I thin kthe two parent Household is overrate and basically it is most stable because . .we as a society support it more than any other form . . . as a society we attempt to Funnel households into that mold I think we need to rethink and rework what we *think* of as Family and then start supporting Families. . . not the IDEAL Families [Basically if you not OUR KIND OF FAMILY . .you not a Family and there for you are yours are Flawed . . . i don't beleive in that] Rocket River The perscription for the Reclamation of this 'lost' generation is a bitter bitter pill that this country is no where near accepting, IMO
if you think that having a father as a male role model is "overrated" then I don't know what in the world to say to you. yes let's just "rethink" thousands and thousands of years of human family relations because the american black family structure is broken. just at least admit there is a major problem.
just name ONE other human society that does not have adult males in the family structure. quit being a space cadet and dancing around the issue.
i wish y'all would stop the piling on RR. He has some perspective on this and I'd genuinely like to hear his ideas.
You know how we could gauge this even further? How many of us arguing in this thread are actually black?
The world is about change and I don't consider the lack Family Structure BROKEN it is Different but in American, Different does equal bad so the attitudes toward it are not surprising I don't want to get too too deep into my personal solutions to these issues It starts at Schools and At Churches It start with change the way we teach . . . and what we teach IMO you can teach at home but it is practiced in schools School is the primary socialization of you kids school for 8 solid hrs a day then home which consists or a small subset [you family] - which you may not socialize beyond TV, Internet, etc PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY - *LOL* those that have the montra make me laugh cause they rarely try to see the Effect society has on the person [Sociology] and want to think every person lives in a Vacuum very limited short term thinking . .. very funny Of course the person has a level of responsibility however If a society does not serve the person .. . why should the person serve the society? It is a Two Way Street. enough for now . . . Rocket River If you really want to chat use the email buttons. . . I don't have time to really chat too much here only to hear the Knee Jerk Reactions and Scripted Reactions People no interested in a solution but more interested in trying to place blame.
It certainly is a complicated issue, and family is not the only socialization of kids. But it certainly is a pretty big part. Studies have shown that kids with 2 parents do better than kids in single parent households. Then again, maybe kids with 2 parents live in better communities as far as crime and poverty are concerned. Sounds to me like you are talking a bit about yourself here. You're the one who started playing victim and saying a 2 parent household is overrate. Talk about a knee- jerk reaction. And apparently you are concerned, above all, about deflecting any responsiblity whatsoever from the black community.
the two parent household is trending downward in across all segments of America. the reason its a problem more in the black community is because single mothers tend to be poor. if a woman has a steady good paying job, and she has a good support system, why do you have to have two parents. one of the main reasons kids feel it is a negative not to have a father is because society tells you that it is a negative not to have a father. I don't totally agree with rr, but some of you guys are being a bit ridiculous yourselves. since you won't to bring up the entire history of humans, lets examine why most societies have two parent households. maybe its because most societies have been male dominated and that most women would have no chance raising a kid without a man bringing home the bacon. that isn't necessary in today's america. the real issue is poverty. and if these men are broke themselves, the two parent home loses its purpose. now that's not to say its better for a kid to have both parents but it isn't the main issue.
we've already established this these "men" were probably too young and immature to have kids so why is better for them to be there?
Society didn't make these kids not apply themselves in school. Society didn't make them quit school. Society didn't make them have unprotected sex. Society didn't make them choose crime instead of hard work There is a little thing in this world called free will. Everytime you blame all your problems on society you slap the face of all those who under bad conditions persevered and made something of themselves. Personal responsibility is not a "montra" its a way of life. Racism is not exclusive to the black community. However it seems like every other race seems to take advantage of the opportunities that this country affords and works hard to achieve some level of success. I'm not trying to downplay the hardships that the black community has endured, but they are not alone in that struggle. As far as single parents go, I don't think that a person living with one parent can't make it in this world, but the one parent has to give a damn about what's going on in the house. As a parent it is a must that you make your kids finish high school at the bare minimum. There are not many opportunities for a person these days without a high school degree. There are not an abundance of factory jobs like there were in the past. You can't even get a job in a plant now with out an associates degree or some sort of additional training. As a parent one needs to be extremely involved in your kids life. If your unemployed kid is driving a 50,000 vehicle and wearing jewelry draped around his neck then maybe that's a red flag that something shady going on. My parents would have kicked my ass if they knew that I was involved in criminal activity, but I don't think these parents really care. Sometimes it seems like the black community is its own worst enemy (ie black on black crime, drug use, crime, teen pregnancy, dropout rates, role models). If they don't take a long hard look at themselves and fix what's in their power to control, then we'll still be having this conversation fifty years from now.
