If Astros do lock him in for 10 yrs then you better remove Tal's Hill or shift him to right field. For 10 yrs you don't want that guy to even twist an ankle if they can help it. He's already on the record saying that he doesn't like it. He told Mark Berman that after the playoff game where he had run back onto the hill to catch a fly ball by Renteria if not mistaken.
They could always work out a 10 year deal, with a mutual option after the 6th or 7th year. No team, or player, ever wants a lock-solid 10-year deal no matter what. So much could happen in that time, that it wouldn't be good business for both sides... but, if there is an option, then its basically the original contract that we all wanted him to sign, plus if we're happy after the 7 years, we could keep him another 3. That being said, Beltran is good... but not at the expense of your other good players. He can't win alone on this team.
Give it to him? A career .284 hitter. Yes, he has all the tools, and is an amazing athlete, but look what happened to the Rangers when they gave all their working capital to one guy. I would love it if he stayed in Houston, but not at the cost of the team. DD
He wouldn't have to, thats the point. Try this future roster on for size: C-Chavez/Gimenez(maybe 2 mil max) 1B-Berkman(10 mil a year) 2b-Burke/Conrad or FA option(anywhere from minimum to 3-4 mil a year) ss-everett(3-4 mil a year) 3b-ensberg/FA(4-5 mil) LF-Lane(again 5 mil or so in a few years) CF-Beltran(15-17 mil) RF-Taveras(minimum) I see about 50 mil spent on that position player/bench list. And I was being potentially being generous with lane/morgan/everett(who could be cheaper or replaced by low cost efficient FA signings) Starting pitching Oswalt(8-10 mil) Miller(4-5 mil or so) Backe(minimum, who knows) Buckholz(minimum) Bullpen Qualls(minimum, who knows) Wheeler(see qualls) Harville(see qualls) Lidge(6-8 mil a year possibly more but he is a closer) That payroll would be 75 mil or so, and needing a cheap 5th starter and a couple more bullpen arms. Plus, I think I was more than generous on ensberg, lane and possibly everett's salaries, and as good as lidge is, so that 50 mil I allotted on the position players could be chopped down and used to upgrade pitching as the club sees fit. And that is just factoring an 80 mil payroll(which could increase due to Beltran's presence on this club: merchandising, TV appearances, etc) I think this is easily financially feasible for Houston, especially if McClane is willing with a big time winner and team exposure around Beltran to take a few losses if it had to happen.
Guys...the 10 yr thing might be our only hope. We may not have the cash that the Yanks or Cubs have...but they may not be willing to give Carlos 10 yrs. I say we lock him up...10 yrs/200 mil and call it a day. the 1st 5 yrs he will pd above the mkt...the last 5 will be under for a 5 tool player
People, you're playing boras' game. he's trying to get somebody to set parameters on years. He first wants us to get on record on the number of years. The first demand is never the final position. He wants us to lock in Beltran at 7-8 years, which is good relative to the contracts of other premier players. If we commit to 10 years, we're sunk. Boras then plays the Beltran's worth 18 mil per year card. We'll then have a hard time denying that fact. You multiply the dollars times the years and viola, you have a beautiful contract for beltran. Our response must be - we are very interested in Beltran and are willing to talk length of contract, possibly up to 10 years. Vague? Yes. The shorter the contract, the more per year we will go. The longer, the less per year. Baseball contracts are guaranteed so to Beltran, it doens't really matter. The net present value of the contract is the driving force. Let's say it another way. Say the Stros are willing to give 16 mil over 7 years, a very aggressive offer in my mind. That's 112 mil total. He can have 112 mil over 7 years or over 10 years, I really don't care. I'd give him either.
You've got to wonder what baseball salaries are going to look like in ten years, heck we might even have a salary cap by then but I'm not holding my breath. Still if we're going to do a 10/150 I'd only do it at an even 15 per year. I don't want to see a 37 yr. old Beltran making 20-25 million those last few seasons. (Even though by that time he'll have led the Stros to several WS) Give it to him and hopefully Kent comes back too for one more run. There's nothing I'd like to see more than just one full season of Miller, Pettitte, and Beltran along with the rest. C'mon Drayton get this done.
