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2021 NFL Draft Thread

Discussion in 'Houston Texans' started by gucci888, Jan 28, 2021.

  1. Sooty

    Sooty Contributing Member

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    Since he isn’t worth squat, we shouldn’t be holding out for multiple firsts in a trade. But we should make him play. ;)
     
  2. Sooty

    Sooty Contributing Member

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    Following interviews with seven executives in personnel, here is Part 1 (offensive players) of a look at the 60 players they view as most likely to lead off the NFL Draft next month. Players are listed by position in current order of value. Forty-three of the 60 declared for the draft early as underclassmen.

    All interviews were conducted before the start of pro days March 5; the NFL combine in February was canceled because of the coronavirus. Thus, these evaluations can and will change substantially over the next seven weeks as teams obtain 40-yard dash times, testing results, medical information and additional player interviews. Heights are rounded to the nearest half-inch when official measurements were available.


    Quarterbacks (6)
    Trevor Lawrence, Clemson (6-foot-6, 220 pounds): In three seasons, he passed for 90 touchdowns and ran for another 18. “Rare arm talent,” said one scout. “He’s humble, a faith-based guy. He’ll handle anything being the franchise quarterback. There are a lot of people who say he’s the best quarterback to come out since Andrew Luck. Is he a product of the system? Everything that comes out of there says he really is smart. This year, he started getting his touch back. His accuracy was better.”

    Lawrence went through an individual workout Feb. 12, four days before undergoing surgery to repair labrum damage in his non-throwing shoulder. Expected to be ready by mid-July. “He is a great athlete and has a strong arm,” a second scout said. “The guy has a chance to be great. But you break him down, game after game, he’s not an accurate passer. Where he has problems is inside the numbers. Inconsistent touch. Is he Josh Allen or Blake Bortles? Bortles was a big-time athlete, but he wasn’t accurate. People were all excited about size and the way Bortles could run. … The ACC is not a good league, OK? The only real competition they (Clemson) get every year is in the playoffs. He didn’t play well. Even when they beat Ohio State, he beat them running, not passing. They totally shut the guy down.”

    Finished second in Heisman Trophy voting in 2020, seventh in ’19. “I’d take Joe Burrow over Trevor Lawrence,” said a third scout. “He was a better player. More of a playmaker. The ACC stinks. Everything is so easy for him. This was for three years. Now when he played LSU, Ohio State this year, Miami, Virginia Tech, there were times he had to speed up and he looked average. When you put him against other elite competition, he has not stepped up. When Deshaun Watson was there and he played Alabama two years in a row, that guy was by far the best player on the field. A superstar. I never saw that with Trevor Lawrence. On designed things he can run, but if he has to quickly get out of trouble, he does not do that well. If he threw for 300 yards in a game, 250 of it would be just the quick design of the offense. Their coordinator (Tony Elliott) is amazing.”

    Zach Wilson, Brigham Young (6-foot-2, 210 pounds): Three-star recruit. “He will not be the first pick in the draft, but he should be,” one scout said. “Love him. He’s just a natural. He just has the movement, the looseness, the throwing from all angles, the jumping around in the pocket. His release is quick as hell. He can throw the ball. He is a nifty, elusive type in the pocket. He can run a little bit.” Battled injuries as the starter in 2018 and ’19, and underwent surgeries to repair a labrum and hand. Vastly improved in 2020 with an NFL passer rating of 138.2, up from 84.9 in 2019.

    Some scouts worry that his slight frame might lead to durability issues. “How big is he?” asked one. “He’s only going to be like 205 (pounds). He may be only 6-(foot)-1. He’s been spoiled a little bit, too.” A fourth scout described him as a combination of Kyler Murray and Patrick Mahomes. Retorted another scout: “There’s a vast difference (to Mahomes). The physical skills of throwing the football, he’s not even close to humming the ball like Patrick. I don’t know if he’s innately competitive and tough as Patrick. Patrick’s probably smarter, too.”

    Justin Fields, Ohio State (6-foot-3, 228 pounds): Spent his freshman season at Georgia before transferring and becoming a two-year starter. “He’s a modern-day RPO quarterback,” said one scout. “He’s a naturally accurate ball thrower and the ball gets out of his hands, too. He’s not a runner like Lamar (Jackson), but he’s way better than Jalen Hurts was. He will have to learn progressions. Very athletic. Very cool demeanor. Plus, he’s sturdy.”

