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[610] idiots on the radio this morning

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by seclusion, Jan 29, 2009.

  1. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

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    I wouldn't say that 47.5% is a significant improvement over 47.1%. That hardly qualifies as above average.

    More to the point is T-Mac's performance in the fourth quarter where he once again failed to make a bucket and made some extremely questionable decisions down the stretch.

    This team has a long history of choking in the fourth, usually associated with offensive droughts. Is it any coincidence that it rears its ugly head when T-Mac returns?
     
  2. DaDream

    DaDream Member

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    I hate when Andre Ware tries to talk basketball on the radio. He REALLY needs to stick to football. He sounded like an idiot this morning.
     
  3. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    Let's see: 2/6 from the field in the first quarter. That's his teammates fault, right? He only played 3 minutes in the second, going 2/2 from the line (and he gets the ball stolen from him on another play). He played 10 minutes in the 3rd, going 0-1 from the field and getting the ball stolen from him (again). Should we blame his teammates, when they went 10-19 from the field in the third quarter? Not sure about that. And in the 4th, he gets the ball stolen from him 3 times, but he does go 3/4 from the field.

    Let's recap. In 34 minutes, Yao gets 11 shots at the basket, and he had the ball taken away from him 5 times. And it's his teammates fault because they wouldn't feed him the ball.

    I wish CCR still did his analysis of Yao's touches after games. This game would be an interesting case.
     
  4. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

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    Way back when Steve Francis asked the Big O what he should do when Yao was struggling. What did the Big O say? Feed him some easy baskets, set him up, get him into rhythm and rolling. None of that happened in last night's game. There was no attempt to establish Yao in the low post. Not only did he not take a lot of shots but he hardly ever touched the ball. And when the Rockets did get him the ball it was so obvious what was happening that other defenders had time to switch off of their guy and blindside Yao.

    Also note that while Yao had 5 TO's T-Mac had 4.

    The team is broken. Go read Yao's interview thread. It's time to break it up.
     
  5. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    But it does qualify for "below average", as you put it? Look, you and some others were trying to make the point that Tracy somehow had a bad offensive night based on efficiency. He didn't in my estimation.

    Is that more to the point for you than Yao getting the ball stolen from him 3 times in the fourth quarter? I can live with shots that are missed, when they are taken within the offense. It's unnecessary turnovers that frustrate me. We can question McGrady's decision to not drive hard to his right on the last possession. I agree. But we also know that he has a weak left knee, and he hasn't exploded going to his right all season because of it. So you can call that an "extremely questionable decision", but I wouldn't go that far.

    There have been countless times when we have not had McGrady in a game, and we totally choke in the 4th quarter. It's happened in this very season on a number of occasions.

    By and large, history shows that we are a far better executing team in the 4th quarter when we have McGrady. If you actually look at the evidence in an objective manner, I guarantee that's what you'll find.
     
  6. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    As I've said many times, "establishing Yao" is much easier said than done.

    All of Yao's turnovers were other players just stealing it from him. You say he didn't get enough touches, but on five different occasions he had opportunities that he just fumbled away. That's kind of an important detail, don't you think?
     
  7. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

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    McGrady went 8 for 20 from the field for a conversion rate of .400. His numbers may fall in line with the league average but what about the average for elite, max salary players? The guy's underperforming for his salary.

    Two, he's still making crappy decisions. What's the point of calling Yao out to set a pick if he's not going to try to drive past Dalambert? We know Dalambert has height and that he's an excellent shot blocker. Does it really make sense to try and jump shoot over him? Of course not.

    Three, regarding Yao's TO's Yao ended up the night with 5, but McGrady ended the night with 4. None of the other Rockets ended up with more than 2.

    Finally, I don't remember too many fourth quarter choke jobs with McGrady on the bench. If you have any specific games in mind let's hear them.
     
  8. SuperStar

    SuperStar Member

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    It wasn't just Yao's fault Rockets loss.

    Yao- Couldn't grab a rebound to save his life and was a turnover machine everytime he tried to post. Dalambert got his number.

    AB- Can't shoot.

    Even though with those 2 not showing up the entire game there was still a chance to win but Tmac couldn't pull it through.
     
  9. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

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    A TO's a TO. I'd say a crappy pass is just as bad as having the ball stolen from.

    My point is that T-Mac had one few TO than Yao. No other Rocket had more than 2. Are you suggesting that T-Mac should have gotten fewer touches given the number of times he coughed it up?
     
  10. seclusion

    seclusion rip chadwick

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    I'll do you one better, I'm pretty certain he doesn't even watch the games. maybe periodically, but he definitely doesn't watch them nearly as much as someone who talks about them for a living should.
     
  11. northeastfan

    northeastfan Member

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    Maybe that's precisely our problem ... too many intangibles. For example, the Celtics have tangibles. They're called point differential, wins and rings.
     
  12. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    That's a different issue. A poster said that McGrady shot below average for wing players. Not below average compared to the likes of Dwyane Wade, LeBron James, and Kobe Bryant.

    That wasn't McGrady's decision. Watch the Adelman post game conference. The plan was a PnR, and they discussed the fact that they'd switch. That was the intended play out of the timeout.

