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Another thread on Kobe's Place in History, but with a slight twist.

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by dharocks, May 20, 2012.

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Among All-Time Great SGs, is Kobe Closer to Jordan, or the rest of the field?

  1. Closer to MJ

    46.9%
  2. Closer to the rest

    43.9%
  3. He's not clearly better than the others.

    9.2%
  1. dharocks

    dharocks Contributing Member

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    I think that, with some exceptions, the vast majority of NBA fans will agree that Kobe Bryant is the greatest SG in NBA history who isn't named Michael Jordan. Most would say that among shooting guards, MJ is in a stratosphere of his own.

    That said, I would actually argue that Kobe is as well, in a manner of speaking. Though not as good as his #23, in my mind he's clearly better than the rest of the field by some margin (unless you consider Oscar Robertson a SG).

    So, if we were to accept the above premise, the breakdown of great 2 guards looks something like this:

    Tier 1
    Michael Jordan

    Tier 2
    Kobe Bryant

    Tier 3
    Jerry West, Clyde Drexler, Dwyane Wade, George Gervin, Walt Frazier, Allen Iverson

    Personally, I'm torn. On the one hand, I'm inclined to believe that any one of the Tier 3 guys could have won those first three titles with Shaq. If that's true, Kobe's advantage in championships shouldn't necessarily be taken at face value, IMO. On the other hand, ultimately it's hard to argue with the hardware. What say you?
     
  2. Jontro

    Jontro Member

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    The twist really got me. Will watch the movie again.
     
  3. Mr. Space City

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    closer to jordan.

    while other great perimeter players maybe could have won with a prime shaq, let's not forget he won 2 titles after shaq.

    he had a brilliant finals in 09 against the magic.
     
  4. Sleepy Flloyd

    Sleepy Flloyd Member

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    I Say if you replace Kobe with Crazy Legs from da movie Dont Be A Menace, Shaq would still ring off dem 3 straight titles. Dude was unstoppable, averged like close to 40/20 at one point in da playoffs, and that was missin half his free throws
     
  5. wekko368

    wekko368 Member

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    32 ppg with a 43% fg % is a brilliant performance? In that case, what do you call Gasol's 19 ppg while shooting 60% from the field?
     
  6. Mr. Space City

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    32/7/6 (shooting .360% from 3) with 1.4 spg and 1.4 bpg was a brilliant performance. gasol was great as well.

    <iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/f42xjUtR39c" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
     
  7. ApuN

    ApuN Member

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    This whole argument is ridiculous.

    Kobe began his career with a playoff squad and he was paired with the most dominant center of his era that already led a team to he finals.

    You Kobe lovers just refuse to accept that he is overrated. I put Elgin Baylor ahead of him.

    He is more like tier 3 or 4.
     
  8. wekko368

    wekko368 Member

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    Sorry, but no. It wasn't a brilliant performance. It was a typical Kobe performance consisting of a low fg% and a high usage rate.
     
  9. ItsMyFault

    ItsMyFault Contributing Member

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    <iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Bywj2QTnA7E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

    <iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/GDrRVMueP38" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

    Just realized, chose the wrong poll option. Meant to pick he's closer to Jordan.
     
  10. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    Did you forget Kobe's second part of his career when he was paired with a borderline all-star PF and won two titles with him?

    Kobe is rated just fine unless you are saying he's better than Jordan or Magic or something silly like that.

    Tier 2 IMO he would be right in there.

    Tier one would include the likes Jordan, Magic, Wilt, guys like these even Hakeem.

    Tier 2 would be for the Kobe's, Malone, Nash just off the top of my head.
     
  11. onreego

    onreego Member

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    I'm sure if lebron had that type of performance you'd be throwing the finals MVP his way.
     
  12. TdashDUB

    TdashDUB Contributing Member

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    So you believe Nash and Kobe are on the same playing level?
     
  13. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    I hate to say it but the borderline allstar PF is a legit all star not a perennial one but legit.
     
  14. NBA_Elite

    NBA_Elite Member

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  15. NBA_Elite

    NBA_Elite Member

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    MJ has 4 more MVPs and FMVPs than Kobe while Kobe only has more rings than the rest, I think it's pretty obvious.

    .
     
  16. CantBeRight

    CantBeRight Member

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    Of the rest he's closest to Jordan but Jordan is clearly miles better
     
  17. roslolian

    roslolian Member

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    Honestly the more I see this graphic the more I think MJ was overrated. Sure MJ won 6 rings, but the Bulls were already good enough to reach the finals without him, getting 6 rings is no surprise. If Kobe or Lebron had been born that time and was drafted by the Bulls I think they might actually have more, simply because Kobe/LBJ wouldn't retire 2 times and break up the dynasty.

    Sure MJ put up a ton of his points, but his team was like the Cleveland cast except with HOF talent: except for the "sidekick" nobody on the team could create their own shot. The result was that MJ could take tons of shots. Admittedly he shot an amazing FG% for most of his career, but then again was played in a league that still had a lot of unathletic white dudes playing when they had no business being there. To be quite honest, it was a lot like Chamberlain toying with unathletic white big men during his time.
     
  18. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    You got me with that twist, but after some consideration I would say that Kobe is in tier one. He's not as good as Jordan, but he's definitely in the top tier. I'd move everyone in tier three up one.
     
  19. Mr. Space City

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    [​IMG]
     
  20. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    Nope, a Tier system would mean not everyone on the same tier is equal. Still though Nash was a great great player in his prime.

    Before Kobe he was a borderline All-star, and in his 14 year career been to the All-star game 4x.

    Real perennial all-stars are Kobe Bryant, in his 16 year career has gone to 14 all-star games.
     

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