What extension is Nerlens Noel worth?

arabrocket · Feb 8, 2018

TheRealAllpro said: ↑

First off how did the enlightened Mavs not trade this fool? And I guess it's safe to say he isn't getting 17 mil next year
Click to expand...

Some NBA team “eying him” tho

sealclubber1016 · Feb 9, 2018

Cuban lucked into having one of the greatest players ever. He has otherwise shown himself to be a pretty awful owner. They don't seem to have any kind of a plan beyond an effort to be mediocre.

kubli9 · Feb 9, 2018

If only we could have offered Capela and a future 1st to get this guy. #acebig

basketballholic · Feb 9, 2018

TheRealAllpro said: ↑

First off how did the enlightened Mavs not trade this fool? And I guess it's safe to say he isn't getting 17 mil next year
Click to expand...

They didn't trade him because they would have acknowledged they lost on him. Now that the deadline is passed they'll probably give him a little run to see what he has and then low ball him after the season.

What Noel does from here on to the end of the season is anybody's guess. He may just poop on the organization so he can shake free.

This has been an interesting case to follow and there are lessons to be learned from it. As I feared, Noel basically burnt this season. He didn't hustle. It's ridiculous that he hasn't played. He's by far their most talented big. Should have been starting and playing major minutes especially in a contract season. But he chose to pout in an attempt to get them to move him to another team where he could shine and then hit the free agent market. He was pissed about not getting what he thought he deserved and instead of ding the Jimmy Butler, just burning up the court, he turned negative and burnt up the team.

Dallas did the only thing they could do to salvage value here. They kept him to retain his Birds rights in hopes of signing him to a deal at a really value number or to possibly execute a sign-and-trade of him this summer.

What Noel should do is shut up, come to work, and work his butt off and whenever he gets an opportunity in a game he should play with maximum effort, play to win, play so well that they have to take him out to keep from winning games they now need to lose.

But there's a 50/50 chance that he does just the opposite.

Even my original 4/50 extension looks high now.........and we know he wouldn't have agreed to it and signed it anyways since we know what he turned down last summer.

Watching this case shows the importance of how a man's character plays into what they should be paid. Noel has all the talent and athleticism you can imagine. That guy even had the ability to be a 40+% volume 3-point shooter......and should already be if he had simply worked on his game diligently himself. He had 4 seasons on his rookie deal to learn how to do that and at least two seasons where the Sixers organization and coaching staff emphasized it to him. He never mastered the shot.......and it's because he didn't work on it diligently. Not because he can't. He's got way more than enough talent to be a great 3-ball shooting big man. (Which would have easily made him a max player when combined with his elite defensive talent.)

Now here we are grinding through his 5th season mind you. Any team would be foolish to hand him even $40 million over 4 years. Foolish. And a championship team.......there's no way you could take that risk on a championship contending team with high payroll and limited assets.

IMO....Here's what is likely to happen. Unless Noel changes and matures and starts realizing his full potential while he feels he is being underpaid then the chances of a team getting valuable minutes for his salary are virtually nil. He'll either keep signing one-year deals for a relatively low salary and performing at a mediocre level good enough to get a somewhat higher long term offer, but the offer not high enough for him to agree sign long term (because in his proud attitude he thinks he's worth more)......or he'll sign a long term deal and either significantly underperform it or barely perform up to it.

For all the temptation it would be to sign him long term at even the MLE.....it's simply not worth the risk. Right now today, Noel is the kind of guy you trade for cheaply in the last year of his deal if you're making a significant run for a championship and you think his skills put you over the top and you trade at non-essential stuff for him to take a flyer. Then if it all works out you bring him back at a doable number that allows you to move him fast if something goes haywire or you use him as a pass thru and sign and trade him or just let him walk.

Until Noel proves over a couple seasons that he's got his act together consistently and he grows his game he's too risky to sign long term at any significant dollar amount that he would agree to.

