The irony of starting a thread like this is too rich. Would you have Christians live their lives differently then? On a more general note, I could never understand -- or perhaps wholly appreciate -- what a great sin it is to "impose your personal beliefs on others." For one, that's a dramatic way of saying it, since it is more of a persistent nagging at worst. I liked the phrasing here better of a Biblical mandate to bug people. And, what exactly is the problem with that? People aren't allowed to bug other people?
Here's a question for ya'll. If you had to choose, would you rather live in a country of extreme religious laws (e.g., where people will be put to death for blasphemy, and let's say the religion of that country is not yours), or in a country of extreme atheist nature (e.g., where people will be percecuted for praticing any kind of religion)?
Wnes; That's a totally straw man argument. Given that you said that the state religion wasn't your's I'm sure everyone would pick the atheistic state especially since from a Judeo-Christian standpoint the first Commandment is "Thou shalt have no other God but me."
I see 'how' you are arguing and I think the best response has already been said by Sishir_Chang. I hope he does not mind me repasting his response: "People can pray as much as they want in public school. You just can't do it officially. That pretty much goes to everything else. IMO Christians have a view that somehow Christianity is under attack in society because they can't display their symbols or have their practices officially sanctioned by the government. All it means is that Christianity is being treated the same way as every other religion." Basically, if you think sanctioned prayer is ok, and claim that you wouldn't mind it if all other religions were sanctioned at school, do you really believe that would be for the best? How about satanism? That's a religion. Would it be ok to put satanic drawings and beliefs around your kid's school? How about verses from the Koran that tell people to kill the infidels (supposedly). Or maybe Wicca practices? If religion was allowed into school, it would cause chaos. There's a good reason that our forefathers chose to secularize the government.
I am not arguing for or against anything in this thread. I was using prayer in school as an example. I am simply stating that atheists attempt to impose their will/beliefs upon others just as you say that Christians "bug" people about their beliefs.
Your question asks whether i prefer a repressive intolerant society to a...repressive intolerant society. Two extremes. Where's the fun in that? My experience has been that a religious person has greater empathy and understanding for another religious person than for someone without spirituality. They seem more comfortable as long as you 'believe in something' rather than believe in nothing. Just my experience. And, of course, ignores the wing nuts. So...in answer to your second question...I'd say...no. The same would be true of a Muslim man, or person of another religion.
I think the distinction is in the motivation. People upset about prayer in school (for example) are generally reactionary, i.e., they are forced to act after somebody mandates "prayer time" after fourth period. Most atheists (IMO) could care less who you pray to or when. Like me, I suspect they just want others to mind their own business. I think the argument Martian is making is that most christians have trouble accepting/using this mentality.
I guess I should be more clear. Christians bug people because of their Christian beliefs (a.k.a. their religious beliefs). Atheist don't bug people because of their atheists beliefs (i.e. belief that no God exist). Atheists bug people because of their personal beliefs: Keeping religion and government seperate is a PERSONAL belief. Even some Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, etc. believe that. Other personal beliefs may include: Belief in the law of gravity Belief in Evolution Belief in freedom Belief in the Big Bang theory Belief in Aliens Belief in T-mac Everyone has personal beliefs. As a group, Christians have a SHARED religious belief that they must "spread the word". If you are Christian, you have a mandate to spread the word. If you are an atheist, you have no obligation to spread the word or do anything for that matter.
Wrong! It is the chicken and egg debate. When I went to public school we said the Lord's Prayer at the beginning of each school day and it was that way since the district was originally formed. Then it was taken away, we were FORCED to abandon our practice. And the worse part is no one wanted it stopped. Not one parent or teacher wanted it to stop. It was dropped so that the school would not lose federal funds. (money ) You might as well say that back when I was in school most Christians could care less who DIDN'T pray. And most atheists have trouble accepting the fact that we don't care if you pray or not. Why make it compulsary that no one can pray aloud, if no one objects to you not praying at all? Problem was the Christians didn't feel forced to act and they all just surrendered. I don't care if they pray in schools or not. For me, I would rather they just leave it out. But I do not like the way Indian religions are promoted, Mother earth religions are promoted, eastern religions are promoted all in public schools and Christianity is banned. (documention to follow if necessary)
Id say that one of the reasons christians share their faith (sorry if this has already been posted) is that the Bible tells them to. Its something called the great commission, and Jesus told his disciples to spread the Good News everywhere they went. so really, a christian sharing his/her faith is really someone just acting out one of the main pillars of his/her belief. unfortunately, some christians do it the wrong way and it comes accross as "imposing" their beliefs and all that stuff. its too bad that some of you have been so turned off by these people.
Allright I think you have a good point here - it is dependent on the time period. That being said, your story realy only shows that the secularist government spelled out in the US consititution was for the most part ignored until the mid 20th century. The pendulum now swings back.
Tomorrow, I have a couple of books at home I just read. Lists the class, school district and what the kids are being taught. It is a bunch of religious chants and stuff in one instance. It is celebrated as Native Indian culture in different districts, that is one example I remember. All this in federally funded public schools. I'll get on it.
