Got to thinking about something the other day, and decided to put a very informal list together. Two groups of names - can anyone tell what defines these two groups? Group 1) Juan Dixon, Kareem Rush, Tayshaun Prince, John Salmons, Dan Dickau, Roger Mason, Carlos Boozer, David Anderson. Group 2) Juan Carlos Navarro, Flip Murray, Darius Songaila, Matt Barnes, Rasual Butler. Answer: Spoiler Group One is a small list of the players the Rockets passed on to take Boki Nachbar. Group Two is a small list of the players the Rockets passed over to take TITO MADDUX. The thing *both* groups have in common is: Oh yeah, all of those players were taken ahead of LUIS SCOLA. I know this is not terribly profound or anything, I just got to thinking about the Rockets' drafts, and wondered what the situation was the year Scola was drafted. Everybody these days is praising Morey (and rightly so) for the good job in getting Landry, and also giving him props (again, rightly so) for stealing Scola from the Spurs. I wonder if the Spurs would have made that deal if they had known he was going to be this good this quickly? But before Morey was here, and even before JVG was here, this franchase was riding a really bad streak in the draft: We didn't draft Francis, we lucked into Yao. Yeah, we got Mobley (even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while). It was just occurring to me that we got Scola for pretty much the same reason we got Yao: pure luck. Who could have expected that the Spurs would have allowed themselves to be backed into a corner on Scola the same year that a former Rox exec would just happen to switch over to the Spurs, thus magically allowing him to fall into our laps, essentially for free? Looking back through the drafts, San Antonio has been way ahead of the curve, and we're all grateful to be reaping some of the benefits. But you can't count on ping-pong balls and colossal blunders by San Antonio's front office. You need some draft voodoo of your own. Fast-forward to this year. Brooks, well, I suspect that was a done deal before Adelman was even hired, maybe even as a prerequisite to his agreeing to come here, so I don't know exactly how much Morey can be credited for that move. But Landry was all him. And having the savvy to recognize a steal when he saw it in fleecing Scola from the Spurs just adds to that karma. The late 2nd's, well, who knows. Newley? Mahimi? Eliyahu? Maybe in 5 years we are talking about Houston's drafts the same way people have been talking about San Antonio's. I guess the whole point of all this is just to say that, with Morey running the show, and Yao's injury notwithstanding, the future looks bright bright bright.
Okay when I went to answer the spoilers showed up so I saw the answer but I was going to guess that they were players the Rockets didn't draft. By the way only Boozer and Prince are absolutely better than Nachbar. And Prince was are pick if Nachbar hadn't impressed so much. As for Boozer everyone missed the bus on him. Kind of like Carl Landry. Tito sucks.
Tayshaun Prince,Carlos Boozer, Juan Carlos Navarro That's the list of players that MIGHT help the rockets if we had drafted them. Tayshaun would backup T-Mac and Battier, Boozer would start(if he was still on the team after his rookie contract) and Juan would be?? third string... maybe.
yeah, i was just about to say.... besides Boozer and Prince.. nobody on those list have made a definite impact in the league. In fact like the previous poster said, Boki is probably better than everybody else.
This is a stupid thread proving nothing but trivia. What about Carl Landry and Aaron Brooks. Of course we're not going to get it right all the time. What GM does? Who's to say how Tayshaun Prince or Boozer would have developed with the Rockets anyhow. So we didn't pick Matt Barnes blah blah, it's not like the other 20 or so other GMs are also idiots.
A Draft is a guess, we know the 5 first picks will be great players if not, legends but then, everything can happen. A 10th pick overall could be better in the NBA than a 6 pick or a 2nd rounder could be better than a 20th pick Overall. We can't predict how players will be in the big league.
Prince was being compared to Donyell Marshall at the time of the draft and Carlos Boozer to Mo Taylor. Having had one MoT on the team, I don't think they wanted to risk getting another one. Google "nbadraft.net Carlos Boozer" and read what they have listed as his weaknesses. Granted that's what they thought, but who's to say that wasn't the POV of the majority of scouts out there? Hindsight does wonders.