Will be interesting to see what he does the rest of this year. Would not surprise me one bit if he did something really foolish in an attempt to get the Mavs to release him before March so he could sign with a playoff team. (If that happens....I'd want us to consider signing him to make a run with. He could be great in a limited role for a short period of time down the stretch.) And even then, I don't know if the Mavs would release him or simply send him home. Will be interesting to watch.

PS: By the way when I started this thread I knew Noel had been offered an extension and had refused it. That extension was much higher than what I would have given him. So I knew he was likely going to be traded. And the question was really about what his trade value was. I knew it was low.

marky :) · Feb 9, 2018

FWIW Yule-C

kubli9 · Feb 9, 2018

basketballholic said: ↑

They didn't trade him because they would have acknowledged they lost on him. Now that the deadline is passed they'll probably give him a little run to see what he has and then low ball him after the season.

What Noel does from here on to the end of the season is anybody's guess. He may just poop on the organization so he can shake free.

This has been an interesting case to follow and there are lessons to be learned from it. As I feared, Noel basically burnt this season. He didn't hustle. It's ridiculous that he hasn't played. He's by far their most talented big. Should have been starting and playing major minutes especially in a contract season. But he chose to pout in an attempt to get them to move him to another team where he could shine and then hit the free agent market. He was pissed about not getting what he thought he deserved and instead of ding the Jimmy Butler, just burning up the court, he turned negative and burnt up the team.

Dallas did the only thing they could do to salvage value here. They kept him to retain his Birds rights in hopes of signing him to a deal at a really value number or to possibly execute a sign-and-trade of him this summer.

What Noel should do is shut up, come to work, and work his butt off and whenever he gets an opportunity in a game he should play with maximum effort, play to win, play so well that they have to take him out to keep from winning games they now need to lose.

But there's a 50/50 chance that he does just the opposite.

Even my original 4/50 extension looks high now.........and we know he wouldn't have agreed to it and signed it anyways since we know what he turned down last summer.

Watching this case shows the importance of how a man's character plays into what they should be paid. Noel has all the talent and athleticism you can imagine. That guy even had the ability to be a 40+% volume 3-point shooter......and should already be if he had simply worked on his game diligently himself. He had 4 seasons on his rookie deal to learn how to do that and at least two seasons where the Sixers organization and coaching staff emphasized it to him. He never mastered the shot.......and it's because he didn't work on it diligently. Not because he can't. He's got way more than enough talent to be a great 3-ball shooting big man. (Which would have easily made him a max player when combined with his elite defensive talent.)

Now here we are grinding through his 5th season mind you. Any team would be foolish to hand him even $40 million over 4 years. Foolish. And a championship team.......there's no way you could take that risk on a championship contending team with high payroll and limited assets.

IMO....Here's what is likely to happen. Unless Noel changes and matures and starts realizing his full potential while he feels he is being underpaid then the chances of a team getting valuable minutes for his salary are virtually nil. He'll either keep signing one-year deals for a relatively low salary and performing at a mediocre level good enough to get a somewhat higher long term offer, but the offer not high enough for him to agree sign long term (because in his proud attitude he thinks he's worth more)......or he'll sign a long term deal and either significantly underperform it or barely perform up to it.

For all the temptation it would be to sign him long term at even the MLE.....it's simply not worth the risk. Right now today, Noel is the kind of guy you trade for cheaply in the last year of his deal if you're making a significant run for a championship and you think his skills put you over the top and you trade at non-essential stuff for him to take a flyer. Then if it all works out you bring him back at a doable number that allows you to move him fast if something goes haywire or you use him as a pass thru and sign and trade him or just let him walk.

Until Noel proves over a couple seasons that he's got his act together consistently and he grows his game he's too risky to sign long term at any significant dollar amount that he would agree to.

Will be interesting to see what he does the rest of this year. Would not surprise me one bit if he did something really foolish in an attempt to get the Mavs to release him before March so he could sign with a playoff team. (If that happens....I'd want us to consider signing him to make a run with. He could be great in a limited role for a short period of time down the stretch.) And even then, I don't know if the Mavs would release him or simply send him home. Will be interesting to watch.