    Led the Buckeyes to a 1-2 record in the College Football Playoff. “Love his makeup, the playmaking, his competitiveness, the movement,” a second scout said. “He’s poised. He stepped up in the big games. He’s just not a quick processor in the pocket. He’s more methodical. That’s a worry. He had the streak in the Indiana game: ‘What is this guy doing?’” Passed for 67 TDs and ran for another 19. “He is one of the top athletes (at quarterback) of all time,” a third scout said. “Best thing Fields does is throw the deep ball. But is he Jameis Winston? That’s who I see. I see the best quarterback in the draft on one play, and on the next play, I see a guy that makes stupid mistakes. Throws off his back foot a lot. Has a lot of balls tipped. He’s a first-rounder, but I wouldn’t take him until the bottom (of the round).”

    Passer rating was 127.6. “He played his worst game in the Big Ten Championship (game) against Northwestern, yet they still found a way to win,” said a fourth scout. “People are saying they don’t even belong there (in the playoff), and he plays a damn near perfect game against Clemson. In the national championship, he carried them. What would be ideal for him would be to go somewhere and not have to play the first year. But the physical talent is so wow, they’re going to see that in practice and say, ‘This guy has to play.’ There needs to be a tremendous amount of growth, which I think he is capable of.”
     
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  3. Sooty

    Sooty Contributing Member

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    Mac Jones, Alabama (6-foot-2½, 217 pounds): Started the final four games of 2019 for an injured Tua Tagovailoa, then went all the way in ’20 for the national champions. “They may have had the best offense this year in the history of college football, but Joe Burrow had a great supporting cast, too,” said one scout. “He is totally amazing when you break him down. Disciplined person, excellent work ethic, goal-oriented. He has a feel (for the rush). The great ones are not big-time runners. Poised, confident. I think he’ll probably go middle of the first.”

    Completed a record 77.4 percent of his passes in 2020. “He could be the steal of the bunch,” said a second scout. “Nobody’s saying, ‘Hey, he’s this guy,’ but there are some Tom Brady comparisons.” Countered a third scout: “How can anyone compare him to Brady? I wouldn’t compare anybody to Tom Brady. Ever. How many guys with similar tools failed? If this guy’s the next Brady, trade your next seven first-round picks. Give up your head coach. Trade your owner.” His passer rating of 143.1 in 2020 left his career mark at 138.2. “When I watched him, I said this was A.J. McCarron all over again,” a fourth scout said. “The offense. The players around him. He’s got a slow delivery. He labors in his movements. If he’s in rhythm and everything is working for him, he’s a machine. I just question everything about his natural talent, his playmaking, his ability to face pressure and make plays.”

    Practiced at the Senior Bowl but missed the game because of an ankle injury. “Honestly, I wasn’t very impressed with him at the Senior Bowl,” said a fifth scout. “I just didn’t think he stood out at all. He stood out in a bad way. He didn’t look very strong. He didn’t look very athletic. He just didn’t look like a starter you want in the NFL.”

    Trey Lance, North Dakota State (6-foot-4, 226 pounds): Redshirted in 2018, started 16 games for the FCS national champions in ’19 and started the Bison’s only game in ’20. “He’s really talented,” one scout said. “I’m not going to say he throws it better than Trevor Lawrence, but he definitely throws it better than Zach Wilson and as well as (Justin) Fields arm strength-wise. Josh Allen was more talented, but a year ago Lance was a much more efficient player. Josh threw interceptions in college, especially against good defenses. Lance definitely fits the mold of what you want to look for. The natural, God-given ability, he has it.”

    Posted a passer rating of 130.1 in 2019 while running for 1,100 yards and 14 TDs. “He’s a better runner than Lawrence and the same level as Fields,” said a second scout. “He’s an aggressive runner. That’s the problem. He takes on people all the time. Physically, he’s gifted. He’s a myth, a one-year-and-one-game starter.” Playing in Fargo Oct. 3 against a Central Arkansas team that finished 5-4, Lance was 15-of-30 for 149 yards, two TDs and one interception. He did rush 15 times for 143 yards. Declared for the draft three days later. “He should not have played that game,” said a third scout. “He looked awful. Looked like a fourth-round pick. No accuracy. No pocket poise. He fumbled the ball. He looked like a developmental backup guy. Straight-line type athlete. He reminded me of Jameis Winston where it’s not really a fluid, natural motion or natural movement in the pocket. He kind of has to gather his whole body to throw.”

    Two scouts said they’d take him over Jordan Love. “You like the taste, but it’s a small sample,” a fourth scout said. “I like his tools. I think he can be good, but would I bank on it? There’s not enough information for me. A lot of unknowns there that would give me pause.”

