HamJam Contributing Member

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    We are absolutely not a better team when Harden defers -- especially when he has to defer because of being somewhat injured.

    We lost to Milwaukee and almost lost to Orlando precisely because Harden was not able to wreak havoc on the opposing defense like he normally does.

    Ball movement is of course important, and when you look at what percentage of our shots have come off assists this season, we stack up well compared to the rest of the league. But this team is significantly weaker when Harden is not breaking down the opposing defense and is not bailing the team out late in shot clocks.

    Yesterday was indeed a great team win, and an injured Harden should definitely defer as he did last night against the Mavs. But if Harden is injured as he has been the last few games then this team will struggle to make the playoffs and and will definitely struggle to win any games in the playoffs.
     
  4. SuperStar

    SuperStar Member

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    No, 90 percent of the plays should be Harden ISO'ing.
     
  5. flamingdts

    flamingdts Member

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    Why do you ask these questions where the answer is obvious but only function to point out his short comings that everyone is aware of.

    Your next thread is going to be titled

    "Are we better as a team if Harden improves his defense?".
     
  6. Karolik

    Karolik Member

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    Only works when other players step up like yesterday, but Lin/Parsons are way too inconsistent to be true second options.
     
  7. jayhow92

    jayhow92 Member

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    No ****ing **** dude. We're clearly better with 100% Harden ISO.
     
  8. hikanoo49

    hikanoo49 Member

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    The strange thing is, not everyone is aware of this. We have several voters who think we need Harden to ISO more so the point of this thread is to see how many feel Harden needs to play more hero ball (and believe me, there are many based on the current votes). Often times, these people will say Harden doesnt have a good supporting cast (etc. etc.) but I bring this up as last night, we played beautiful team ball and blew out a pretty tough Mavs team



     
  9. morpheus133

    morpheus133 Member

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    Can we get some more interesting threads like this? How about "Would we be a better team if our point guard could shoot better than 32% from 3 point range?", or "Would we be a better team if Asik was an 80% free throw shooter?". These are tough questions that need to be debated :rolleyes:
     
  10. FLASH21

    FLASH21 Heart O' Champs

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    Did it ever occur to you that most of those that voted no are probably doing so in ridicule of this dumb thread?

    It's obvious any team plays better when they move the ball and their shots are falling.
     
  11. flamingdts

    flamingdts Member

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    Start a thread that says

    "Is Jeremy Lin actually Asian?"

    You will have a ton of voters who picked no. Should we start a discussion about that too?
     
  12. apollo33

    apollo33 Member

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    Oh look its you again
     
  13. J.R.

    J.R. Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

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    Take away OPs thread starting privileges. You're worse than Badlee and that's saying something.
     
  14. REEKO_HTOWN

    REEKO_HTOWN I'm Rich Biiiiaaatch!

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    Passive aggressive much?
     
  15. Sen89

    Sen89 Member

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    In Wins: 6.2 apg, 16.8 fga
    In Losses: 5.1 apg, 17.9 fga
     
  16. nickg

    nickg Member

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    Harden is our closer but ball movement is the key. Look at Friedman's article from this morning. Rockets are 8-1 in 9 games when they have 30 or more assists.
     
  17. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Contributing Member

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    harden has to carry the whole team to victory when his teammates shots arent falling
     
  18. WinkFan

    WinkFan Contributing Member

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    I voted maybe because I'm a little confused by your premise. I'm not sure what you mean by better "team". Are you refering to winning, or some other aesthetic criteria? Your choices only allow for more ball movement, or more iso, which are not the only two options.

    We are not going to win many games with Harden taking 10 shots.

    Last nights win was against a non tough, below average defensive lottery team. Our best win, team or otherwise, was clearly against OKC.

    I think you misremember watching Jordan. It's probably because of what all the announcers were telling you. During his tittle years, Jordan took over 7 shots per game more than anyone else on the team. That includes Pippen, who despite how people in Houston feel, is still in the HOF. The year Jordan won his third title, he lead the league in shots by 400.
     
  19. HadToDoItCF

    HadToDoItCF Member

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    Every team in this league is better when guys move their bodies and move the ball. We don't need him to be passive (i.e. take less shots or defer), but he will get more easy buckets himself if we, as a team, all move the ball and move our bodies better.

    As an aside, I don't get why these polls all have ridiculous tags after a "yes" or "no" answer. I think some people would say that we aren't better when James moves the ball (I disagree), but it's not necessarily because they think we need to ISO him more. A simple yes or no poll and allowing the people to expound upon their answer would be a better discussion starter.
     
  20. HadToDoItCF

    HadToDoItCF Member

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    In wins: 28.0 ppg
    In losses: 24.0 ppg

    Which, 24 points on ~18 shots would still be ~1.33 PPS. That's a boss stat for your off games. I think we all know our offense is better when James is more actively involved (cutting, passing, making shots, etc.) but that's not to say he should defer or be less aggressive. I think everyone in the NBA is better when they cut, pass, move, and make shots... And usually that translates in to more team success.
     

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