No kidding? You went to SHS?? When did you graduate?? I recognize that difference...I recognize that I'm blind to a lot of stuff that I have not experienced; stuff you have experienced. I just want you to realize that makes you equally blind to my experience. And that just because you and I arrive at different conclusions on how to address the issue does not mean: 1. i don't acknowledge the problem 2. i dislike or don't care for minorities Having said that...I am sooo sorry this has been your experience. I hate to see ANYBODY treated disrespectfully when it's so uncalled for. I wish I could change it...for what it's worth to you, I do pray for that stuff.
What a laugher. Jews are "unaffected" by racism? Anti-Semitism doesn't exist? By the way, around 70% of American Jews identify themselves as Democrats. So, J.C. Watts was not elected on merit? The Republican Party does not choose who runs for election to Congress. Anybody can label themselves a Republican and launch an election bid. The people of Oklahoma first saw Watts' leadership ability on the football field. His conservative vision for Oklahoma got him elected, no matter how much Liberals want to discount the man. The people who "call out" Powell based on disagreements surrounding one issue can be described as "simple minded" at best. Education, retirement, healthcare, public safety, and national defense are critical issues that Powell is addressing as he serves all Americans. Black Americans who disagree with the Democratic Party are labled as "sell outs" or "Uncle Toms" by dimwits such as Harry Belafonte. As a result, Black Americans exhibit voting patterns unique in American politics. 96% of blacks voted for Al Gore last election! Guess what that means? The black voter no longer counts in Presidential elections! President Clinton helped torpedo affirmative action, ended "welfare as we know it" (to the dismay of black Democrats), and upheld crack vs. powder cocaine jail sentence disparity. He could get away with this because he knew that the black vote could be taken for granted. Democratic National leaders don't have to promise the black community a damn thing, because their vote is in the bag. Republicans know the black vote is automatically lost, so why bother? This is the result of bullying tactics on the left, and everybody loses. I can't think of anything more racist in today's society than telling a man what he can or can't think based on his skin color.
t4651965, Excellent post! Keep up the good work, we need more of you for our side. You have great potential.
On J.C. Watts....I'm told by a co-worker who lived in Oklahoma at the time of his initial election...that Watts was trailing in the polls late. His Democratic counterpart in that race ran an ad with a picture of Watts as a teenager with an afro...with a message over it saying something to the effect of, "is this who you want to be your representative?" Watts won by a large margin after that.
Maybe Powell thinks in terms of "all of America" instead of just "black America." Wait a second.....maybe that's the problem. That would be very un-black of him, wouldn't it Batman? Is that why he's being called out?
Listen you fool, I didn't post that for you to take jibes at my marriage. I posted that because most Jews (particularly in the Northeast) vote Democrat. My father in law has said as much and he was raised in Brooklyn. But I guess you're going to make a comment about that now...not because it's relevant...but because you're classless. Tell me that after you've grown up Jewish in Little Rock, AR...you may have a different opinion. I know my brother in law did after being beaten up because he was Jewish. Powell's take on affirmative action was a 30 second sound bite. The next intelligent thing YOU say in this thread...will be the first. Was it not you who asked how Powell can be a Republican while they oppose affirmative action? That is at the least questioning his motives if not his integrity. Ever hear of this nifty little thing called a primary? They have them in OK too. Anybody who can pay the fee or get enough signatures can run...and then the people decide who gets the nod. It isn't some secret committee sittring in a board room saying..."Gee it sure would be nice if we could find a black guy to run...how 'bout that football player?" Respond if you want to Batman...I likely won't respond back. You have nothing accurate to say. Your posts became more and more of the disagree with me and I will question your intelligence and morals variety and less of the Batman I had good debates with. Too bad...he was a pretty cool guy. If that Batman ever decides to come out of retirement...you know where to find me.
Originally posted by MadMax No kidding? You went to SHS?? When did you graduate?? '91 I recognize that difference...I recognize that I'm blind to a lot of stuff that I have not experienced; stuff you have experienced. I just want you to realize that makes you equally blind to my experience. I didn't have much choice to being blind to your experience. I wasn't trying to lay a trip on you or anything but I was just trying to show how that one little thing can make all the difference in experiences by two people who pretty much grew up in the same environment.
