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Alperen Sengun is the Rockets' franchise player

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by AroundTheWorld, Jan 17, 2023.

  1. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    This season should be a developmental season, not a contending season. But coaches typically don't care about the future (unless it's their first season with a team that needs huge resetting) because their jobs are here and now. They will lose their jobs if they don't win now.
     
  2. H. Christopher

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  3. harold bingo

    harold bingo Member

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    It's not about subpar games, I don't want him traded because I think he's bad, it's exactly the opposite. I think he's way better than what he is showing here and he has tremendous value. When our team is down 25 points early in the second quarter, I think you have (broadly) two categories of coaches. You have one group who thinks "I have a plan to get back into this game and win it, and it requires Sengun." And you have another group who thinks "I have a plan to get back into this game and win it, and Sengun isn't a part of it." I don't think either one is inherently wrong, you can be a very good coach and be in either group. It's part of your personal philosophy and style as a coach. And I think Ime is a good coach. And Ime is very obviously in the second group, as we saw last night.

    But as an organization, I don't think you should pay a young guy $185 million if your coach is in that second group. It just doesn't make any sense, it's a poor allocation of salary. I want the rockets to succeed, and if we're going to play Ime-ball, then we should find a center who can play Ime-ball. Or we could get rid of Ime and find a better coach, though I'm not sure that's realistic.
     
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  4. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    In this case I am not seeing alternatives, it's like the Bucks got rid of Bud and then AJ Griffin's dad but replaced them with a worse coach in Austin's Dad Rivers.

    I am certain Rafael knows he can't get a better a coach on the fly. At least not someone that fits.

     
  5. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    A coach is never someone you hitch your wagon to for multiple years unless the name is Phil Jax someone with multiple championships.

    The coach will be the first domino to fall in this league.

    You would have traded Alpe for lesser players and Udoka might get tired of the job and join a veteran team later, that was always the risk.

    Or the coach has a fallout with management or ownership.

    It's a precarious situation but in doubt never build around your coach!

    Another way would be to offer him a FO job to save face.

     
    #16445 daywalker02, Nov 3, 2024
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2024
  6. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    I've always had the opinion that there are only two kinds of coaches, bad coaches and good coaches. Among good coaches, there's really very little difference in terms of winning. Different good coaches fit different situations. There's no such thing as elite coaches that are significantly better than other good coaches in all situations. Coaches' success depends largely on their players, players they are good at coaching.

    That's why coaches get fired all the time, not because they are bad but because they no longer fit. You definitely need to avoid bad coaches. The rest, you just need to find the coach that fits your situation.
     
  7. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    I don't think you want to get rid of a coach at the start of a season. We saw how it went with McHale's firing. (I actually didn't think McHale was as bad as people here thought.) But long term I am not sure how it will go. I hope they work out fine. One thing I am pretty sure. If the Rockets make a fire sale trade of Sengun because he and Udoka don't see eye to eye, then we are screwed.
     
  8. harold bingo

    harold bingo Member

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    Can you elaborate, and be more specific on how this applies to the current rockets team? I think I know what you mean but I don't want to put words in your mouth. How does this idea apply to Ime, Sengun, and our current roster in general?
     
  9. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    Of course we are screwed because Ime could still leave later and you are basically left with the rest of the shambles.

    And only if you are lucky you end up with someone like Atkinson, Brown or an assistant that is the next Steve Kerr.

     
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  10. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    My point is that if your coach and your star player (assuming Sengun is our star player given his contract) don't mesh, you find another coach that fit. When you fire a coach, it doesn't necessarily mean that he is a bad coach. It just means that he doesn't fit what you have.

    I am not advocating firing Udoka now. But if it is true that his coaching philosophy does not maximize a player like Sengun, then it makes more sense long term to find another coach than to trade Sengun and hope that we'll get equal value back.
     
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  11. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    Udoka won't have problems finding the next gig, the league wants to be OKC now.

    He is too ambitious.

    He might be more famous than Alperen.

    The organisation got to look out for itself.

     
  12. AroundTheWorld

    AroundTheWorld Insufferable 98er
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    I am still on the Ime train.

    But he, more so than Sengun, needs to learn from what he has been doing wrong so far this year, and especially in the Warriors game.
     
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  13. HardenReturns

    HardenReturns Member

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    FIFY
     
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  14. HardenReturns

    HardenReturns Member

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    When will we read your take on the subject then?
     
  15. HardenReturns

    HardenReturns Member

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    Maybe it's too late to say this, but don't be an idiot.
     
  16. harold bingo

    harold bingo Member

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    What exactly do you expect Ime to change? I don't see this as some minor tweak, this is fundamental to how Udoka sees basketball. A leopard can't change it's spots.
     
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  17. AroundTheWorld

    AroundTheWorld Insufferable 98er
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    I expect him to look at video and data, and to adjust how he managed the minutes and lineup combinations.

    Data-driven decisionmaking.

    I understand that preconceived notions influence decisions in the moment, but when he reviews video and data, he should see he was wrong.
     
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  18. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    Your point is valid but I think both sides should stick it out for a while, the ramifications are too complex.

    Ime does not want to come off as a coach who builds something and tears it down 1 year later.

    And Alpe is not someone who backs down easily either. Should be somewhat a compromise or truce.


     
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  19. rocketchamp

    rocketchamp Member

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    Turning on Udoka as promised. I swear I know you SOF's better than yourselves
     
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  20. the11mingdynasty

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    Almost cost us the game in regulation when there wasn’t a big in there to get the rebound when they missed both free throws.
     

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