One parent households are like a car with at least one flat tire. Sure, it's driveable but it's a lot harder than if all tires had air. Poverty is indeed a big part of the problem, but you overrate that. Blacks have lived in poverty for the last 200 years in America, but the rampant excessive "negative" behavior (as compared to American society in general) has ramped up severely over the last 3 decades. The breakdown of 2 parent black families has followed the same trend. Poverty has also increased but not in the same meteoric way the other two have. When you have 2 poor parents who are determined to do the right things (like take responsibility for their children), poverty can be overcome and the children will be well-adjusted. When you have a single pair of eyes at home, it's a lot easier for the children to get off track. From my experience, the difference between the single mothers who had well-adjusted children and those who's kids got off track was the single-minded determination of the mother to be well-informed about the kids lives. Income level had zero to do with it (though I obviously realize income helps). Some of these women are amazing and their children turned out well, even though they were poor. Others had much better jobs, but being a single parent exhausted them and their kids got away with things starting early in life and paid the price later. Your statement "one of the main reasons kids feel it is a negative not to have a father is because society tells you that it is a negative not to have a father" is so ridiculous I won't bother saying much about it. You and I couldn't disagree more on any subject whatsoever. I'll be kind and say this is a cop out in the extreme. To each his own, but I can't believe you actually posted that. But you are entitled to your opinion.
I believe very strongly in the concept of free will. But when you know some of these kids and are aware of the environment they face at home, in their neighborhoods and at some of the pathetic schools they attend, you also realize that kids are also products of their surroundings and these surroundings have a huge effect on the decisions their free wills make. The consistent reinforcement of negatives on a daily basis is very difficult to overcome, probably much more than you are aware.
You stated that well. It takes extrordinary courage to rise above when everyone and everything around you is encouraging taking the easy way out (falling back into the system). We need to find a way to help change that. Such as equitable funding of all schools (their should not be a disparity it teacher salaries), programs where students are encouraged and challenged to succeed (stay in school, safe sex etc....). The answers aren't easy but worth it.
Deflecting Responsibility Understanding something in its entirety is Deflecting Responsibility??? Knowing the Flu is cause by a Virus . . .helps one cure it Just treating the cough means nothing . .. if you don't cure the virus know thing causes of behaviors will help one cure it Pure and Simple. We are so busy screaming by the Symptoms we want to ignore the cause The TWO PARENT home - has been the ProtoType and PG brings up a good point The Economics of society has changed for centuries. . .women could not raise a child on their own or the level of difficulty was much much higher than now We want to ignore that in these Great two family homes their was abuse, infidelity,etc every ill in marriage today the only difference is women suffered in silence and simply . .'took one for the team' now They get a divorce and go on with their lives. Instantly it is a better situation for her. . cause she not getting beaten etc but now she in one of those DREADED non Male headed households . .wwoooo We cannot turn the clock back We must adjust and the failure to adjust is a Failure of society Trying to hold the social structure a mold of the 50s IS SIMPLY NOT GOING TO HAPPEN so . .rather than FIGHT the change . .adjust to it Rocket RIver
While you may see his statement as 'ridiculous' there s merit to it IF you are told you . . . you were not raise with a father.. .therefore you are flawed some folx will take it to heart. . use it as an excused to behave badly etc over time . .. it does affect you Having being raised my a single woman . . i resent the statement In fact I find the Ideal that I am innately Flawed because of my family structure Offensive . . . Yet and still you hear it everyday . . . . . Your statement about the downward trend Is in my opinion very much true IMO . . . . . Perhaps it is time to look at the Results of Integration Intended and unintended. . . .I mean a Real look Rocket River