Prince would start over Battier. Prince plays a lot of SF and has been on defensive team just like Battier. Difference is Prince can shoot but can also drive very well.
Sorry, the championship trophies sitting on San Antonio's shelves indicate that it's not just trivia. Some teams DO do a better job of identifying the potential in unexpected places than others. The whole point is that we shouldn't be in the lottery for the next several years, we don't WANT to be in the lottery, and therefore if we want to continue to grow and improve the team, it is vital that our GM find these players, such as Landry, on a regular basis. The point is, so far anyway, it looks like Morey is not just doing a better job, but a MUCH better job.
Oh come on HP. You know as well as I do that I am talking about people like Ginobili, Barbosa, Scola, Oberto, Parker, people like that. There has to be a constant stream of quality assessment too, in this age of luxury tax and salary caps, as evidenced by the fact that Scola and Barbosa are not even playing for the team that found them. And no talk of tanking can be complete without mention of the early-80's Houston Coin-Flippers. The nice thing is, now we have someone who appears to put us on a more equal footing with the Spurs in the 'obscure-but-talented' player evaluation business.
starting Center of CSKA Moscow in 2002 NBA draft he was taken # 37 Atl David Andersen ........ PF-C 7-0 242 6/23/80 Australia http://www.eurobasket.com/team.asp?Cntry=RUS&Team=89
Group 1: Al Harrington, Rashard Lewis, Cuttino Mobley .......small list of players the Spurs passed on to draft Felipe Lopez and trade him for Antonio Daniels Group 2: Michael Redd ..........small list of players that Spurs passed on to draft Chris Carrawell Group 3: Josh Howard, Jason Kapono, Luke Walton, Kyle Korver, James Jones, Mo Williams, Carlos Boozer, Matt Barnes ..........small list of players that Spurs passed on to draft Leandrinho Barbosa.........and then they traded Barbosa for a future first rounder that turned into Ian Haminmi Group 4: Anderson Varejao, Chris Duhon, Trevor Ariza, ......small list of players Spurs passed on to draft Beno Udrih Group 5: David Lee, Monta Ellis, Ronny Turiaf .......small list of players Spurs passed on to draft Ian Haminmi (hehehe) after trading Barbosa for the right draft him Group 6: Carl Landry and Glenn Davis .......small list of players Spurs passed on to draft Tiagro Splitter not to mention trading John Salmons for Speedy Claxton not to mention trading Luis Scola for nuth'n. San Antonio did two things distinctively well to build their dynasty: 1. They tanked, got lucky and won the lottery, and drafted definitively the best player in the NBA over the last 10 years. BLIND LUCK-they happened to tank and win the lottery and not only win it but win it in the right year when Duncan was there. Think about it.........no Duncan and SA is stumbling around in mediocrity for the last 10 years, Popp could still be running the show, Parker and Manu still there, everything else the same, and they have zero, zilch. Keith Van Horn, Billups, Antonio Daniels, Tony Battie, Ron Mercer, Tim Thomas, Adonal Foyle, Tracy McGrady, .....one very, very good player and a bunch of mediocrity following Duncan. Don't tell me San Antonio would have 4 titles if they would have drafted McGrady instead of Duncan, it wouldn't have happened. It would have changed their whole team dynamic, they may have wound up in the lottery another 2 or 3 years, they may have got lucky on one of those lotteries and gotten Elton Brand to go with McGrady or something and put together a title team, who knows? But the odds are that whichever team Duncan would have gone to would have been winning those titles San Antonio won. Can you imagine Philly running Iverson and Duncan out there every night for the last 10 years with supporting cast such as Stackhouse, Theo Ratliff, etc. etc.? You see, even great coaches are replacable, but a dominant talent ain't. No Pops?? How many championships do you think the Spurs win with another top flight coach such as Larry Brown, Phil Jackson, Sloan, Van Gundy, Adelman, etc. etc. etc.? Philly was coached by Larry Brown, one of Pop's mentors. If Philly wins the lotto for Duncan and puts him out there with Iverson and company, the trophies are in Philly and the road