C'mon mc mark. Republicans use their catch phrases, like the ones you mentioned as well as "judicial activism", only when it serves their purpose.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050321/D88VDJ4O0.html this whole thing is just getting more and more bizzare. there was a woman on fox last night arguing that her brain is not dead, her cerebral cortex is not damaged and that with physical therapy she has a good chance of recovery, but the husband wont allow it. she also said that dehydration is "the most painful way" to die. she went on about how much terri will suffer. complete liar. from what ive heard, dehydration leads one into a coma, they slip into unconsciousness and thats it. doesnt quite sound as painful as say electrocution or beheading. unfortunately, most people are too reactionary to care about "facts" and will take this woman for her word. the same reason that half of americans still believe that saddam had something to do w/ 9/11. its beyond insane! every doctor that has examined her says this woman has zero chance of recovery. her current state is the best she will ever be. i wonder how many of these "right to lifers" would want to live like this for 15 years or longer. i sure wouldnt. "Court-appointed doctors say she is in a persistent vegetative state with no hope of recovery. Her husband says she would not want to be kept alive in that condition, but her parents insist she could recover with treatment." i understand that the parents cant just let her go, but the reality is that she will not recover. i guess they feel that they dont want to quit on her and anyone can sympathize with that, but after so many years you have to realize that she wont get better. i definately wouldnt want to live in that state and i bet most of yall wouldnt either. if schaivo was after money or trying to hide the fact that he beat his wife and that is why she went into a coma (heard that one on good old fox as well from one of the "commentators") or that he wants to just be able to marry his longtime girlfriend than why cant he just divorce her and just let the family deal with it? why cant he tell the schindlers, "you want to keep her going, its your responsibility. i cant do this anymore." wash his hands of teri completely. that would be the easy thing to do, right? maybe he hasnt done that b/c his intentions are trying to follow thru on his wifes wishes and he is carrying out what he feels is what she would have wanted. he was, afterall, her husband! "This is a sad day for Terri. But I'll tell you what: It's also is a sad day for everyone in this country because the United States government is going to come in and trample all over your personal, family matters," he told ABC's "Good Morning America" on Monday. - Michael Sciavo this is a family issue that the state has already ruled on. republicans, the party of states rights, are now sticking their trunks where they dont belong. federal government has no buisness here, but to pander to the hardcore christian conservatives they must take a stand. the government should be dealing with important issues like steroids in baseball and all them queers gettin' married. nevermind iraq, defecits, taxes, corporate scandals, economy, poverty. if anything, this is a good lesson for us all. have a will of some kind (even handwritten) with your signature. keep it in your desk drawrer. let it be known if you would want to live like this, who should get your stuff, who has power of attorney for you, ect.
From the article...says half the Democrats voted for this measure. Odd. I guess now that sanctity of life is all the rage, they'll be moving quickly on removing the death penalty from the books.
"Tonight we have given Terri Schiavo all we could — a chance to live," said House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, R-Texas. "After four days of words, the best of them uttered in prayer, Congress has acted and a life may have been saved." Oh...my...God... It's official, our government no longer represents the will of the people, just the will of the Christian Uber-Right. I wonder if good ole' Tommy-The Bug Exterminator-Delay ever said that about a wrongly accused death row inmate? Oh, I forgot, in the "big tent revival" that is now our legislature, this kind of debate and the trumping of Sates Rights and or Judicial Activisim is okay as long as it is framed by god fearing Republicans... Now, Mad Max, Glynch--I may not agree with you on some religious issues, but you guys are straight shooters and I believe you both oppose the Death Penalty. YOU DO have some moral high ground to support this measure even if I don't agree with you. But if you are an American whom hasn't yet turned their intellect off in favor of the Jackson trial, you MUST be hearing the Hypocrisy claxon beating it's striker a thousand times a minute, drowning out all other sound, pounding on your mind to WAKE the F*@# UP!!
http://nytimes.com/2005/03/21/polit...&en=d959f74eb94c300f&ei=5094&partner=homepage YOU EXECUTE r****dS
I can really see both sides of this argument. I'm not taking one side or the other. But I must say, I find very persuasive the idea that if you have a presumption one way or the other, that it ought to lean towards preserving the life. Without an explicit statement from the person in question, you lean towards preserving life. That's coming from someone who has signed a directive to physicians to have them pull the plug on me if I were in the same state. But absent that...I'm not sure I want anything other than a presumption that favors life.
