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Westbrook is making Harden

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Loneyroy7, Jan 8, 2020.

  1. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Yes, media voting awards are what's important
     
  2. jordnnnn

    jordnnnn Member

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    Only someone with true hate in there heart for a player could somehow twist perennial MVP contention into somehow not a good thing.

    Oh yeah I forgot MVP level talent is a bad thing. NBA champs usually don’t feature those types of players....
     
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  3. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Playing well in the playoffs is more important
     
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  4. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    The best players in the league outside of Harden do not take the regular season as seriously. They play less minutes. They load manage. They don't play the 4th when their team is up 20.

    They also don't have anywhere the usage rate as Harden.
     
  5. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    He hasnt been playing well.....if you ask me the main reason why we've lost all these games its because his shot has gone cold and hes been taking the step back less making him easier to guard. People call him out all the time in the game thread dude. Cmon....., dont you think defense is a higher priority right now though...objectively?
     
  6. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    He performed well last year.
     
  7. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    Ummm..you should check who the top 5 in usage rate dude.
     
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  8. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Yes defense is the bigger weakness
     
  9. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Ya and they all have historical greet numbers that are better than prime Magic Johnson and Jordan numbers.
     
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  10. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    Who exactly are you referring to?
     
  11. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Guys like Trae, Luka and Gainnis.
     
  12. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    Are you being serious right now
     
  13. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Yes. Especially with Luka, Hardeb and Trae, they have relatively inflated stats compared to former greats like Jordan and Magic.

    Gainnis doesn't rely on the three as much. He's just a force of nature i in the paint that hasn't been seen since the days of Shaq though and for his size has great handles.
     
  14. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    Okay cool...so you would agree that other great teams in the league have superstars that have a high usage rate? People are trending towards that not away from it.
     
  15. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    There is more involved than just one player dominating the ball. And the last recent dynasty didn't rely on that high usage. When Curry won his first ring, his usage rate was below 30%.

    Kawhi last season in the playoffs had a usage rate well well below Harden's recent seasons.

    Also, usage rate is not the entire story when it comes to how a player dominates the ball. Usage rate only tells you how many team possessions ended up with a certain player taking a shot attempt or turning over the ball. It doesn't say how they dominate the ball.

    We had a pgs that dominate the ball before such as Nash and CP3. They dominated the ball and dribbled a lot. But they did it in a different manner than Harden. They constantly moved with the ball probing the defense forcing teammates to move off ball in sync with the ball handler. This forces the defense to actually move their feet and exert more energy on defense.

    Harden's style of slow walk and dribbling on one spot for 15 seconds really allows opposing teams to catch their breath.
     
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  16. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    I mean...he has historically great talent surrounding him lol.

    Again...more talent than we had on our squad AND he posted worse numbers against GS.

    Giannis and Luka dominate the ball plenty,and you know why.....cause its the smart thing to do. Other coaches are just realizing it now. Only difference is, those guys have benches that could do well when their super star doesnt play. They also have knockdown shooters AND they have guys who can play defense.
     
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  17. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Giannis and Luka dominate the ball in different manners. One, Luka is far more willing to score off ball. Also, Luka doesn't stand on one spot of the floor allowing defenses to set and relax nearly as much as Harden does.

    Giannis doesn't dribble the ball nearly as much as Harden and he never should because Giannis doesn't have the handles for full time of duties.

    The difference is that both those high usage rates from Luka and Gainnis doesn't condemn off ball movement. Harden's style of ball dominance does.
     
  18. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    Harden NOR Westbrook are the reason we are losing games.

    The team has little to no depth and you know something? It's been this way since Tilman took over the team.
     
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  19. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    The system we have in place doesn't allow us to find hidden gems or have players have a feel for the ball where they can generate some rhythm.

    Who knows how good Gary Clark could have been if we had any semblance of off ball movement where Clark could be used as a ultra lite versij of Klay Thompson.


    Let's put it this way. With the way our offense is set up right now, a young Klay Thompson would struggle.

    Our second best shooter in Eric Gordon resorts to taking heavily contested threes 3 feet behind the 3 pt line. Our offense just doesn't generate great looks that often.
     
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  20. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    No hes really not as much you think. Hes their PG, he runs the show, ive seen a lot of mavs games this year.

    But he still uses it alot relative to the league no matter how you wanna slice it. Like top 2 after Harden, ...hell one of the main parts of their offense is 5 out and him going to the rim. Again...Super Star getting more possessions with the ball, something you cant deny.

    I mean....not really, there is A LOT of standing around I see with both Giannis and Luka, maybe not as much for Giannis but it is ALOT and certainly alot more compared to the rest of the league. And btw other dudes moving around doesnt automatically mean winning basketball and neither does ball movement. Thats just stereotypical ideas people have in their head.
     

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