to the NBA finals runs through Philly for the next 10 years. And if Larry Brown is coaching Pop's Spurs, the results are the same. 2. The Spurs got lucky and hit on a Euro second rounder in Manu. The Spurs were one of the first teams to scout and draft Euros, hitting on Manu late in the 2nd round. Again, sheer luck, even a squirrel finds an acorn once in a while. The Spurs were the team that figured out they could accumulate some second round picks, draft Euros, stash them in Europe and continue to take the crap shoot on the American players in the draft. They just worked the numbers. That advantage is gone. The European market is too well known today. The Rox have already started doing this as you can see the last few years, stashing away players in Europe until they hit on one that is really good. The Spurs were simply the first team to hit it big with Manu becoming a superstar in the NBA. I'm tired of this junk about the Spurs being so much better than us. Their front office is not better. They're good. You've got to give them their props. But the Rox won their championships too. Dare I say, if the Spurs teams were playing in the Rox/Bulls era, they may not have won a single championship. Perhaps they may have knocked us off once and claimed one of our two championships the two years when Jordan was gone. The Spurs have a good organization, but so do the Rockets. And you will see how good the Spurs are when Duncan retires or goes downhill. They'll struggle to fight off mediocrity just like every other championship team, and they will fall into mediocrity without some more good fortune, just like the Lakers, Rox, and Bulls all did. And how soon they make it back will depend on their good fortune. The Lakers were fortunate (lucky) to get Gasol to bring them back up. The Rox were fortunate to win the lottery and get Yao. The Rox were fortunate to be in a place after drafting Yao to trade for McGrady. When the Rox win their championships, you will be able to trace it back to winning the lottery for Yao, plain and simple. Even if they win it this year, it will go back to getting Yao. No Yao, no Tracy. Tracy don't come here without Yao. Morey is doing a great job. CD mentored him for a year. CD did a great job. We won two championships. Think about it. CD drafted Yao when everybody in and out of the league was saying we should take Jay Williams, when the Rox players were wanting to trade for Lamar Odom. CD got it right. And that's where you define a front office. What do they do to get themselves in a position to build a team around a true superstar that can lead them to championships? We are competing in the most highly competitive conference of the NBA.................ever. There has never been a more competitive conference then the present Western Conference. And we're right there on the cusp. Quit trashing our front office. They are as good as there is in the league.
to add to jopatmc's smoking of Nero's take on random trivia... Not only did every team pass twice on Gino...(he was the 2nd to last player taken in the draft) Every Euroleague team passed on him the same yr. He went from his hometown Argentina team to a 2nd tier Italian team that isn't in the Euroleague divisions. It took him 2-3 yrs to become a starter for a first class Euroleague team... and it took him a yr for Popovich to trust him as a rookie in the NBA. Basicallyl, the dude had "physicality" and worked his ass off on his outside shooting. I mean, Morey is willing to admit that Landry is better than what they drafted. Landry admits it too, saying "I've gained 4 1/2"s on my vertical since fall camp." Popovich admits that Gino is way beyond what they drafted. Rudy admitted Cuttino was too. They all basically admit they were taking fliers out on physical skills with 2nd rounders that just happened to turn out in a big way. But no, Nero takes the data and uses to slam CD and Rox mgmt, just like what is so common with fans across the NBA and ALL SPORTS. It's such a boring argument you make. meaningless.
Whatever man. Obviously our drafting has been just peachy over the last ten years or so, and San Antonio wasn't doing anything any better than anyone else. I just have to stop this bad habit I have of looking at the players we drafted, and counting the trophies sitting down the highway. How silly of me.