Meantime, 70 percent of Americans say Congress' action was inappropriate and 67 percent thought the elected officials were trying to keep Schiavo alive were doing so more for political advantage than out of concern for her or the principles involved, according to a poll conducted for ABC News. http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=703&e=1&u=/ap/20050321/ap_on_go_co/schiavo_congress
Democrats wussed out fearing Terri's death would be pinned on them. Nevermind the precedent set last night. I can't wait till Roe v. Wade falls and the Republicans win Congress and the White House again. Dems should change their mascot to a big....
Holy ****, I still have faith in Americans. Also, one more article: http://www.click2houston.com/news/4269884/detail.html?subid=22100412&qs=1;bp=t Where's the outrage for this guy? Why isn't Congress convening in an emergency effort to stop this guy from being unplugged, as part of their "culture of life"? (poor foreigner)
I principle, I agree with you. However, in this matter: 1. Over 20 judges have heard this case already. 2. Not one doctor that's conducted a personal evaluation has offered a positive conclusion. 3. After 15 years, she has no signs of improvement. 4. The husband, the ONLY individual with the right to do so, is making the request to end her life. It sounds to me, by every immaginable measure, this case has been given its due process. This is a simple matter of politicians grand-standing. If Delay wasn't under investigation for ethics violations and W didn't actively promote capital punishment and premptive wars (resulting in the death of thousands), then maybe their "save-a-life-athon" might have more credibility.
i hear ya. i guess my analysis was sort of in the abstract...not necessarily commenting on all the crap that's gone on with this particular case.
I personally think that offering money is BS. The businessman should be ashamed of himself for making such a proposal. If the offer were accepted, then the husband should be ashamed of himself. My understanding of this situation is she asked to not be kept alive should she be in a catatonic state like this. There is medical evidence that says, despite what the family or people would have you believe, this person is not thinking. The husband has sat with her for hours on end and he has said he cannot get through to her. All she can seemingly do is smile which doesn't mean she is happy to be a vegetable nor does it mean she is thinking or actually experiencing emotion. I guess I'm wondering that, if she said not to keep her alive in this situation, was it in her living will? If so, then how can anyone dispute it...especially Congress or the President? I think the family is being a bit selfish in this scenario. Obviously, they want to believe the best and keep her alive but that is ignoring what she wanted originally. Her prognosis is totally grim going forward for any kind of recovery. I think the family just doesn't know when to say "when" and let go. They will believe anything to keep her around. But, I don't think starving her to death is exactly humane. If you want to end her life, then do it like a lethal injection or something. Even though it appears she is basically brain dead, the body still feels hunger and dehydration. So, I don't think it's fair either way. Keep her alive to live like a vegetable or dehydrate/starve her to death which seems kind of cruel, also. Where is Dr. Kervorkian when you need him?
the problem is that terri did NOT leave a written will of any kind. its basically her husbands word against the family. this is a reminder to all of us to get this stuff in writing and just stash it away in case the worst should ever happen. i wouldnt call the family selfish. i cant imagine how difficult this is for them, but i dont think they are willing to accept repeated medical opinion from several doctors and neurologists that she will not recover...no chance. they cant give up, and its hard to fault them for it. as far as the starving to death, from what ive heard it is painless, as you slip into a coma and thats it. basically go to sleep. its not the ideal scenario, but in this case what is?
The problem is that it is illegal to give a lethal injection because that is legally equated to murder. Dr. Jack Kavorkian (sp?) pushed that idea to the limit in Michigan and he was ultimately sentenced to prison. So to remove life support is not killing somebody. That is simply allowing a natural death. Do I agree with that? Well, that's a whole other topic. But I beleive people should be able to make decisions of their own fate if they are in a terminally ill or in a vegetative state. To keep somebody alive indefinately through an extremely painful inevitable death is more cruel then keeping somebody alive on artificial life support.