The problem with your thinking is that you got to realize that we are a mid-market team and have been for however long Drayton's been our owner. That's why everyone on this board goes in thinking with any possible signing or trade, "how is that going to affect our mid-market budget?" I'm pretty sure we all agree with you on the fact that Drayton has a boatload of money and if Carlos wanted a 17-18 million dollar contract over 10 years then its easily possible but you just got to look at the history of this team. If Drayton doesn't want to go over "his" own salary cap and the signing of Carlos for all that money is detrimental to the team (resigning of roy-o, lance, miller) than it wouldn't matter having Carlos anyways because we're not going to win. I wish Drayton would be an owner that just cares about winning at all costs but history says that ain't gonna happen unless we get another owner.
This is why you're not an MLB general manager. They may go ahead and give it to him, but it is CLEARLY not as balck and white as you make it out. In either case, the argument that Drayton has a lot of personal wealth or you're not going to worry about the future, even if it is long-term are not going to get you a job as a baseball GM.
I agree with what someone else said.....Boras is just trying to get the numbers up. I think Beltran will end up with a deal anywhere from 5-8 years. I do believe that in 10 years we'll be regretting the deal if we did somehow sign him to one, but I don't think that's even going to happen. We need to offer him 6 years 7th team option starting at 15-17 mil and raising each year until the 7th year, which would be around 20 mil (at that I doubt we'd pick up the option, but who knows). Pugs
I say pay him. In 5 years, 16 - 17 million for Beltran will be a freaking steal. Lock that dude up for the rest of his career.
I proved that I can build a competitive team around Beltran with the Astros financial situation, compromising all the future talent in the organization, I might add(including big extensions for a bunch of the young core). I guess I did that for fun, right? I'm sorry, but I am thinking about the future of the franchise by wanting this guy back even for 10 years. He is one of the best players in the game, plays a premium position and is all of 27 years old. If you think he will be one of the top 5 players in the game for the next decade(which I do) you don't hesitate because of the length of a contract. By signing Beltran I am putting my future in the best hands possible. He is the best player on the Astros team. The Astros need someone to lead them after Biggio/Bagwell hang it up in the next two or three years. There is no better player for the job than Carlos Beltran. And if you are so worried about a 10 year deal, you can work provisions in to make it more amenable for both parties. The astros are more like a mid/large market team than a mid market team only. They can hold a payroll in the 75-80 mil range and be successful on and off the field. I'm not asking them to trade everyone to fit him in, and they would not have to. I feel strongly about this issue because there are only a handful of Carlos Beltran caliber talents this young in MLB, and they don't come around very often. Plus like I mentioned earlier, Chan Ho Park is the contract that cost Texas. With his wasted 15 mil a year, they could've gotten 3 or 4 above average pitchers. And besides that, I would agree if it got into the A-Rod territory(25 mil per) that I would look elsewhere. But I'm figuring owners realize how stupid that kind of contract is now. Vladimir Guerrero, another one of the young players I'd build a franchise around, got 15 mil last offseason, so I don't see A-Rod two happening again.
No way. Since the contract will be guatanteed there is no way the Astros do this. 10 years in the neighborhood of 15-18 million per year is just to much of a risk for a .284 hitter. I love the guy and want him here but I dont see this as a smart business decision.
10 years/15-18 million....that leaves the astros with no money to sign other players, and after 5-6 years, people are saying the same thing about beltran that theyre saying about bagwell now. beltran had an amazing post season, yes, but he didnt fare as well in the regular season. i remember listening to 610 and john and lance commenting about how beltran wasnt a that great of a fit for MMP offensively because he hits the ball to center a lot. with such a big center field, what would be homers or hits at other parks are outs at MMP. thats why he only hit .268 here... no way should the astros give up so much, unless they dont want to be able to sign any other players. with a contract like that, the astros could easily become the KC Royals South....
Just because peopel would be saying it doesn't mean they'd be right. We've been able to sign/pay Wagner, Hidalgo, Kent, Pettitte and Beltran (for half of this year) with Bagwell's contract. Plus, if we do sign Beltran, that means we did it while Bagwell was still under contract, proving this theory false already.