Originally posted by TheFreak Yeah, Bush just appoints minorities to high-ranking positions in his administration. What type of minority is Ashcroft? The redneck with bad haircut minority? By the way, can you or anyone else define what you think affirmative action is for me? You keep saying so and so is against it...against WHAT? Give me an example of what affirmative action is, and how someone would be against it. Don't give me quotas, the Supreme Court has already said those are unconstitutional. I'll answer your question but when white people hire white people over minorities is that a quota? When Bush gets into Yale because of his daddy what is that? But anyways, Affirmative Action in Powell's case probably went something like there being an upcoming round of promotions to General and the person doing the promoting picking Powell over similarly qualified or slightly more qualified whites because of discrimination in the past which had caused that position in the Army to be disproportionately white. I think that's pretty accurate but I'm sure Mango will correct me if I'm mistaken. Powell is black. Belafonte is black. The article features quotes by prominent black americans. If you're still not with me, THIS THREAD IS ABOUT BLACKS. But thanks for insinuating that I'm a racist again. Effective way to get people to see your side. I no more wrongly insinuated that you were racist than you wrongly insinuated that I believe Powell to be an Uncle Tom. You're obviously still unable to see the sarcasm in my prior statement in response to your ridiculous characterization of me. I don't believe you are racist and have no basis to believe you are but keep crying wolf and maybe someone will hold your hand and read you a story. This thread isn't about blacks and affirmative action. It's about Powell turning his back on the people who fought for him to have the opportunity to be in the position he is today. It's about minorities feeling betrayed that Powell stepped on the shoulders of those before him to achieve a certain amount of success only to join a party that makes little to no effort to address issues in the minority community. I also don't care for these insinuations that minorities call out their own for thinking for themselves or making their own decisions. If big oil or whoever helped GW get into office and he completely ignored them afterwards they'd be trashing him like crazy. This is not unique to race. Powell owes a debt to HIS people as much as GW owes "access" to his cronies in big business. Maybe they don't believe in looking at race in hiring practices. Seems like that is a position favorable to minorities, no? Also you have not yet established that AA is an important issue regarding minorities. Is that why Bush handpicked Powell, Rice, and Mineta? Because he doesn't believe in looking at race in hiring practices? What a load of crap. You can bet your ass that Bush upon being elected was looking through his list of "acceptable minorities" in order to feign the look of a truly diverse administration. Racism and as a result any civil rights legislation like Affirmative Action will always be important to minorities. Get your head out of the sand. Shall I ask you why the flat tax is important to fat cat Republicans? Gee I wouldn't venture a guess. Maybe, if you're swayed by such things. Appointing minorities to high-ranking positions in the administration is another way to show you care, I suppose. But perhaps you'd prefer that photo-op with LULAC. No it's just a way for Bush to say "look, I care about you because I have minorities in my cabinet" when in fact those minorities do not reflect the views of the minority community. I prefer Bush actually went into minority communities and dealt with real problems in education and dealing with poverty.
John Ashcroft is a loving family man and a *devout* Christian. For you to call him a redneck is RACIST. You are very hypocritical, I hope you are able to recognize that.
I wasn't taking a jibe at your marriage -- I was taking a jibe at your assertion that your wife's religious background coupled with her politics was somehow extraordinary. The tone I used was, I think, appropriately responsive to the tone you used and to your unprovoked personal attack. Growing up Jewish, I'm well acquainted with the history of anti-semitism. It's a little easier to spot a black guy than a Jewish one though, which is why people of color are considerably more likely to be discriminated against. I don't know what you're talking about here. I do know that he's spoken passionately and extensively about his debt to affirmative action as well as his support of it. No, it was not me. I did try and explain why certain other people might have a problem with it, but I didn't ask what you said I asked. I don't question Powell's integrity. I'd vote for him if he'd run. Watts leapfrogged many other tenured Republicans to attain his leadership position in Congress. I never suggested he didn't win his race fair and square. I suggested that he was promoted out of turn, and I'm not the only one who believes that was due to his race. Yeah, it's sad. I feel the same way about the old Refman. He used to be able to read posts he disagreed with and not take them personally. He was also successful at avoiding broad, personal swipes. Ditto. p.s. To t4651965: It might surprise you to know that I agree 100% with your appraisal of the Dem party and their tendency to blow off those groups they feel they can take for granted. They do the same thing to all of their key constituents. And they are less righteous than the opposition as a result. I also agreed with Frank Rich's editorial condemning their lack of spine or direction. The Democratic Party no longer represents the core values of its constituents. The welfare legislation was not only cynical, it was cruel. Only one reason I'm proud that I never voted for Clinton.