PS: By the way when I started this thread I knew Noel had been offered an extension and had refused it. That extension was much higher than what I would have given him. So I knew he was likely going to be traded. And the question was really about what his trade value was. I knew it was low.
Click to expand...

TLDR

But he's better than Capela, right? Eat your crow, admit you were wrong and just SHUT UP.

ElPigto · Feb 9, 2018

Boy that NOF club must be really lonely. Bballholic is his only believer.

basketballholic · Feb 9, 2018

kubli9 said: ↑

TLDR

But he's better than Capela, right? Eat your crow, admit you were wrong and just SHUT UP.
Click to expand...

I'll stick with what I said. He has way more talent and ability than Capela but he has character issues and had not capitalized on his gifts. Capela has. Capela has worked hard and maxed his gifts based on the training and coaching he has received and Capela appears to me to STILL have significantly better character than Noel.

Nothing has changed in my comparison of the two players.

Thanks

mrm32 · Feb 9, 2018

Ricky "Mr. Character Issues" Rubio

No wonder he didn't pan out.

heypartner · Feb 9, 2018

TheRealAllpro said: ↑

First off how did the enlightened Mavs not trade this fool? And I guess it's safe to say he isn't getting 17 mil next year

basketballholic said: ↑

They didn't trade him because they would have acknowledged they lost on him.
Click to expand...

Click to expand...

'holic, why do you always state things as if they are fact.

Here's a fact you didn't consider: Dallas was not allowed to trade Nerlens without his consent.

From Larry Coon...

There are two additional circumstances in which a trade requires the player's consent:

When the player is playing under a one-year contract (excluding any option year) and will have Larry Bird or Early Bird rights at the end of the season. This includes first round draft picks following their fourth (option) season, who accept their team's qualifying offer for their fifth season. When the player consents to such a trade, his Larry Bird/Early Bird rights are not traded with him, and instead becomes a Non-Bird free agent3. The player's consent is also required for any subsequent trades that season.

photojoe · Feb 9, 2018

sealclubber1016 said: ↑

Cuban lucked into having one of the greatest players ever. He has otherwise shown himself to be a pretty awful owner. They don't seem to have any kind of a plan beyond an effort to be mediocre.
Click to expand...

He had a plan.

It was called dismantling a championship team to create cap space to try to attract max free agents and then when they don't come, punt on trying to build a team and sign 1 year deals to maintain cap space in the future. All the while, watching as the remaining productive years of the best player in Dallas decline into mediocrity.

Not going to lie, I've enjoyed watching it

kubli9 · Feb 9, 2018

basketballholic said: ↑

I'll stick with what I said. He has way more talent and ability than Capela but he has character issues and had not capitalized on his gifts. Capela has. Capela has worked hard and maxed his gifts based on the training and coaching he has received and Capela appears to me to STILL have significantly better character than Noel.

Nothing has changed in my comparison of the two players.

Thanks
Click to expand...

It looks like just about everybody else could see what you couldn't. Maybe you should listen and learn from others and stop spouting off like you know more than the rest of us, because you don't.

bulkatron · Feb 9, 2018

He should have taken the 4/70 extension. He won't sniff that money again.

basketballholic · Feb 9, 2018

L

heypartner said: ↑

'holic, why do you always state things as if they are fact.

Here's a fact you didn't consider: Dallas was not allowed to trade Nerlens without his consent.

From Larry Coon...

There are two additional circumstances in which a trade requires the player's consent:

When the player is playing under a one-year contract (excluding any option year) and will have Larry Bird or Early Bird rights at the end of the season. This includes first round draft picks following their fourth (option) season, who accept their team's qualifying offer for their fifth season. When the player consents to such a trade, his Larry Bird/Early Bird rights are not traded with him, and instead becomes a Non-Bird free agent3. The player's consent is also required for any subsequent trades that season.

Click to expand...

LOL.

