Zach Lowe: Terrence Jones could be asking for $15M per year

Okay man you're going a bit overboard with the Jones hate. Yes he's not as good as alot of people make him out to be. Yes he needs to improve his jumper. Yes he misses wide open **** (so does Dwight and I don't see you b****ing)

His form isn't as broke as you say it is. It just looks awkward cause he's a generally awkward player like some people are. His form is slow, yes. But it's not a broke form. It's not like he has a form like Bill Cartwright or anything. He has decent form.

 

I'm not calling him terrible, in fact in the right role, he can be pretty good. I'm just pointing out that his skill set is pretty easy to replace....because it is.

Until someone like Harrell steps up, Jones is very valuable to the team as the only competent backup PF.

Don't confuse my accurate portrayal of his value with saying he's terrible.

 

So give us 5-10 specific people who would replace his skill set, with similar rim finishing and offensive rebounding statistics, or something else meaningfully better to offset worse numbers in those areas.

If you can't give us specific options who could replace him, then stop saying it is a simple matter to do so.

 

Agree with Bobby. There is an abundance of undersized athletic power forwards who think they have handles in the league. Between him and Dmo, Dmo is by far the more special and unique player.

 

You don't know what you're talking about. His form is terrible. His jump shot is broken. He doesn't even want to shoot it. And it's going to take a long time to fix it. Comparing him to Dwight and Cartwright is stupid. They are/were strictly centers. Terrence is not a center. And just because their jump shot sucked doesnt mean it's OK in Terrence's career progression for his jumper to suck.

Terrence is an undersized underskilled power forward with low basketball iq, a slow processing brain, and no drive to be great. He's happy to slop through his career and make half the money he could make because half the money he could make is more money than he can comprehend. He's just another player.

 

He faces up and scores a lot and is more than a garbage man.

Let's look at the video.

Rockets vs. Bucks, March 17, 2014. Jones had 30 points. It will give you an idea of how he scores his points.


1. 3-pointer
2. Alley-oop dunk off pick and roll
3. Post up baby hook
4. Put-back offensive rebound
5. Alley-oop lay-up
6. 3-pointer
7. 3-pointer
8. Post up baby hook
9. Pump fake, drive, lay-up and 1.
10. Contested lay-up in transition
11. Drive, nice dribbling, spin move, dunk. This play was sick. 3:33 in the video. Garbage men don't make moves like that.


<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ocrZvR1D2ig" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>




I would call Terrence Jones "versatile" more than I'd call him a garbage man. He's not great at any one thing but he does a little bit of everything. He can shoot the 3 a bit, catch alley-oops, play the pick and roll, score in transition, dribble well for a PF, drive, post up, and face up.

 

I like Jones. I don't understand why we need to trade him. Why can't we pay both Donuts and Jones this off-season? Why do we have to only choose one?

 

We could. That would just mean this team is essentially stuck as is, though.

 

Jones isn't a terrible player but it is quite obvious that his weaknesses were exposed in the playoffs two seasons in a row. He isn't our answer at PF unless he takes a giant leap. I don't think Morey is willing to pay him $15M. If he wouldn't give it to Parsons, he sure as hell won't give it to Jones.

We're already title contenders in my eyes but with Dwight getting older, he needs some help down low. Coaches choose to double him because they know we stuggle with rebounding when Dwight is closed out. Jones isn't an elite rebounder and neither is D-Mo.

 

How so? They are both restricted so you can make a big splash this Summer first and then match if you want to afterward and as long as the big splash move comes before they accept an offer, you retain flexibility.

Now if they extend them both before the season starts then yes, that's it for next year for the most part with the exception of trades of course.

So in the case of putting both of them into RFA next summer, it shouldn't matter one bit to fans here assuming they make a splash beforehand. We as fans shouldn't care about Les' pocketbook.

 

I'm not trying to sell him as an amazing ball handler, that's you trying to put words in my mouth because your argument is weak. All I'm saying is Tjones has better handles than most of his PF peers.

Approximately 50% of his attempts come at the rim (0-3ft), that's pretty low for a "garbage man". He does what Faried does but better plus he has above average handles for his position and can shoot at a higher percentage.

You keep using the term "garbage" a lot when describing Jones.... Are you able to quanitfy what "garbage" is?

It's laughable you think he is a garbage man offensively.

Ok? Most PFs aren't any of those things.

 

I don't understand how you've arrived at these conclusions without truly knowing TJ as a player, but more importantly, as a person. What evidence do you have which suggests TJ has a "...low basketball IQ, a slow processing brain and no drive to be great..."?