    Turnovers have to be understood based on touches. I'm not arguing that McGrady should have gotten more touches, as you are with Yao. You think we should have gone to Yao far more, when as is he already had the ball taken from him 5 times. When a guys efficiency with the ball (taking everything into account, including protecting the basketball) is so poor as it was with Yao yesterday, I see no compelling reason to actually force feed the ball into him more.

    The Utah game comes immediately to mind. We go 5-28 from the field in the fourth quarter and 1st overtime. Yao is 2-11 from the field in that span. We're running the offense primarily through him. Fortunately we smarten up in the 2nd overtime, exploit the Artest on Brewer matchup, and pull out the win. There's the loss to Indiana back in November. We shoot 5-18 from the field, commit 5 turnovers in the period, blowing a double digit lead. No McGrady to blame that on.

    Even more recently, take the Atlanta game. That came after a terrible loss in Toronto with McGrady. No McGrady in Atlanta. Look at the gameflow:

    http://popcornmachine.net/cgi-bin/gameflow.cgi?date=20090103&game=HOUATL

    Note that Yao does nothing in the fourth, and Atlanta makes a 7-0 run as soon as he reenters the game. After scoring 16 points in the first half, Yao gave the Rockets 0 in the second half.

    Or more recently still, the Lakers game on 1/13:

    http://popcornmachine.net/cgi-bin/gameflow.cgi?date=20090113&game=LALHOU

    We're leading by 4 entering the final quarter, and we end up losing by 5. What does Yao do in that period? 0-4 from the field, 0 points.

    And there are many more examples one could run through from previous years (e.g. terrible losses to New Orleans and Philadelphia last January due to fourth quarter choke jobs, just prior to McGrady's return).
     
  13. redao

    redao Member

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    Yao= 4th quarter collapses
     
  14. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    I wouldn't say that, but nor does it make sense to say that McGRady = 4th quarter collapses.

    Problems in the 4th quarter is a team problem.
     
  15. HeyDude

    HeyDude Member

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    I've never bought too much on the the rhythm thing. Sure it plays a factor, agreed with that part. But how much? A great player doesnt need the ball in his hands every possesion to make an impact. I'll give you a couple examples. KG. He does NOT have the ball in the low block every time. Same with Duncan (more similar to Yao as he's good down low in case you think KG was a bad example). They still find ways to make impact on the game. The point is, just because you dont have the ball in your hands EVERY friggin trip down does not mean you can't have a positive impact on the floor. How about just keep running in the flow of the game? Rebound more ? Or play excellent D? Neither were the case in Yao's game last night.

    I understand the fact that we did not feed Yao the ball every time (nor would I have if he's tumbling and fumbling half the game). But Yao is not a baby. We should not have to feed him the ball every time down the court for him to be effective in the game. For examples of what resulted when we went inclusively to him only in previous games, durvasa has already done the H.W for us.
     
  16. joesr

    joesr Member

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    Rockets = 4th quarter collapses you mean?
     
  17. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

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    1) T-Mac is below average for the amount of money he's making.
    2) Adelman wanted the ball in T-Mac's hands for the last play. Just about nobody wants him to take a long range jumper over a center who's got a reputation as a shot blocker. Again, terrible decision making by T-Mac.
    3) T-Mac had 4 TO's to Yao's 5. Again, are you suggesting that T-Mac should have gotten fewer touches given that he had twice as many TO's as any other Rocket except for Yao? What's your argument, that Yao shouldn't have gotten the ball because he was turning it over? How does that not apply to T-Mac then?
    a) Similarly T-Mac went scoreless in the fourth while Yao was hitting shots. By your logic shouldn't Yao have gotten the ball?
    4) You have a funny definition of choke job. The Rockets had the lead in the fourth by a sizable margin in last night's game. The same holds true in the NY game. They choked away the lead.
    a) Utah doesn't count simply because the Rockets won.
    b) The biggest lead in the Atlanta game was four points. Both teams started the quarter tied. Not a choke job, just a close game.
    c) The Lakers? Seriously? Again, a good close game and the Rockets never enjoyed the kind of double digit lead they had (and choked) away in the NY and Philly games.

    Like it or not the choking made its reappearance with McGrady and it's no coincidence. Under pressure McGrady folds and goes back to what he knows best--one on one basketball. No offense, no system, offensive stagnation, loss.
     
  18. northeastfan

    northeastfan Member

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    And worst of all, no defense.
     
  19. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

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    A retooled Rockets offense that focused on Yao while McGrady was out won 5 out of 6. That Rockets team didn't piss away leads in the fourth quarter either.

    Yao doesn't need to touch the ball on every run down the court, but last night he was underutilized. Listen to Adelman's press conference last night where he talks about running an inside-out game and how the Rockets don't have that.
     
  20. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    Yeah, most wives and gfs who don't know much about basketball think Yao look dumb on the court and isn't much of a basketball player.

    The fact is, when Yao is playing good and dominating, he looks good and smooth. But when he isn't playing well, he looks like someone's grandpa trying to do kid things.
     

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