So you think he wouldn't have consented..........LOL

JayZ750 · Feb 9, 2018

sealclubber1016 said: ↑

Cuban lucked into having one of the greatest players ever. He has otherwise shown himself to be a pretty awful owner. They don't seem to have any kind of a plan beyond an effort to be mediocre.
Click to expand...

Pretty astute at the end of the day. Hadn't really considered that, but it looks spot on at this point.

Other than Dirk, and Nash who they let go early on (last time I actually saw a game live in Dallas Dirk/Nash were together... dang I'm old), their best player has been who?? Josh Howard? Old JKidd? Great role playing defensive big Tyson Chandler?

glimmertwins · Feb 9, 2018

sealclubber1016 said: ↑

Cuban lucked into having one of the greatest players ever. He has otherwise shown himself to be a pretty awful owner. They don't seem to have any kind of a plan beyond an effort to be mediocre.
Click to expand...

I hate the Mavs, but I don't think that's a fair assessment of Cuban - Cuban has definitely had a plan and has mostly allowed himself to have enough cap room to chase every marquee free agent for the last decade. They felt like Dirk was a centerpiece type of player and you can't blame them for thinking that because Dirk won them a title just 6 years ago(seems like an eternity ago - the NBA has changed so much since then). The Mavs' failing though is that they waited too long to move on from the Dirk era. Realistically, he took a step back the very next year and has only declined more since then. They bet that they could maintain a contending roster by bringing in marquee players to play alongside Dirk, and they were wrong - marquee players didn't want to come there. Now they have to switch gears and go all in on a rebuild.

In short, Cuban tried to do what Houston did transitioning from one era to the next without bottoming out but he didn't have the opportunity/luck that Morey did in acquiring a young star in Harden. It's a hard feat to pull off. Had we not acquired Harden, we probably would have been in a very similar place as Dallas is now. You just have to position yourself to be able to take advantage of opportunities when they present themselves - that means keeping cap space, tradeable contracts, stockpiling picks, etc. Dallas has mostly done that - they just have struck out time and time again chasing free agents and had some poor injury luck with their last couple of big FA signings(Parsons, Wes Matthews) but I don't think that's because Cuban didn't put them in a position where they could take advantage of a favorable situation....

Corrosion · Feb 11, 2018

glimmertwins said: ↑

I hate the Mavs, but I don't think that's a fair assessment of Cuban - Cuban has definitely had a plan and has mostly allowed himself to have enough cap room to chase every marquee free agent for the last decade. They felt like Dirk was a centerpiece type of player and you can't blame them for thinking that because Dirk won them a title just 6 years ago(seems like an eternity ago - the NBA has changed so much since then). The Mavs' failing though is that they waited too long to move on from the Dirk era. Realistically, he took a step back the very next year and has only declined more since then. They bet that they could maintain a contending roster by bringing in marquee players to play alongside Dirk, and they were wrong - marquee players didn't want to come there. Now they have to switch gears and go all in on a rebuild.

In short, Cuban tried to do what Houston did transitioning from one era to the next without bottoming out but he didn't have the opportunity/luck that Morey did in acquiring a young star in Harden. It's a hard feat to pull off. Had we not acquired Harden, we probably would have been in a very similar place as Dallas is now. You just have to position yourself to be able to take advantage of opportunities when they present themselves - that means keeping cap space, tradeable contracts, stockpiling picks, etc. Dallas has mostly done that - they just have struck out time and time again chasing free agents and had some poor injury luck with their last couple of big FA signings(Parsons, Wes Matthews) but I don't think that's because Cuban didn't put them in a position where they could take advantage of a favorable situation....
Click to expand...

I hate the Mavs more than most .... but I agree with this post , Cuban's not that bad. He has a Larry Obrien Trophy more recently than all but 4 franchises - San Antonio , Lebron South , Lebron North & GSW.

