He played the system perfectly, why does that make Luhnow a douchebag? Everything would have been fine if Aiken had a healthy elbow.
It was a mistake by Luhnow - no doubt about it, and some teams were really unhappy about the outcome.
He treated a person like a piece of meat. It was absolutely within the rules but showed no humanity or regard for players. Players and agents were pissed at the Astros as were other teams who suddenly had to be more careful and work harder negotiating with draftees and free agents That was Luhnow's M.O. = find loopholes to improve the talent in the system and to win. To hell with feelings or what anyone else thinks about it. I can't imagine it didn't cost the team some young international players if they had good/smart representation. And it absolutely put a bullseye on Luhnow's forehead as far as the league was concerned.
I hope your enjoying the dynasty Luhnow built, because everything he did was with winning in mind. This is what lead to Bregs becoming a Stro. He followed the rules and the Stros org benefited and ended up with a dynasty partly because of this move. You act like Aiken's arm blowing out was Luhnow's fault. If you were in Luhnow's shoes what would you have done differently? Are you not glad Luhnow did everything possible to put the best team possible on the field? I hope all GM's in the town would have a fraction of Luhnow's focus on winning regardless of what others think of them. The agents had to work harder and change the way they do business, boo freaking hoo. Luhnow didn't have any issues with international prospects because Oz successfully gave lower ranked prospects a chance and Luhnow had contacts in Cuba. Any other org could have done the exact same thing. But they chose to do the status quo and not work as hard or push the limits. This is what really pissed off front office people around MLB. They had to begin to think outside the box and work harder. MLB obviously doesn't like change.
Some fans sure are ungrateful to the one that brought us the joy of watching a winning organization for the past 8 years.
I am enjoying it and am very grateful for the enjoyment I have received. Doesn't change the facts. Doesn't change how Luhnow was and what he did. Most likely without those cut throat ways, the Astros are not still winning today. Maybe they never win because he simply isn't better than orher GMs. Maybe he is still very good and still has a job and the team and organization still looks like it did in 2019. We will never know.
Exactly, and I can't understand why feelings and what other people think matters to anybody. You can't build a winner with feelings or caring about whatever other people think. In business feelings should always take a backseat to what's best for business. Caring about what other people think is something that isn't conducive to having a successful business, particularly if your goal is to be the best you possibly can be in said business. It's sad that people fight change.
The fact that he ran the org the way he did and within the rules is what made him successful. You seem to have an issue with this, but still seem to be really enjoying the fruits of his labor. You never answered how you would have handled the Aiken situation any differently. I know this, you're really good at throwing numbers out there, but you don't seem to have an understanding of how to make those numbers work for you. Luhnow knew how to make the numbers work for him, by hiring people who were willing to do whatever it took to win both in management and on the field. I'm glad you aren't running the team because obviously you're a very smart guy, but you don't have the stomach to do what it takes to build a winner. Don't take this as a personal flight towards you, most people aren't built the way I'm talking about. They don't put business 1st. They care about things like what others think, feelings etc... What should come above business IMHO are Christ Family Business This is why smart people don't mix business and family.
Houston fans shouldn’t have any issues… it’s the MLB commissioners office and other GM’s/owners weren’t fans of him and his early tactics. The fact that other teams no longer trying to pull the same stuff (to the same degree) or give him an interview echos the extent of how MLB has basically informally told all teams that they won’t allow that sort of “business mindset”. Also didn’t help that this all went down prior to the Astros having any real success, and after they were an embarrassment to all of baseball from 2011-2014…. The timing of those intentionally sucky years (without the guaranteed payoff) absolutely made a difference when the Aiken/Nix/Marshall slot manipulation scheme blew up and created the ****-storm (which given how the Astros were fighting with the media or putting their foot in their mouths daily, it was just par for the initial course).
With Aiken, wasn't it an issue that the Astros gave one offer but once they were actually allowed to get medicals on him realized there might be an issue with the arm and lowered the offer? I don't know details about the other two. So Luhnow was criticized for going below slot value to spread money around better for the Astros and was heavily criticized for that. But now, every single team does it and it is expected. Seems like people got mad at someone for having the good idea first. Also, because of the Aiken situation MLB now has medical info on the top draft prospects before the draft. Seems like another advancement made by Luhnow. So he pissed off Boras and the other agents, good. Agents get away with collusion every year but cry rivers if the owners have a cup of coffee and talk player money. I don't agree with everything Luhnow did (the office culture evidently was toxic and I am sure he knew about the sign stealing ) but he did all he could do to acquire more talent. That I can't fault him for. He tanked because he needed to, he signed vets and traded the at the deadline, and he got the mozt out of the draft that he could. Now his trades to acquire help at the deadlines (once we got good) generally sucked so I would like those back.
Yes MLB and Manfred were looking for a reason to ban Luhnow. MLB doesn't like change and the Stros winning costs MLB money, in addition to the media being pissed about being proven wrong.The cheating was the excuse they used to get Luhnow out and everybody else got to get other jobs. It hasn't been proven that Luhnow did anything against the rules. Hinch, Cora, Beltran on the other hand. SMH Luhnow ran the Stros like a business, rightfully so and in the process made Crane millions. Too bad he was left to take the fall. I admire genius level people. These types of people in general don't typically give a crap what others think about them. Too bad Crane won't give Dana the type of autonomy he gave Luhnow.
At this point, they’re just going to keep that stuff internally. People don’t have the success he does… and still don’t have another team go near him… unless there’s something much much more to it.
He treated a liar like a piece of meat. There is little doubt that Aiken knew full well that he was unfit to pitch in ML baseball. He was drafted first because the rules allowed him to cover that fact up. Feeling sympathetic toward him is one thing. Insisting that others should is quite another. Humanity had nothing to do with it.
Exactly, I wish I could like this post more than once. What happened, happened because of Aiken and specifically his elbow. Luhnow did what any good CEO would have done, made the best of a bad situation. No rules were broken. Thing is guys like Buck, ISo, Snake have yet to tell me what they think Luhnow should have done differently given this specific situation.
I didn't answer it because I genuinely don't know. I wasn't there and don't have the knowledge or experience to do that job. ButcI do know what was reported and that is that Luhnow handled it in a way others never did and pissed of a lot of people that did have those things.
They were pissed off because Luhnow was kicking their butts, when some of those same people said that what Luhnow was doing would never work. Again, the Aiken situation rubbed some old school excs the wrong way, but ultimately Luhnow did what was best for the org he was running. Which helped lead to a dynasty which far outlasted his tenure down on Kirby.