I'm watching the news right now and they are going over the video tapes that the family has released reported showing Terry Schiavo conscious and also the medical explanations behind it. Even according to the doctor who had been appointed by the FLA Legislature to support keeping her alive has said that she will never recover and isn't really conscious and that any reactions she shows aren't part of any pattern of consciousness but random reactions. I'm coming to think that this issue is going to come down to actually bringing her to the Capital to be put on display before a Congressional committee. This will be done by the legislators supporting keeping her alive as an attempt to show she is actually conscious but will backfire when the public at large finally sees her condition directly than through carefully edited videos and statements by her family.
Even Evangelicals support letting her die, 46-44. And here's the latest from her husband: http://www.sptimes.com/2005/03/20/Tampabay/Schiavo___Come_down__.shtml Schiavo: 'Come down, President Bush' By WILLIAM R. LEVESQUE, Times Staff Writer Published March 20, 2005 PINELLAS PARK - Angered by the latest political developments in Washington, Michael Schiavo said Saturday that it isn't just the Florida governor who should visit his wife to learn about the case. Jeb Bush's brother, President Bush, should visit Terri Schiavo, too, he said. "Come down, President Bush," Schiavo said in a telephone interview. "Come talk to me. Meet my wife. Talk to my wife and see if you get an answer. Ask her to lift her arm to shake your hand. She won't do it." She won't, Schiavo said, because she can't. He made a similar offer to the governor last week, saying lawmakers interferring in his wife's life know nothing about the case. So far, Gov. Bush hasn't responded to the offer. President Bush has indicated he will sign any federal legislation to keep Terri Schiavo alive. Weary after an emotional visit with his wife, Schiavo said he is astonished that politicians want to interfere in such a private matter. "Instead of worrying about my wife, who was granted her wishes by the state courts the past seven years, they should worry about the pedophiles killing young girls," Schiavo said, referring to a local case. "Why doesn't Congress worry about people not having health insurance? Or the budget? Let's talk about all the children who don't have homes." He said U.S. House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, who is leading a charge to extend Terri Schiavo's life, is a "little slithering snake" pandering for votes. "To make comments that Terri would want to live, how do they know?" Schiavo said of the members of Congress who want to keep his wife alive. "Have they ever met her?" Schiavo said. "What color are her eyes? What's her middle name? What's her favorite color? They don't have any clue who Terri is. They should all be ashamed of themselves." Schiavo said he was going to stay at his wife's side through the entire ordeal and said he wouldn't back down in his fight to have her wishes carried out. "Terri died 15 years ago," Schiavo said, referring to the collapse and cardiac arrest that doctors say virtually destroyed her brain. "It's time for her to be with the Lord like she wanted to be."
Looks like the Judge has seen through the grandstanding and demagoguery.... http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/03/22/schiavo/index.html Judge denies request to restore Schiavo's feeding tube Attorneys for parents to petition appellate court Tuesday, March 22, 2005 Posted: 8:20 AM EST (1320 GMT) TAMPA, Florida (CNN) -- A federal judge on Tuesday denied an emergency request to reinsert a feeding tube for Terri Schiavo, a brain-damaged woman at the center of a national legal battle over her life. Attorneys for Schiavo's parents will file an appeal at the 11th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Atlanta, Georgia. Schiavo has been without food or water since Friday, when a state judge ordered her feeding tube removed at her husband's request. The ruling by U.S. District Judge James Whittemore in Tampa came after Congress and President Bush enacted legislation aimed at allowing federal courts to review Schiavo's case. (Full story) In denying the emergency request by attorneys for Schiavo's parents, Bob and Mary Schindler, Whittemore wrote that they did not not have a "substantial likelihood of success" on the merits of their arguments. "This court concludes that Theresa Schiavo's life and liberty interests were adequately protected by the extensive process provided in the state courts," the judge wrote. He acknowledged the "gravity of the consequences of denying injunctive relief." "Even under these difficult and time strained circumstances, however, and not withstanding Congress' expressed interest in the welfare of Theresa Schiavo, this court is constrained to apply the law to the issues before it," the ruling said. Terri Schiavo's husband, Michael, insists that his wife would never want to continue to live in her condition -- what Florida courts have deemed a "persistent vegetative state." People in such a condition cannot think, speak or respond to commands and are not aware of their surroundings. Terri Schiavo, 41, collapsed in her home in 1990, suffering from heart failure that led to severe brain damage. Michael Schiavo said his wife suffered from bulimia that