Calling someone a redneck isn't frikken racist. Pulease! Why does it not surprise me that you think Ashcroft to be a loving family man and a *devout* Christian. You know I just wanted to say that never, ever in my life anywhere have I ever heard of or been told that the word redneck is racist. I've lived in Texas for about 22 years and have never heard that. I seriously doubt I offended TJ but if I did I apologize. I don't even joke with racial slurs of any kind and wouldn't have used the word if I'd known it to be considered racist though I still doubt that it is and TJ is just taking an opportunity to get a shot in.
What does that mean? I never said he appoints minorities to EVERY position. Why would anyone do or expect that? I don't get it. Neither of those situations are quotas. What's your point? When the Citadel doesn't allow women what is that? Okay, so how do you make that a law? How do you implement it (legally)? I would think you would have to have an answer to those before determining whether any politician is for or against it. My bad, I guess all you minorities sound the same. I don't really care to address any of these points. You come out of left field with "blacks aren't the only minority" and "guess we all look the same", and I remind you that this thread is ABOUT blacks. Now you're saying "but it's really about Powell, etc., etc.". Well no ****. You're right. What was he thinking picking people that agreed with him on the issues? Guess the ones he chose aren't "real" minorities huh? Good one Harry. You could ask, but it wouldn't be relevant since Republicans aren't a race, last time I checked. So your answer is that Affirmative Action is an important issue to minorities because you say so? To me it's a nebulous concept that politicians can say they're "for" in order to avoid tackling real issues. But that's just me. Again with the "not real minorities" stuff. Your expectations of a president will never be met, I'm afraid. Local, city, and state governments do exist, you know. And I can't believe you think meeting with a lobbyist group to score political points and smile for the camera is more important than actually appointing minorities to high-level cabinet positions.
It may not be racist, but it is certainly something only said about white men in the South whom you dislike. It may not be overtly racist...but it has racial underpinnings.
You make a big fuss about how the Republican party doesn't support minorities and in effect discriminates against them, then you turn right around and make a racial slur about a member of another race. Furthermore, your allegations that Bush appointed Rice, Powell, and Mineta in part because of their race is not only insulting to the intelligence and achievements of these three distinguished Americans, but it is also prejudiced. This, my friends, is the definition of hypocrisy. CASE CLOSED
TJ you're really starting to piss me off. Redneck is not a racial slur and you're act is really pathetic. The word redneck appears in 151 threads on this BBS, I guess the whole damn board is racist. Well glory be... nobody better call Karl Malone a redneck either, wouldn't want to upset little TJ. Stomp your feet TJ. Your stuff on Rice and Powell is just not worth my time anymore. They're in those positions in order for Bush to have the apperance of diversity. That doesn't mean they're not qualified, it simply means Bush gains more political points for choosing a minority even if that minority's opinions vary strongly from those of their ethnicity. I know in your lilly world a Republican would never stoop to such dastardly levels but reality is a little different.
Since when are "rednecks" a race? It seems to me that it would be better described as a "lifestyle choice." After all, a redneck is defined by what he does (for example, cooking possums, playing with snakes in church, marrying cousins) and not his ethnicity. Moreover, "racism" is defined as the systematic oppression of a minority ethnic group. So if you said, "African Americans are lazy and therefore should not be allowed to attend public schools," then you'd be making a racist statement. Calling John Ashcroft a "redneck" might be inaccurate ("totalitarian" seems a better fit to me), but it's not racist. CASE CLOSED (sorry, couldn't resist that )
Racism- The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others. This definition is important, because any human can be a racist.
merriam-webster never mentions "minority" in their definition of racism: Main Entry: rac·ism Pronunciation: 'rA-"si-z&m also -"shi- Function: noun Date: 1936 1 : a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race 2 : racial prejudice or discrimination Nevertheless, I can certainly appreciate the convenience certain groups would place on your definition.