He's definitely made some mistakes along the way - Messing with Morey (Parsons) being one of them but they just didn't have the luck the Rockets did ....and lets face it , Morey is one of if not the very best GM in professional sports. Not many teams lose a Yao & McGrady and don't go to the bottom of the standings.

YaoMing#1 · Feb 11, 2018

Noel is garbage.

He had like one nice 50 game stretch for philly a few years ago.

And it’s hard to even say how impactful it was because Philly was tanking and clearly the worst team maybe ever.

Dude is a joke.

Never turn done 70m you just don’t do that. Whoever was advising him should Never get another client ever again.

This guy will be lucky to sniff 5m a season.

Talent doesn’t mean anything. I don’t think he has more talent than Capela but I guess some do?!?!? Lol

Hard work and mental makeup is very important in any job. Capela has both. He’s improved every year and is avg 14/11/2 in 25 min a game.

Noel will never put up those numbers.

Exiled · Feb 11, 2018

glimmertwins said: ↑

I hate the Mavs, but I don't think that's a fair assessment of Cuban - Cuban has definitely had a plan and has mostly allowed himself to have enough cap room to chase every marquee free agent for the last decade. They felt like Dirk was a centerpiece type of player and you can't blame them for thinking that because Dirk won them a title just 6 years ago(seems like an eternity ago - the NBA has changed so much since then). The Mavs' failing though is that they waited too long to move on from the Dirk era. Realistically, he took a step back the very next year and has only declined more since then. They bet that they could maintain a contending roster by bringing in marquee players to play alongside Dirk, and they were wrong - marquee players didn't want to come there. Now they have to switch gears and go all in on a rebuild.

In short, Cuban tried to do what Houston did transitioning from one era to the next without bottoming out but he didn't have the opportunity/luck that Morey did in acquiring a young star in Harden. It's a hard feat to pull off. Had we not acquired Harden, we probably would have been in a very similar place as Dallas is now. You just have to position yourself to be able to take advantage of opportunities when they present themselves - that means keeping cap space, tradeable contracts, stockpiling picks, etc. Dallas has mostly done that - they just have struck out time and time again chasing free agents and had some poor injury luck with their last couple of big FA signings(Parsons, Wes Matthews) but I don't think that's because Cuban didn't put them in a position where they could take advantage of a favorable situation....
Click to expand...

I don't think Cuban had a plan , he just followed where's his heart took him.... .. which ended... somewhere broken in Memphis

BHannes2BHonest · Feb 11, 2018

basketballholic said: ↑

They didn't trade him because they would have acknowledged they lost on him. Now that the deadline is passed they'll probably give him a little run to see what he has and then low ball him after the season.

What Noel does from here on to the end of the season is anybody's guess. He may just poop on the organization so he can shake free.

This has been an interesting case to follow and there are lessons to be learned from it. As I feared, Noel basically burnt this season. He didn't hustle. It's ridiculous that he hasn't played. He's by far their most talented big. Should have been starting and playing major minutes especially in a contract season. But he chose to pout in an attempt to get them to move him to another team where he could shine and then hit the free agent market. He was pissed about not getting what he thought he deserved and instead of ding the Jimmy Butler, just burning up the court, he turned negative and burnt up the team.

Dallas did the only thing they could do to salvage value here. They kept him to retain his Birds rights in hopes of signing him to a deal at a really value number or to possibly execute a sign-and-trade of him this summer.

What Noel should do is shut up, come to work, and work his butt off and whenever he gets an opportunity in a game he should play with maximum effort, play to win, play so well that they have to take him out to keep from winning games they now need to lose.

But there's a 50/50 chance that he does just the opposite.

Even my original 4/50 extension looks high now.........and we know he wouldn't have agreed to it and signed it anyways since we know what he turned down last summer.

Watching this case shows the importance of how a man's character plays into what they should be paid. Noel has all the talent and athleticism you can imagine. That guy even had the ability to be a 40+% volume 3-point shooter......and should already be if he had simply worked on his game diligently himself. He had 4 seasons on his rookie deal to learn how to do that and at least two seasons where the Sixers organization and coaching staff emphasized it to him. He never mastered the shot.......and it's because he didn't work on it diligently. Not because he can't. He's got way more than enough talent to be a great 3-ball shooting big man. (Which would have easily made him a max player when combined with his elite defensive talent.)

