I'm sure this has been done in this thread already, but haven't read it all. I've been most intrigued by the Al Horford size comparisons, because Al certainly doesn't seem undersized at the PF spot and frankly has had a very solid career thus far. Pre-Draft Measurements Per Draft Express: Patrick Patterson Height Without Shoes: 6' 8" Height With Shoes: 6' 9.25" Weight: 240 Wingspan: 7' 1.25" Standing Reach: 8' 11" Body Fat: 5.3 No Step Vert: 28.5 Max Vert: 33.5 Bench Press: 17 Lane Agility: 11.14 3/4 Court Sprint: 3.25 Al Horford Height Without Shoes: 6' 8.75" Height With Shoes: 6' 9.75" Weight: 246 Wingspan: 7' 0.75" Standing Reach: 8' 11" Body Fat: 9.1 No Step Vert: 31.0 Max Vert: 35.5 Bench Press: 20 Lane Agility: 12.15 3/4 Court Sprint: 3.37 Carl Landry Height Without Shoes: 6' 7.75" Height With Shoes: 6' 8.5" Weight: 248 Wingspan: 6' 11" Standing Reach: 8' 6.5" Body Fat: 7.5 No Step Vert: 31.5 Max Vert: 36.5 Bench Press: 21 Lane Agility: 11.35 3/4 Court Sprint: 3.29 It's certainly interesting to see where Patrick out-measures Horford and Landry and where he falls short. I think he certainly has the size, length, standing reach and athleticism. Somewhat surprised at, given how athletic we know he is, despite his 8'11'' standing reach (4.5 inches higher than Carl, same as Horford), he falls short on the verticals. I guess that is why Carl is so effective - despite his size (where he WAS/IS somewhat undersized for the position), Carl posted the highest max vertical of the group...and as we know, he gets up there quite quickly. Draft Express has a nice, sortable table here: Draft Stats, Sortable, All top 15 picks Last 20+ Years Not clear correlation between rankings on here and success of NBA career, especially only on a category by category basis. But I think the fact that Patterson ranks so well in every category, combined with his on court production, maturity and well-rounded game is what Morey and company liked so much.
He's actually 6'8 which is just considered undersized. Dennis Rodman was 6'5 so you know, I am not saying he can't be good. But you notice that a lot of the top teams have very tall power forwards and that spells trouble for guys 6'8. Boozer has trouble against taller guys - he takes more jump shots. It makes a big difference that one inch ya know. Amare is listed at 6'10 by the way. And Odom, Gasol, Duncan, Aldridge, Dirk...all listed at 6'10 or taller. Yes, the average pf is probably 6'9 inches. So PP is slightly undersized. He's not Charles Barkley undersized, but he is some what. He's going to struggle a bit when he comes to the NBA and has to play as tall or taller pf's every night which he is not used to from his college days. I think he'll be fine. But he will struggle against bigger front lines - just as Scola and nearly every single guy you listed above. Unless of course he can find a way around it like Barkley and Rodman did. Or even a guy like Moses. But those guys are rare indeed.
Combine results from draftexpress: Amare 6'8.5" w/o shoes, 6'10" w shoes PP 6'8" w/o shoes, 6'9.25" w shoes http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Amare-Stoudemire-4498/ http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Patrick-Patterson-1225/ Their skills will be a bigger factor in differentiating performance than their 1/2 inch difference in length (that's what she said).
Amare was 18 when those measurements were taken. He's probably a bit taller now. I would certainly put him in the lanky KG/Bosh mold, except that with his lankiness and decreased bulk he has also decided not to play defense. And it's really annoying how people continually mold statistics to their argument. Stop saying Patterson is 6'8 if you're gonna compare him to the NBA where everyone is listed in their shoe-height and then some. Brooks without shoes is 5'10. Barkley without shoes might have been 6'5. By anyone's standards Patterson is the average size of a PF in the NBA, bigger than Landry and about the same size as David West or Carlos Boozer. You can check the Draftexpress data on your own if you really don't trust me.
How was he 18? The link says he was born in 11/16/82 and the draft was in 2002. He would have turned 19 on 11/16/2001.
Here is the 2002 measurements from the predraft camp, June 4-7. It was 5 months away from his 20th birthday. http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/predraft_camp_02.html http://www.nba.com/media/bulls/predraft_sizes_02.pdf
Why are you using Patterson's height without shoes and comparing it to other players' measurements with shoes? If you are complaining about being undersized, you should use their measurements without shoes for an accurate comparison. The NBA uses measurements with shoes. All those 6'10" guys are really 6'8.5"-6.8.75", when you take out 1.25"-1.5" for shoe height. Just like Hakeem wasn't really a 7 footer. He was really 6'10" without shoes. Amare isn't even 6'9". Check his measurements at the Chicago draft camp. http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/predraft_camp_02.html http://www.nba.com/media/bulls/predraft_sizes_02.pdf Duncan played at C. McDyess played at PF. Yes, Patterson is shorter than a center. Odom is 6 without shoes.
It's not just the half inch in height (if that's what it really only is) but the fact that Amare has more reach and jumping ability to counteract the height difference. All in all, Amare probably gets 1-2 inches in reach and another few inches in jumping ability. Those things make a significant difference. Amare is taller, higher reach, AND more explosive. You aren't going to get Amare in PP. If you think so, you're dreaming, I can't believe you are actually trying to make this justification. And...Amare had a lot of trouble with the Lakers front line too. That just goes to show that even Amare struggles with taller players who only have and inch or two on him. It makes a difference. Now, all that being said, I am favor of the pick and said it was a good one, I don't know why all of your are all up in arms because I said PP is undersized. I'm not ripping on him, just stating what is obvious. Don't look at just his height - it's his standing reach of 8'11
Meh, the Rockets brass thinks he's normal PF height. They also feel he's a good defender. No, they're not always right. But unless I see Patterson continuously get beaten by bigger PFs due to his supposed slight build, I'm going to trust the Rockets here.
I already posted this link: ALL PLAYERS DRAFT MEASUREMENTS You can see that Amare's max vertical is 2 inches higher than Patterson's was, at their pre-draft measurements (Amare may be higher now, who knows...). Amare's max vertical was 35.5 vs. PP 33.5. If you sort by Max reach, Amare's max reach was 12 feet exactly, whereas PP came in just short at 11' 8.5". So when it's all said and done, using pre-draft measurements as a guide...it's pretty even steven. Moreover, PP's is certainly high enough to be a very effective NBA power forward. His max reach is the same as Cousins, higher than Cole Aldrich (you don't hear any Cole can't play center due to his size arguments), higher than Tyson Chandler, Jordan Hill, etc. The one differentiating factor, which I don't think they measure, is jumping speed. We all know Carl got up quick. Amare gets up quicker, and maybe quicker than anyone in the league (certainly was true in his early years). Patterson I don't believe gets up so quick. Interestingly, John Wall also posted a max reach of 11'8.5" No player with a higher max reach on the list is shorter than him - to show you his amazing athletic ability.
Amare is a max player. Yes, Patterson is undersized for a PF making max money. For NBA PFs, he is just barely below average.
Pat has a shorter max vertical reach than Jordan Hill who's max vertical reach is 11'11, practically 12'0. BTW another guy who has the same max vert. reach as PP is Blake Griffin, both maxing out at 11'8.5 --RB