I wholeheartedly disagree with you, and I don't know the man personally. It's fair to judge his jumper, I guess, but it's not like he was expected to have Ray Allen or Glen Rice's form. His shot is a bit unorthodox, in terms of how he places his feet in relation to the basket, but as we've seen, TJ can score and is fairly efficient in the paint. Your post almost implies that his game is no better than Joey Dorsey's. LOL

TJ doesn't have a David West jumper, but what he does have, which many PF's lack, is the ability to put the ball on the floor and create a shot for himself. His shot isn't as nice, but TJ's game mimics Mo Taylor's in some way. Mo could put the ball on the floor and drive to the basket, but it took him some time. Obviously, his career didn't turn out the way we wanted, but MoTay was better when he was able to dribble instead of being a pick and pop PF like our beloved Luis Scola was.

You've also failed to recognize how young TJ is. The man is 23 years old. 23! He's battled a few injuries and has lost his minutes a few times, but that's part of the process for a player to become better. If you've played or coached ball, you would realize that there are very few players who are simply "great" from the moment they step on the floor. That goes for shooting form, rebounding, defense, agility, etc...

TJ may not be worth 10+ milli a year, but he's not the garbage you implied in your post. He certainly has the backing of a vet like Dwight and has tried to blend in to the Rockets' evolving offense.

To call him undersized is subjective. He is pushing around 6"10', which is not that undersized for a forward. To call him under-skilled is inaccurate. I'm not his biggest fan, but his stat logs show evidence that defeats your claim altogether. If you were fair, you would say that he is developing in numerous aspects of his game.

It just irks me when someone tries to say (insert player name) has a low basketball IQ, processes things slowly and has NO drive to be great. You have absolutely no evidence to back any of those claims up, except for some sort of bias. I don't get it.

Has TJ been bullied by other PFs? Most definitely. Could he improve and gain some more muscle? Absolutely. Is he an intellectually-inept, non-driven player? There's no proof of that. If anything, his stats, which cannot be refuted, show improvement over three seasons, with him shooting above 50%.

We can argue about talent and how or if TJ fits into the Rockets' plans, but attempting to determine his drive, IQ and personal feelings in relation to basketball is ridiculous. TJ is growing, and with that progression, there are going to be growing pains. Being an elite player doesn't happen overnight, and I'd bet you that TJ wants to be a better player, even if his "form" and size don't appease you and his other critics.

 

Codman has fished the turd out of the punch bowl, but is it safe to drink or has the turd left it's mark?

 

The Rockets well very likely replace him with Montrezl Harrell.

 

They are nothing alike. However your scouting skills are rather limited so I won't hold it against you

But if you really believe it, its not a lie.

Spoiler

Just FYI, the only irreplaceable players on this team are Harden and Dwight.

 

Of course he's not worth $15 mil. And neither is DMo imo.

Unless one of them makes a big leap this year and averages more than 12 and 6.

I mean, there's a reason we went after Aldridge.

 

HANDLES

Terrence Jones goes Full Point Guard

Spoiler

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/GmMU3Z6QIO8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Terrence Jones sick crossover

Spoiler

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/j6veGg_pQAA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

“He’s a proficient dribbler and can take defenders off the bounce, making him a substantial matchup problem for slower post players. “
“He comes alive in transition, where he’s extremely capable either pushing the ball himself “
[Kentucky superfan’s well done breakdown of the entire championship team]

More Handles Footage

Spoiler

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/CSFUlQzDOJc?start=118&end=124" frameborder="0"></iframe>
All one-handed with one motion: Grabs loose ball, one dribble, then perfect behind the back no look outlet pass down court for the assist to dunk.
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Jr00MbFO5Mk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Terrence Jones' Nasty Big Man Handles

Spoiler

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/2rho-4WvBLo?start=22" frameborder="0"></iframe>

Terrence Jones coast-to-coast

Spoiler

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/hMKc1z_I3bg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Mix of Cross Overs

Spoiler

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/945YnTWFZPM?start=23&end=34" frameborder="0"></iframe>

Handles creates space and makes the guy fall back on his heels

Spoiler

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/CSFUlQzDOJc?start=129&end=132" frameborder="0"></iframe>

I’ll be chopping this video up a hundred times every few seconds, so just see all the handles highlights in this vid:

Spoiler

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/CSFUlQzDOJc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Game recognize Game. According to this Youtube video compilation of the top 10 Big Men with Best Handles, Terrence Jones is #2, with only Blake Griffin with slightly more elite big man handles:

NBA Top 10 Big Men with the best Handles

Spoiler

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/yenpYISc1N4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

SMH why is this thread still going? I thought after the math fail by the Jones apologist it would end. I can't wait for the season to start so the last few hanging on the Jones bandwagon will fall off. It's really annoying at this point more than anything else.

 

Jones is an okay player. My main issue with your argument is that you call him a "garbage man".

Asik is a garbage man.

Jones is much more skilled.

 

Bet $100 TJones has a clutchfans acc. and he's reading all these in agony, then going to the gym to up his game