resulted in a potassium deficiency that triggered the heart failure. He vows to carry through with what he calls his wife's wish not to live in such a condition, saying, "I will stick by Terri." "When Terri's wishes are carried out, it will be her wish. She'll be at peace, she'll be with the Lord," Michael Schiavo said Monday. "This is what Terri wants. She does not want to be in this condition. She does not want to exist in this condition, and I'm going to carry out what she wanted." But Schiavo's parents point to the absence of a living will, or written document, clearly spelling out her wishes. They argue that their daughter's due process rights have been violated and that she, as a Roman Catholic, would not have wanted to die. They also contend that their daughter's condition could improve with treatment. Her parents are facing an uphill battle. Repeated court rulings have held that Michael Schiavo is his wife's legal guardian and has the right to make decisions regarding her care. At the federal court hearing Monday, the judge grilled the Schindlers' attorney about the constitutionality of their case. Michael Schiavo, who was not at the hearing, visited his wife at a hospice in Pinellas Park on Monday. He said it is going to be hard when she finally dies. "I've cried many tears so far, trust me," he told CNN's Larry King. "I made a promise to Terri. I'm going to stick by her side, and I'm going to do this for her. Terri is not a piece of property that you pass back and forth. She didn't say, 'Well, when I become sick, give me back to my parents.' " He and his attorney, George Felos, said Terri made it clear years ago that she would not want to live in such a condition -- even though she never made a living will. They said she once made the comment to her best friend after seeing an emotional movie in which a character was in such a state. "She said, 'No tubes for me,' " Michael Schiavo said. Asked if he would feel bad if his wife died and medical experts later figured out a way for her to have had a better life, he said that was a medical impossibility. "Let's be realistic, Larry. You can't regrow a brain," he said. Meanwhile, outside the hospice, Terri's brother thanked supporters on his family's behalf and said they remain optimistic the feeding tube will be reinserted. At the same time, he said it is disturbing to visit his sister without the feeding tube. "She's still alert, but we're going on four days now, and we're slowly watching my sister being starved to death," Bobby Schindler said. "It's a surreal situation when you walk in there, and you realize you're watching a loved one slowly being starved to death and dehydrated to death. It's hard to describe."
In the Daily News this morning they were talking about a law that Jr. passed as governor that let a hospital turn off the life-support system of a child whose family couldn’t afford to keep him alive anymore. Is this true? Does anyone know about this? Hypocrite
Well, I was not happy about all of the congressional actions ... until I've heard a few more details about the situation. Originally posted by krosfyah I principle, I agree with you. However, in this matter: 1. Over 20 judges have heard this case already. I'm not convinced that judges, bound by laws, can always do what's best for an individual. 2. Not one doctor that's conducted a personal evaluation has offered a positive conclusion. Is that true? I heard a doctor interviewed that said he spent a total of 10 hours evaluating her, and claims that she can be rehabilitated to the point that she could even speak again. She's not in a vegetative state. If I heard correctly, the doctor claimed that 33 doctors feel that she can be rehabilited, more than the few that didn't. He also has videos of patients who were worse off than Sciavo and learned to speak again. 3. After 15 years, she has no signs of improvement. Reportedly, the husband has not permitted rehab. 4. The husband, the ONLY individual with the right to do so, is making the request to end her life. There are circumstances where the husband would lose such rights. * How did Sciavo get her bones broken? * Was there evidence that she was strangled? * After Sciavo got in her condition, why did it take the husband 7 years ... and a new relationship (which has now resulted in 2 children)... before he mentioned his wife's wishes? I wondered why he didn't just divorce his wife if her family wants to give her a chance, but it's not just that he won't get the $1 million inheritance, the family believes that he may not want her talking about what really happened. This may be a perfect example of how judges may not be able to do what's 'right'. If the husband did harm his wife but it cannot be proven beyond reasonable doubt in court, then his wife would get screwed (isn't that correct, MadMax?) It sounds to me, by every immaginable measure, this case has been given its due process. This is a simple matter of politicians grand-standing. Again, my thoughts early on, but after listening to her family, I'm no longer convinced of that. I always had a problem with the husband pursuing her death against the wishes of her parents and siblings. Esp. her parents. What this situation come down to for me: 1) Apparently, many medical professionals feel that her condition can improve; 2) The parents and siblings have no ulterior motives. and should be the ones determining her fate.