Now here we are grinding through his 5th season mind you. Any team would be foolish to hand him even $40 million over 4 years. Foolish. And a championship team.......there's no way you could take that risk on a championship contending team with high payroll and limited assets.

IMO....Here's what is likely to happen. Unless Noel changes and matures and starts realizing his full potential while he feels he is being underpaid then the chances of a team getting valuable minutes for his salary are virtually nil. He'll either keep signing one-year deals for a relatively low salary and performing at a mediocre level good enough to get a somewhat higher long term offer, but the offer not high enough for him to agree sign long term (because in his proud attitude he thinks he's worth more)......or he'll sign a long term deal and either significantly underperform it or barely perform up to it.

For all the temptation it would be to sign him long term at even the MLE.....it's simply not worth the risk. Right now today, Noel is the kind of guy you trade for cheaply in the last year of his deal if you're making a significant run for a championship and you think his skills put you over the top and you trade at non-essential stuff for him to take a flyer. Then if it all works out you bring him back at a doable number that allows you to move him fast if something goes haywire or you use him as a pass thru and sign and trade him or just let him walk.

Until Noel proves over a couple seasons that he's got his act together consistently and he grows his game he's too risky to sign long term at any significant dollar amount that he would agree to.

Will be interesting to see what he does the rest of this year. Would not surprise me one bit if he did something really foolish in an attempt to get the Mavs to release him before March so he could sign with a playoff team. (If that happens....I'd want us to consider signing him to make a run with. He could be great in a limited role for a short period of time down the stretch.) And even then, I don't know if the Mavs would release him or simply send him home. Will be interesting to watch.

PS: By the way when I started this thread I knew Noel had been offered an extension and had refused 40%it. That extension was much higher than what I would have given him. So I knew he was likely going to be traded. And the question was really about what his trade value was. I knew it was low.
Click to expand...

i agree other than the 49% 3 point percentage. His form previously didn’t show me consistency potential from 17 feet out. However I wouldn’t mind throwing a minimum deal next year on a backup to Clint “prove yourself” type of deal. He has been a disappointment with all of that potential thus far

Forums

What extension is Nerlens Noel worth?

arabrocket Member

sealclubber1016 Member
Supporting Member

kubli9 Contributing Member
Supporting Member

basketballholic Member

marky :) Member

kubli9 Contributing Member
Supporting Member

ElPigto Member
Supporting Member

basketballholic Member

mrm32 Member

heypartner Contributing Member

photojoe Member

kubli9 Contributing Member
Supporting Member

bulkatron Member

basketballholic Member

JayZ750 Contributing Member

glimmertwins Member

Corrosion Member

YaoMing#1 Member

Exiled Member

BHannes2BHonest 2 SOLID FOR WEIRD AZZES

Share This Page

About ClutchFans

Rockets Content

Support ClutchFans!

What extension is Nerlens Noel worth?

arabrocket Member

sealclubber1016 Member Supporting Member

kubli9 Contributing Member Supporting Member

basketballholic Member

marky :) Member

kubli9 Contributing Member Supporting Member

ElPigto Member Supporting Member

basketballholic Member

mrm32 Member

heypartner Contributing Member

photojoe Member

kubli9 Contributing Member Supporting Member

bulkatron Member

basketballholic Member

JayZ750 Contributing Member

glimmertwins Member

Corrosion Member

YaoMing#1 Member

Exiled Member

BHannes2BHonest 2 SOLID FOR WEIRD AZZES

Share This Page

sealclubber1016 Member
Supporting Member

kubli9 Contributing Member
Supporting Member

kubli9 Contributing Member
Supporting Member

ElPigto Member
Supporting Member

kubli9 Contributing Member
Supporting Member