What were the values that YOU went teaching on the other side of the world and what regime were YOU trying to change???
next time i see a guy who looks like a 'terrorist', im going to beat him with a shovel. there might be a chance that he is planning an attack, and the ends make up for the means. and if you have a problem with it, war is hell blah blah blah and people are getting killed and i just want in on the action. from now on anything that can be percieved as a threat should be destroyed and ass raped. looks like the term 'pre-emptive strike' did have ramifications on society afterall. now we are justifying pre-emptively torturing people because they might know something that might be important. sick. and like in mcdonalds, we do it with a smile on our face.
Uh oh (Vik did recall correctly)... http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=535&e=3&u=/ap/20040510/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq
What percentage of the photographed detainees were threats? That is the key statistic, not the one which you cited. Very misleading.
Are you actually trying to make the case the the US has the right to decide on a case by case basis where the Geneva Convention (the modern day protection of rights during warfare) applies and where it doesn't?
It is? If we 1) incarcerated innocents and 2) kept them incarcerated, what would lead you to the conclusion that we were able to discern the difference when torturing?
I'm really truly amazed when I read this board. I’ve never been to U.S. but I have my opinion of you and your country pretty much made… it’s not very positive, but then again I’m European But when I read the responses of some radical posters on this board it really scares me. Is this where the most powerful and influential society is trying lead the world? I can not even imagine that few of them would be innocent and that injustice was done to them, but here… we are talking about the majority of detained that are probably innocent being tortured in an inhuman way. And all this facts are documented, god knows what else is going on there when there is no one to photo the ‘party’. I’ve just one massage to all the radicals (although I know it won’t get to you). The world is not flat and the sun does not turn around your god given country.
No, let's be clear here. The outrage is over the abuse, not the false imprisonment. In a war like this, false imprisonment is simply unavoidable. Don't try to distort the issue, please. Again, what percentage of the photographed detainees were threats, creating problems inside the prison, or had vital information? This is the important statistic, not simply a gross percentage of perceived threats.
You are either absolutely insane or a budding fascist that Hitler would be proud of. To claim that there are no rules that we must live by in this (or any other) conflict is the height of madness. If this is the case, then the despicable actions in Falujiah were absolutely justified, as would have been the torture and rape (had it occurred) of the recently escaped American KBR contractor. This has begun to convince me that you must be taken in the same way the t_j is, a comic figure worthy only of derision and insults. I will withhold that judgement for now, but claiming that the Geneva Convention doesn't apply here is beyond stupid.
Giddy, because there are incidents everytime there is military conflict, is all the more reason why people should have been trained on how to deal with this, and why the command structure should be set up to prevent these kinds of acts. Instead it was set up to allow them to happen. If there is a good likelihood that these kinds of things would happen, then we should have been prepared to stop them. Instead we find out that they are widespread and appear to be tolerated if not encouraged. No matter how political or unpolitical the process of uncovering and speaking out against the abuse is, nobody should rationalize it. Yet we have people rationalizing this stuff. It's one thing to say that those who spoke out against the torture didn't offer solutions that you agreed with, but it's not reasonable that some folks would try and say the torture is ok.
You know I expected people like tj and bama to try and minimize and rationalize the treatment of Iraqi prisoners. I honestly didn't expect the outright support of the use of torture against people who might possibly have information that could be helpful in preventing attacks on U.S. troops. And somehow they see this as a war in support of American values. What country do they live in? NJRockets views about all of this are the stuff of nightmares. How many more people in our country really feel this way, but would never dare to express it? I am numb.
Actually that's not the key statistic, because even if all of the photographed ones were threats, it wouldn't justify rape, abuse, and murder.
saphan - where in Europe are you from?? i wouldn't concern yourself too much with the statements from some on this board. So far, Bush has been awfully critical of the way these prisoners were treated...and I'm not hearing any voice of support or even rationalization out in real life for this deal.
Make sure it's shiatsu, then they'll get it. Don't waste your time, these idiots just get a kick out of setting people off and post any garbage to provoke a response.
