So in light of the evil and greedy Walton family and the Apple product carrying individuals who are simply too good to shop with the rest of the poor population, I would like to celebrate another 1 million "high paying" jobs with great benefits being created. http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-07-18-foxconn-planning-USD1-billion-facility-in-indonesia
Once again. The cost of living in other countries does not equal the cost of living in the US. I know its not your point, but just saying. Poverty line in Indonesia is ~$30 a month.
Just because it's better than letting people starve on the road doesn't mean the international labour system doesn't have massive problems which are, in a way, forcing Third World citizens to work for their lives (if Foxconn isn't driving them to suicide.) In an international system where capital didn't have such crushing power, we would be celebrating much more than a raise from $100 a month---never mind the desperate masses that still live on less than a dollar a day.
Multinational corporations are to blame. What's stopping them from paying workers $100 a month compared to paying US workers a LOT more?
The overwhelming power of capital, led by deregulation and kowtowing to rates of return for the elite, have led to a massive imbalance. Things are much better thanks to technological progress and innovation. However, the benefits are nowhere near being shared evenly.
The difference is Walmart helps our poor by offering low prices, all though often its on the back of third world countries. Iphone and Ipad users proudly display their electronic devices as trophies. Apple brings in billions of dollars in profit a year that rival walmart, delivering a product that is not a necessity, in which both the poor and rich buy.
I don't understand where this general notion of poor people having a mass preponderance of IPhones comes from, I'm guessing that this is the new mythical "welfare queen" of our generation?
Apple products are considered the best in class in its category and the most popular. It's not for you to decide whether or not someone relies on an iPad or not. Walmart sells cheap crappy stuff that often has poor safety standards both in its usage and in it manufacturing. It also puts smaller mom and pop stores out of business - that actually eliminates jobs. You might argue that by saving people money it is serving the economy, but the impact of Walmart ignores a few things. Because it is manufactured overseas - the COGS is a net negative on the economy. American dollars flowing out to other countries. Also, compared to the local retailers they are replacing, the loss in jobs and the cash that is sucked out of the neighborhood is hugely detrimental. A group of small businesses employers many more people than the Walmart Superstar that drives them out. And the money from your local hardware store staying in the local community by a 2:1 margin. Walmart sucks the money out and much of it ends up in foreign markets as capital investments into expanding its chain internationally. Also the percentage that stays within the country is often being distributed as stock divendends which can go to foreigners or to the very rich who do not re-inject into the economy the way money spent on a small business does. Often used to buy expensive foreign lux items. All of this adds up to negate the cheaper prices from Walmart. It's sort of like how the British used efficiency to such the wealth out of India. The R.R. system was a net drain on the economy - wherever it expanded to poverty flourish years later as wealth was shipped out. So before you sing the praises of Walmart be careful you understand all the micro and marco economic effects. It is far more complex that you are making it out to be. Apple is no hero either by any means. The key thing here is that if you really believe in America, than you should buy hi quality items built here and sold in local small shops. You are not paying more for the same stuff. You are getting more value on each penny you spend because the stuff will last longer and bring you more utility, and you are being a true patriot.
Tangential but Foxconn makes products for lots of companies, not just Apple. The last PC I built had a Foxconn motherboard, so they even have their own consumer branch. To the bigger issue of competitiveness, drive the price of electricity in the U.S. to almost zero via a Eisenhower Interstate scale program with distributed solar/wind and natural gas (as a stepping stone to carbon free) Massively increase Aluminum production dropping the price = to steel and slap a heavy export tariff for unfinished Al parts, billet, etc. Essentially giving anything Aluminum rich in composition a good reason for being made in the USA. I started with step two, with step one being a total overhaul of congress and the ROI for lobbying, single term limit for both houses, etc but whaddayagonnado?
Apple is a miserly company that nickels and dimes its customers and employees. The only difference between them and Walmart is that they have better messaging and marketing. "You overpay because you want to overpay"
Are you seriously justifying the abuse of labor simply because Apple produces a better product?? Apple is no different than Walmart when it comes to this aspect. Whether the product is cheap or high quality is irrelevant. It all comes down to what you're willing to turn a blind eye towards. You're making a piss poor argument and making unsubstantial allegations. In the last 10 years, I have lived in 3 very small towns. I will attest how frustrating it is to find the things i need/want simply because thos 'mom and pop' shops didn't have what I needed. When the SuperWalmart were built, the Mom and Pop shops were already gone or on their last legs. It wasn't Walmart that has driven them out, it was the big national grocery chains and and the small chains like Walmart that had already moved in. Additionally, once the Superwalmarts moved in, they always attracted more of the national chains that always follow the Walmart Supercenters. Many many more jobs are created than lost.
So as long as you have a high end popular product, it's ok for it to be made by people earning less per month than I spend at a Rockets game?
We complain about people in developing country working under bad conditions and low wages, do we ever stop and think from the perspective of the people in those countries? Maybe to you and me $100 a month is very bad but to those people it could be significant improvement in their standard of living. I know my parents were making $7 a month teaching in college in China back in earth 80s, and many factory workers lived on less than 5 dollars a month, if someone offered a job for $30 a month, many people would have jumped at the chance. These types of jobs are what started the economic power that is China today. You think Foxconn or any other business should just go there and offer those people $3000 a month jobs? If Foxconn and other multinationals do not go to developing nations to create jobs, who is going to invest in those countries? US tax payers?
This factory is good news for China. I'm not sure how this matters for us, though. I guess an IPhone might be a couple bucks cheaper. Is this a new thing, threads for every new factory opened abroad? If so, Space Ghost is going to have his work cut out for him.
This is a very important point and one that changed my mind regarding globalization. In college I back packed through Indonesia and saw people living off of trash heaps and from talking to locals their feeling was that working in sweat shops was better than the alternative. I agree that we need to improve the working conditions of workers everywhere but not providing them with jobs, even ones that are very low paying by are standards, doesn't help them. It just means that they are stuck in poverty and underdeveloped. Globalization is really the only sustainable way to transfer capital from the first world to the third and foster development.
Never been able to buy into the whole "economic development justifies exploiting the desperation of the impoverished" line of reasoning. I'll keep buying Nikes though.
The cost of living difference isn't really the issue. Yes, $100USD might sound laughable, but it could be a fairly decent wage there. The issue is that companies like Apple are making billions of dollars in profit but allow the working conditions to be horrendous. They are not protected like employees are in the US. It wouldn't take that much more money to provide safer work environments. Foxconn is nothing but a firewall to let companies like Apple exploit the labor (laws) of poor countries.
You have to consider the alternative though. Is living stuck in a primarily agricultural state with little infrastructure or as in the case of the PRC in the 1970's in antiquated Soviet style industry better than working in sweatshops? There is a reason why people are flocking to take these jobs and it is the same reason why people flocked to sweatshops in mill towns like Lowell, MA 150 years ago in the US. Non-industrialized farm life is more tedious and back breaking than a sweat shop.
