Where does James Harden rate All Time in shooting guards ?

As evidence on a point that someone is better w/o being "superior to."- the superlative comparisons do matter.

 

Shooting guards? Way down. Point guards? Quite high.

He needs chips to crack top 5 though.

 

it's hilarious to see people use the same reasoning for why harden is over guys that have more rings than him not be valid when people start use the same logic to put lebron over guys that have more rings than him.

 

what else he can do?

 

Kobe's PER is just under Hardens... The difference is that Kobe is one of the greatest defensive players in the history of the game. Also, playoffs are a different level for Kobe. You'd never see Kobe do what Harden did in game 7 against the Spurs.

Harden shouldn't be even in the discussion with MJ and Kobe until he actually becomes great on both sides of the court.... And wins a ring or two.

 

ever heard of saying The best defense is a good offense?

 

Stats dispute your impression of the caliber of player Kobe was. Look at his win shares, that takes into account both offense and defense and Harden has already had 3 or 4 seasons better than the best Kobe ever was.

Honestly Kobe is more legend than reality. The best comparison is how some are fooled into thinking that Derek Jeter was even a competent defensive player when he was by some accounts the most detrimental defensive short stop to ever play the game.....largely because no short stop as terrible as he was defensively was allowed to play the position as long as he was.

I think it's time to demystify media created legends and see them for what they are. Some will live up to the hype, others will not.

 

Game 7 vs Phoenix, While blowing a 3-1 lead.

I think that was Kobe's greater playoff series IMO, the Lakers had no business being up 3-1, and were up there from Kobe's clutch shot making, but you cannot say he didn't quit in game 7.

 

short distance behinds Wade

 

Ok, and?

 

Kobe's defense wasn't a myth... He was legitimately one of the best defensive players to play the game. It's not some made up BS. And under pressure, he never caved like Harden has at times in the playoffs. Again, not myth... It's fact.

When you consider offense AND defense, there's no debate here. Harden might go down as one of the best offensive SGs ever, but that's separate conversation.

 

Harden has made one, disastrous, finals appearance in his career, and in that finals he shot better from the field (37%) than Kobe's finals average (36%)

 

The Harden is better than Kobe argument is baseless at this point. It's too early in Harden's career to compare genuinely. Harden to this point is comparable to Kobe through their first 9 yeas in the league in regular season play. Even if you go by age (since Kobe started at age 18) the gap gets more even with that 35.4 ppg season. But the post season Kobe did his work and had 3 rings.

If Harden can play another 5 more season at his same level now then we could start comparing, but even then the rings would be the deciding factor as the stats are close.

 

Kobe shot 50% that game while the rest of the team shot 32%...he could have done better, but at least he showed up.

Harden was 2-12 for 10 pts in the elimination game against the spurs. He didn't even attempt a shot until like the 2nd quarter? How does that happen to any "great"?

 

Yup, Harden needs to go 5 more years before it's even a discussion.

 

battier & co will also be destroyed be destroyed by harden with prime gasol, prime odom, 23 yo ariza & co

how did Kobe fare when he had no superstars around him like harden?

 

Kobe only shot the ball 3 times in the entire second half, all in the 3rd quarter. He quit on the team.

 

I think it had more to do with the fact that no other Laker showed up to play...and accepting defeat.

That's better than deciding from the start of the game to not play.

Regardless, Harden has a lot to prove in the playoffs. Winning a title would be a good start.

 

I didn't say that his defense was a myth, I said that the notion of him being a top 10 all time player is a myth and I said that even if you factor in defense, Harden already has 3 or 4 seasons better than the best Kobe ever managed.

When you are considering how the 2 players played at the sport of basketball, you are right, there's no debate here, Harden is clearly the superior player. It's not particularly close.....and that's why we always hear about team accomplishments in order to prop up Kobe. He simply can't stand on his individual performance.

 

i am not voting until no1 option is added to poll