They do need another arm (or three) but I’m not 40-y/o JV or bust. And damn sure not for Hunter Brown (or even Drew Gilbert). Not gonna give Graveman 3 years($24M) but a year later give Montero 3 years. And then trade a prospect for Graveman. Not gonna give Verlander whatever the deal was ($40M/2+1 or 3) but then you’re gonna trade top prospects for him. Eduardo? Flaherty? Lorenzen? Another bp arm if they can’t get a starter? https://theathletic.com/4738180/2023/08/01/astros-pitching-staff-help-trades/ Sources told The Athletic on Monday night, however, that Houston has shifted its focus from the bullpen back to starting pitching. The team remains engaged with the New York Mets about a reunion with Justin Verlander, although some enormous hurdles remain and it’s uncertain whether a deal will ever materialize. A person with knowledge of the team’s plans said Verlander is not the only starter in the crosshairs. Prices for starters are still sky-high in a sellers’ market, putting Houston in a difficult position. The farm system is subpar and first-year general manager Dana Brown is here, in part, to replenish it. He has reiterated in the last few days he does not want to “mortgage” the farm — especially for a rental arm — but the current landscape suggests he may have to part with some prospects he prizes. Whether it is Verlander, a rental like Michael Lorenzen or Jack Flaherty or someone not publicly known to be available, the Astros are in clear need of a starting pitcher. Pivoting from relievers is the prudent course of action for Brown, who can no longer hide behind his season-long assertion that his team boasted baseball’s lowest ERA. https://theathletic.com/4737822/2023/07/31/mets-justin-verlander-pete-alonso-deadline/ The Mets have been open-minded about trade talks involving other players whose contracts are up at the end of 2024. That includes Pete Alonso, who is set to become a free agent after next season. An industry source said Alonso has been available on the trade market over the last week. Brooks Raley is “definitely” available, one industry source said. The Mets hold a club option on Raley for 2024 ($6.5 million with a $1.25 million buyout) that, given his success this season, would likely be exercised by them or any acquiring team. For what it’s worth, Raley has quite enjoyed playing in New York. Raley has finished each of the Mets’ three wins since they traded closer David Robertson to the Marlins. He owns a 2.37 ERA on the season (3.94 FIP) with a 26.2 percent strikeout rate. Although lefties have curiously hit Raley better this season (.711 OPS for lefties versus a .579 mark for righties), almost all of that damage was done in the first few weeks of the season. C.J. Abrams’ grand slam off Raley at the end of April made lefties 9-for-23 with two homers and a 1.206 OPS off Raley. Since that night, they’re 9-for-48 with one extra-base hit (a Juan Soto double) and a .472 OPS. The ascending Cubs are a possibility here, per league sources, but a host of other teams linger as well. https://theathletic.com/4737876/2023/07/31/tigers-verlander-eduardo-rodriguez/ Here’s one interesting notion to chew on: Might Rodriguez’s fate be tied to Justin Verlander, and in a sense, Astros owner Jim Crane? Monday evening the LA Times reported the Dodgers view Rodriguez as their second — and perhaps only other — option if the Dodgers are unable to acquire Verlander from the Mets. But a couple of hours later, The Athletic reported the Astros remain in talks with the Mets regarding Verlander. The Tigers and their high price tags have frustrated some teams around the league. They likely want at least one top hitting prospect in return for Rodriguez. The Dodgers, meanwhile, are arguably the team best equipped to part with prospect capital in exchange for a top-tier starter. So if the Astros swoop in and take Verlander, or if Verlander otherwise decides not to waive his no-trade clause, that could make the Dodgers the most likely suitor for Rodriguez. That might be the best-case scenario for the Tigers. But if it does not work out that way, Harris and the Tigers could risk seeing their patient (if not stingy) approach backfire. There’s a chance another team would decide to part with its prospects at the last minute. There is also a chance Harris has to be the one to cave and accept a lesser deal in return. The other option would be holding on to Rodriguez and getting serious about the idea of a contract extension. But even in that case, Rodriguez would hold the leverage. He can opt out of his deal at season’s end and wade into free agency, so the idea of him re-upping with the Tigers is no guarantee. The Orioles continue to be mentioned as the most likely destination for Michael Lorenzen. The Athletic’s Ken Rosenthal mentioned this idea yesterday. But again, the Tigers have been in no hurry to rush a deal to the finish line. The forces of the market could always lead to greater interest in Lorenzen from elsewhere (say, the Marlins, or even the Astros if they don’t get Verlander). But it is not hard to envision a trade going down between the Tigers and Orioles. Baltimore has ample farm depth but would not have to part with a true premium young player for Lorenzen, who is a rental and likely worth less than Rodriguez on the market. The Tigers could wade a bit deeper down the Orioles’ prospect lists and still end up with a player they like. It makes a lot of sense.
We don’t shop at the top of the free agent market, so we wouldn’t be losing anyone in free agency that made the kind of impact JV could
If the Mets want Hunter Brown and Drew Gilbert they better pay ALL of Verlanders salary plus throw in Brooks Raley and take back Montero. And even then it’s a bad deal for Houston.
I doubt it, but if Pete Alonso is on the market... i have to think about... Hunter Brown Drew Gilbert JP France Shay Whitcomb Ryan Clifford For Verlander/Alonso Key to me is they would not be rentals. If that gives you 2 rings then I think it's worth the sacrifice of Brown and Gilbert.... Verlander Valdez Javier Urquidy Then: Mccullers, Garcia, etc. So Brown becomes more expendable in unlikely scenario of everyone healthy...
Im not one to say someone is untouchable but trading hunter isn't the type of move you do during the season. That is a winter move.
If they're able to get JV. Playoffs GM1 Framber GM2 JV GM3 Javier/Brown GM4 JP/Urquidy Pressly Abreu Neris Graveman Brown Urquidy Next yr Framber JV Javier JP Brown Urquidy Garcia LMJ PULL THE TRIGGER!!!
Trading for a controllable SP (whether Verlander or someone else) gives Houston a SP surplus going into next year that they can use to fill their bullpen holes, whether that’s putting Urquidy and Bielak in bullpen roles or trading them for more established late inning relievers.
I love Verlander but no matter what they do it’s going to be painful for Houston to acquire him. If they take on most of his salary they save prospects but would have very little financial wiggle room for extensions and free agent additions. If they get NY to eat hjs salary they give up elite young talent that severely hurts their outlook 3-5 years down the road.
No guarantee that Garcia + LMJ come back next season (and if they do that they're effective). If they do great. Adding JV gives them the ability to go to a six man rotation (this yr and next) which they need to do to help ease the wear and tear on JV as well as reduce the workload on young pitchers like Brown, JP, and even Javier.
I've warmed up to trading Gilbert and others if money is getting eaten. If they seriously want Hunter Brown they can get f**ked, I don't care how much they chip in. I don't think Verlander is a significantly better pitcher than Brown right now, much less the next 3-5 seasons when our window could/should still be open.