    Kyle Trask, Florida (6-foot-4½, 240 pounds): High-school backup in Manvel, Texas, who was offered by the Gators based on his showing at a camp. “He didn’t even start in high school,” said one scout. “He’s lucky to be a starting quarterback. He has numbers, but I think there’s better out there.” Redshirted in 2016, broke his left foot in August 2017 and broke his right foot in September 2018. Took over the starting job in 2019. “Reminds me of Jared Goff,” said a second scout. “Pocket quarterback with height, arm strength, accuracy. High three-quarters release, quick release. Tight ball. Throws well in and outside the numbers. He can move around the pocket, but he doesn’t have quickness. He does have good pocket awareness. I think he’s a first-rounder.”

    Posted a passer rating of 117.1. Improved each year. “Similar to (Mac) Jones,” a third scout said. “He’s got a little more moxie than Mac. He’s a game manager. Average arm. He’s gets in rhythm good, but if he has to reset and throw, it’s over with. He’s a backup type. If he ends up starting, you’ve got a bad team.” Tossed three interceptions for the Gators’ depleted offense in their first three possessions of the Cotton Bowl, his final game. Said a fourth scout: “We see him as a backup. He can’t move. Totally immobile.”
     
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  4. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member
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    Zeke sucks
     
  5. raining threes

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    I never said he wasn't worth squat. He's actually a good QB.

    I dont think they should make him play and I want him traded, but only if they get a proper return for him. Otherwise you hold onto him until the 2022 offseason. Gotta get value for him.

    I'm just glad the true Deshaun Watson value system has come to light for all to see, if they want to see it.
     
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  6. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member
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    That’s interesting, first report I’ve seen that has Wilson’s arm in question. Every other report has been best arm in draft.
     
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  7. Sooty

    Sooty Contributing Member

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    Think it was the opinion of one of the many scouts interviewed.
     
  8. Sooty

    Sooty Contributing Member

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    I just found it an interesting criteria for "proven stars".

    There's maybe 1 or 2 at each position.
     
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  9. gucci888

    gucci888 Contributing Member

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    Unless I missed something looks like he just said it’s not on Mahomes’ level which is probably fair.
     
  10. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member
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    Down further under Lance report, there’s a clip about Wilson.
     
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  11. raining threes

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    He still has a great arm.
     
  12. rhino17

    rhino17 Member

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    That he's a top 5 quarterback in the NFL and 25 years old.
     
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  13. raining threes

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    Top 10 maybe

    Top 5 not yet.
     
  14. primtim24

    primtim24 Contributing Member

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    This definitely is not the basis of the entire thread, but to say he's not even top-5, there's just nothing to support that.

    In no order:
    Mahomes
    Rodgers (IMO 32 teams would take Watson over him as well)
    Wilson (IMO He's better than him today)
    Brady (IMO at least 25 teams would take Watson over him as well)

    Who else? Josh Allen? Kyler Murray? Dak Prescott? There are absolutely ZERO metrics/stats/numbers that support Deshaun not being top-5.
     
  15. raining threes

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    Agree to disagree

    I'm not going to derail this thread.

    I would love to discuss the draft with you.
     
  16. gucci888

    gucci888 Contributing Member

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    Ya he does. I really like Wilson and wouldn’t be opposed to Jones with a later pick. Don’t think Fields is a candidate and Lance is too big of a risk for me.
     
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  17. Rudyc281

    Rudyc281 Member

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    This.

    But my target would be Mac Jones.

    Not everything needs to be a amazing elusive scramble then throw the ball 70 yards. Or all highlight plays.

    Mac Jones is a real student of the game
    Can make every throw
    And is very very competitive

    And tons of untapped potential but I would love for him to sit for a year.
     
  18. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member
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    Are you really trying to say that Mahomes is carried by his weapons?

    LOL.

    Mahomes would still be an all pro without Kelce.
     
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  19. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member
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    What metrics are you using to say he definitely is?

    I think it's highly debatable.

    Prescotts and Watsons numbers are very similar and No I am not saying he is a top 5 QB.
     
  20. Verbal Christ

    Verbal Christ Member

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    How do you know? The guy himself said he couldn't read an NFL defense until year 2.

    Recency bias clouds these kinds of opinions. For example. Do you think Deshaun Watson wins a Super Bowl (or two) if he was drafted by the Chiefs with all of those weapons and supreme coaching staff? I say yes, and on the same note I can say that Watson is able to perform with absolute garbage around him. We will just have to assume Mahomes can do that. Hopefully he loses some of these weapons soon so that this narrative can be put to bed. He can only go up after that pathetic SB performance.
     

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